# Lottery alternate date wins?



## anchahiker (Sep 22, 2006)

I am curious if anyone has ever gotten permit in one of the lotteries for other than their first choice date? I have never drawn on anything other than the first choice submission and it seems odd after all these years and all the lack of success that it always seems to be first choice or nothing.
Thoughts?


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## desertSherpa (Feb 27, 2013)

Yes.
Last year I pulled a MF permit on an alternate. My main date was pre-total eclipse, so that I could be on the river during the event. I got an alternate, 3 days after. 

-Travis


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

My wife's successful Main Salmon permit, years ago, was a second or third choice.

Pretty sure my Yampa was as well.


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## Kilroy (Oct 23, 2011)

I just drew the main salmon on a 3rd choice pick this year (August). Had to scratch my head on that one, but I'm not complaining...

Sent from my brain using Mountain Buzz "Thought " app


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## basinrafter (May 12, 2009)

I went on a Lodore trip last year that was on the TL's last choice date. So it definitely happens. However....just fyi....the Smith River in Montana runs their lottery differently. There, they select an application and if the first choice is available, that applicant gets it. If the first choice date is NOT available, they move on to the next application. After they've gone thru all the applications, they'll go back and look at 2nd and 3rd choices. 
NOBODY gets their 2nd or 3rd choice up there. Well....unless you pull a ding dong move like us a few years ago and accidentally put mid-April as your 2nd choice.


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## Wadeinthewater (Mar 22, 2009)

Look at the bottom half of this page. Data for the 4 Rivers Lottery in 2017 show that winners for other than their first choice were;
MFS = 33%
Main Salmon = 39%
Selway = 37%
Snake = 33%

So yes it happens.


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## tetondan (Jun 1, 2017)

We pulled a Selway permit this year from our 2nd choice date.


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## anchahiker (Sep 22, 2006)

Thanks for all the replies, just my bad luck to not draw on 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 4th.
Glad to hear that the other dates do work!


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## mowgli (Feb 24, 2010)

Pulled a 3rd choice Grand trip on a follow up last year.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

If your successful for a smith river permit, How do find out online ? Does it list all successful applicants?


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## 3d3vart (Apr 15, 2010)

Yes, pulled a Deso permit for this summer on an alternate choice date.


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## DriftaBit (Feb 4, 2015)

walterwhite said:


> If your successful for a smith river permit, How do find out online ? Does it list all successful applicants?


Starting March 1st, permits will be posted online at MyFWP. They don't notify people who didn't win the draw.

Smith Permits Section


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## bcpnick (Jul 16, 2015)

My friend pulled a 2019 Grand Canyon permit on his 5th choice date.


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## seantana (Mar 5, 2015)

DriftaBit said:


> Starting March 1st, permits will be posted online at MyFWP. They don't notify people who didn't win the draw.
> 
> Smith Permits Section


Or you completely forget, and wonder why you're getting mailers from Smith shuttlers a few days after the drawing is done.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Really hope we get lucky. Applied for late June. Anyone have good luck with picking up cancelations ? Snowpack looks great, especially compared to last year.


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## 802flyfish (Oct 22, 2014)

Had some trouble logging into my FWP account. However, an employee mentioned that the Smith river results wouldn't be posted until tonight, maybe even tomorrow. It's also showing that I did not apply for any drawings for 2018, anyone else seeing the same thing?


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## bcpnick (Jul 16, 2015)

802flyfish said:


> Had some trouble logging into my FWP account. However, an employee mentioned that the Smith river results wouldn't be posted until tonight, maybe even tomorrow. It's also showing that I did not apply for any drawings for 2018, anyone else seeing the same thing?



I'm getting the same thing. I had to create a new account in the new MyFWP so I wasn't sure if it just wasn't connecting to my ALS profile right.


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## TFVandal (Oct 6, 2015)

Yes, same result, showing that I did not apply.


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## 802flyfish (Oct 22, 2014)

I'm glad I'm not the only one. Not sure whats going on. Hopefully it gets resolved soon... They probably getting flooded with calls.


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## bcpnick (Jul 16, 2015)

Apparently we're all doing it wrong. This person on Backcountry Post just posted a screenshot of their account in the Drawings tab and it shows the status: https://backcountrypost.com/threads/2018-river-permits.7430/#post-92769


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## 802flyfish (Oct 22, 2014)

Interesting...


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## bcpnick (Jul 16, 2015)

I emailed them and they responded with this:

"The system is currently down as preparation for the drawing later today, this means that your application status or results will not be visible. Please check back in the evening for the results."


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## seantana (Mar 5, 2015)

It said Pending all morning, just recently switched to "The drawing is in process. Your results will be posted after the drawing." Guess I'll check tomorrow. At least they took the "Smith results are in!" landing page down..


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## 802flyfish (Oct 22, 2014)

Results!

Got my 2nd launch date - April 6th !

It's going to be a cold one!


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## seantana (Mar 5, 2015)

Wife pulled a June 10, WOO!


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## 802flyfish (Oct 22, 2014)

Congrats! I'm hoping my girlfriend got the original launch date we applied for.


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## TFVandal (Oct 6, 2015)

double strikeout .... again.


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## MontanaLaz (Feb 15, 2018)

Looks like Smith results just came in in the last half hour (I've been compulsively checking) and I didn't win.

Now I just have to wait for everyone else in my group to let me know if they got lucky.

Our group of 15 is going to do North Fork Flathead if none of us gets a Smith.

Edit: Looks like some folks got their results posted sooner than others???


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## 802flyfish (Oct 22, 2014)

My girlfriend Just checked hers, she didn't win. We were thinking the same thing. Were most likely doing North Fork June 29/30. I've heard Pole bridge has a pretty sweet 4th July parade if your around during the time frame. We also have been talking to an outfitter about South Fork of the Flathead river, but flows will be fairly high based on current snow pack. Your chances are pretty good, especially if you have 14 other people that applied.


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## MontanaLaz (Feb 15, 2018)

We've got a few kids under 12 in the group and one flaked out and forgot to apply so there are 10 chances left. I'm OK with a N Fork considering the snowpack this year and then we can also de-rig for overnights and lap the middle fork daily before heading home. 

I've heard good things about the 4th in Polebridge, but unfortunately we are already committed for then for visiting the grandparents.

I've read that you can expect to drop a cool $1,000 and have to book a year early for an outfitter to mule in your gear (and out) on the South Fork. Are you hearing differently?


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## 802flyfish (Oct 22, 2014)

I've been talking to him since September. I told him a few weeks ago that I planned on waiting for the results of the Smith before booking anything. There only two of us and will have minimal gear. I think he quoted me 1,500 for the pack in. The pack out is a separate charge. He stated that Late June is pretty early, he only has one other party booked for that time frame. Mid July-Mid August is prime season so I'm sure must of those dates are booked.


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## MontanaLaz (Feb 15, 2018)

802flyfish said:


> I've been talking to him since September. I told him a few weeks ago that I planned on waiting for the results of the Smith before booking anything. There only two of us and will have minimal gear. I think he quoted me 1,500 for the pack in. The pack out is a separate charge. He stated that Late June is pretty early, he only has one other party booked for that time frame. Mid July-Mid August is prime season so I'm sure must of those dates are booked.


Good to know, and thanks. SYOTR

FYI, Upper Stillwater is worth the drive over from Bozeman if you can catch the magic flow between "Too bony for a raft" and "Can still squeeze under the bridges". At that flow it is fast enough for a day trip or you can overnight at cliff swallow.


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## briantcinmt (Mar 13, 2015)

4th choice on an August Middle Fork.
I got a 2nd choice a few years ago on the MF.

Beggars can't be choosers.

And just checked, got skunked for the Smith........again.


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## briantcinmt (Mar 13, 2015)

MontanaLaz and 802, what is the North Fork like?


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## MontanaLaz (Feb 15, 2018)

briantcinmt said:


> MontanaLaz and 802, what is the North Fork like?


Class 1-2, except for a 3 near the bridge. 58 Miles from the CAD border to the take out. Braided, clear water, views of the Livingstone range, good fishing.

You know, Montana 

Forest Circus on River right and Glacier NP on the left. Not considered wilderness, the road runs parallel to the river for most all of it. The road is not exactly smooth...


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Haven’t been on the North Fork, but I’ll proably be crossing off my bucket list this summer.


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