# Gore Race Post-Race Announcements



## Lakota (Jul 17, 2014)

I want to thank everyone for coming out. We have decided to give all the race prize money to American Whitewater in honor of Beth. Since we obviously had some race finish and timing issues this is what we decided to do instead. But...it looks like we will be able to come up with some race times to at least see how you stacked up. One of the photographers was at Kirshbaum and each photo was time stamped. It will be accurate but will be slightly above the normal finish. We will at least know that the participants were still paddling at this point. This is all I can offer and next year we will make sure the finish is defined for racers and our timer. Sorry for any confusion or frustration, but like I said in the pre-race meeting, it's not all about the race but the experience of the weekend and paddling hard together.


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## westernslopeslayer (Jan 11, 2010)

Thanks for stepping up and putting on the race this year Lakota! Glad to hear you got some times to post. I was not looking forward to buying T-Miley a plane ticket to Mexico! Where will the photos be posted?


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## TonyM (Apr 17, 2006)

Thanks Lakota for stepping up and taking on the race, events are not easy to organize and run. As you discovered this weekend. It was a great weekend of paddling regardless of peoples times. My only suggestion, other than getting the timers in the right spot, would be to allow people to paddle in to watch the event. I understand that you do not want to burden the safety crew with rescuing non-racers, but its always fun having folks in there cheering you on. I have also found that often times the spectators provide as much safety as the designated safety crew. 

Cody Beach, i crushed you and you know it.


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## Lakota (Jul 17, 2014)

*Spectators*

Tony, we will be discussing some other options with BLM for next year concerning spectators. We were just trying to deter non-qualified boaters from using our safety. We tried this and it was probably not the best option, but will need to do something, just not sure what yet? 

I appreciate the encouragement on running the race! It was really smooth except for the timing which is obviously a big deal. Tony, no matter how the times come out you crushed Cody.


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## Nathan (Aug 7, 2004)

I have good video of some spectator boaters making the rescue after the safety crew missed 4 attempts to get a racer swimming Gore. I don't know who the safety crew was but they were not qualified in my opinion. 

It's a very nice gesture donating in Beth's name and I applaud you.

I watched Tony come through and there was no way he didn't crush Cody. 

I have no doubt many lessons were learned running the event this year and it will be better next year.


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## Lakota (Jul 17, 2014)

*Spectators Again*

Nathan, thanks for the note. I heard about this from the safety crew at Gore and from my understanding the ones throwing were not our crew. 

Many lessons and feedback is welcomed...we learned and definitely looking forward to next year.

Thanks
JM


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## craven_morhead (Feb 20, 2007)

Yeah, I can't speak to this year's race, but in the past I've seen a number of important rescues made by spectator boaters. Keeping them out of the canyon doesn't make much sense tome.


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## KSC (Oct 22, 2003)

My 2 cents:
- Obviously the race was a total bust this year. I think the fix is fairly self-evident there. 

- I think the spectating is a big part of the race. I didn't even realize that people weren't being allowed in the canyon to spectate. It's going to be impossible to prevent non-racers from having trouble in the canyon, but boaters tend to be self policing and I think that putting a strong message out it is not a good day for first time Gore boaters to be in the canyon and that the race safety is only designed for racers and not for spectators is sufficient to provide a safe day. I also agree that in my experience, spectators are often more likely to provide an effective rescue than the designated safety crew.

- Tony wasn't even in sight for a good Tunnel freestyle session when I came through, so he must have been fast this year. I was pretty sure with Tim's Remix in hand this was my year to crush jmack but now I'll never know. I figured myself and Brian were first and second respectively since we were the only ones who kept paddling to the new finish line.

- I know that sponsoring the Gore race is a somewhat thankless job, so I do appreciate Lakota keeping it going, and while I'm bummed that it was a bust this year, I understand that everybody makes mistakes.


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## latenightjoneser (Feb 6, 2004)

Please, in the future do not get BLM to close the put in road from 9-1. Very lame. Might as well be all day. We saw maybe 3 vans unloading around 11. Plenty of room for us at the same time. Also, safety was a joke. Nobody needs a bag at the top of gore. Maybe have some bags right above and below scissors. Maybe have someone signal upstream paddlers when there are 3 or 4 ropes across toilet bowl.


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## Awoody (Nov 15, 2006)

Spectators save lives. http://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/f11/gore-race-accident-report-33084.html. And make the race way more fun.


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## Dave Frank (Oct 14, 2003)

It was well announced that the put in road would be closed from 9-1. I understand that there would be parking problems if everyone drove a car to the put in. It hadn't even occurred to me that the goal was to close the river to the common man/spectator. I get that you don't want a bunch of first timers getting in the way of the racers, but you need to rethink this idea. I hadn't been in a few years, and remember there being boat trailer shuttles, even for non racers to avoid parking issues in years past. It seems that encouraging carpooling with bigger rigs and a couple rigs with trailers, would mitigate parking issues.

I apologize, for getting in whoever's face when they told me that they wanted to keep the public out of the canyon entirely, but I just found that concept to be way beyond acceptable. I do hope that everyone who wanted to paddle Gore that day actually did, but I'm sure that some were deterred by this.

As much as I like the idea of AW getting all the prize money, some of the Kayakers travel there on a shoe string with legitimate hopes of putting their winnings towards their expenses. Maybe it's premature to assume that viable race times don't exist. If a time can be established via the camera man that is just a little upstream than the appropriate finish, it is not likely to change any but the closest of race placings. I suspect the winners will be fairly obvious from these time stamps...


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## rpludwig (Feb 28, 2011)

I apologize, for getting in whoever's face when they told me that they wanted to keep the public out of the canyon entirely, but I just found that concept to be way beyond acceptable.

Actually care more about Tony vs Cody :grin:


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## jortsKing (Jan 9, 2014)

Just want to raise my hand as a vote to allow spectators/ everyone paddle in. There were 0 ropes at the bottom right side of gore when we came through, the best place to bag folks in my opinion, and then nothing until below pyrite. Isn't that one of the most continuous stretches in the canyon? For professionals who wanted to keep newbs from piggybacking safety, that's a pretty large and dangerous oversight. I am SUPER GRATEFUL for the efforts this year to put the race on, but "closing" the canyon? That's not a move that goes with the spirit of the weekend, especially this year. But hey- live, learn, run it again! That's what we do!


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## deepstroke (Apr 3, 2005)

Donating money to AW which was generated by a race that denied access to boaters is rather ironic. Thanks for keeping the race going, but if spectators are going to be denied access, don't even bother.


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## smauk2 (Jun 24, 2009)

Ya some mistakes were made, but it's their first attempt at organizing the race. Lakota is listening to the feedback and right now that's all we can expect. I had a lot of fun (also didn't race... phew), and hope this race continues in the future. 

Trying to prevent boaters from getting on the river was ridiculous. That's like trying to separate a mama bear from it's cub, but instead of getting mauled to death the organizers just took some verbal abuse and everyone still ended up paddling anyways.


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## tango (Feb 1, 2006)

First off, i think Lakota did a pretty decent job, with one glaring red hot exception. The finish line. The food, beer, registration, shuttle, and race start for competitors were all smooth and well organized.

Saying kayakers can't go into the canyon is futile. We're like cockroaches. We cannot be eliminated. I saw plenty of non racers at the canyon mouth. 

So what's the word on the photo timestamps at Kirschbaum? I'm pretty sure I wasn't first, but Definitely beat Ross, Hobie, TK and any other vail pussies. 


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Trying to keep the boating public out one of the most popular public lands with running water is ridiculous. Either have the race with the logistics dialed or don't have a race. Shame on Lakota and the Blm for coming up with this plan. Hope it's better thought out next time.


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## Id725 (Nov 22, 2003)

Plus one.
PUBLIC lands BELONG to the PUBLIC.
It is absolute garbage to try to close that canyon to all but race participants for a day. That is a precious place, and especially so at this time of year, and NOBODY should be able to close it unless there is some very compelling reason.


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## kabzak (Feb 29, 2012)

Hah, race without finish! 
So was there actually someone measuring times at the unnamed class III rapid few min below Kirschbum?
If so, the person on the cliff was supposed to have a whistle. And I'd like to know the difference between me and Connor since we were both dedicated to win and paddled all the way.
Perhaps next year we can vote where exactly we want the safety to be set.


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## chrispy (Apr 6, 2004)

*I would have been frustrated*

Glad I didn't go. .. i've gathered gear in the eddy's spectating in the past. And thrown some good hole rides in ginger too. No rescue needed.


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## westernslopeslayer (Jan 11, 2010)

As I was chastising that idiotic woman timer for being in the wrong spot she told me that the BLM ranger told her that the rapid that she was at was kirshbaum. So maybe BLM should get there damn beta right too. I almost found a little sympathy for her. Then I thought why the fuck are you 100yds above river level with no finish sign. WTF. To organize a race with that many competitors and that much hype you would think the timing is one of the most important aspects of the event. Not to mention the $35 entry fee. Not to mention the 3 tanks of gas and 6.5 hour drive either way from Durango to get there. and bragging right. Its a little hard not to be pissed about the timing. And yeah as far as safety goes in my experience. Rafters suck especially commercial rafters. class 3 guides thinking there fuckin cool cause they are a raft guide, doesn't mean they have shit for actual river experience. I would way rather have private rafters, kayakers, and spectators to be in there for assistance. Also surprised we didn't lose the boats off the trailers during shuttle. Sorry for the shit ramble. The party on Saturday night was well worth the weekend. And it was great to all you beaters out there!


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## jmack (Jun 3, 2004)

Hey Slayer, beaters are people too you know.

It was pretty disappointing to get to the finish line and have no timer and no idea what was going on. Not really sure how you send a finish timer out there who does not know where K-bomb is. Hopefully the delay in "photo times" means they are carefully reading jersey numbers off the pics.

As for safety, if you are counting on the safety crew to help you, you really shouldn't race. Racers should accept the fact that they are paddling Gore solo. Still, spectators add safety and fun to the race and should be allowed in so long as they don't get in my way.

As others said, it was a great event except for the lack of a finish line.


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## jennifer (Oct 14, 2003)

Hey Slayer, you should not be calling any volunteer idiotic. There was clearly some confusion and mistakes, but I'm sure she was doing what she thought she was supposed to, and not screwing up on purpose. If you are perfect, then I hope you volunteer for every position at the next race. Clone yourself. And hope you don't screw up and get called names...


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## erdvm1 (Oct 17, 2003)

I would like to offer my assistance for next years event organization and planning. If someone from Lakota wants to contact me we can discuss further.
Very generous of you all to put on the race.


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

Perhaps we need a solid Colorado event organizing crew. Veteren boaters that want to further the sport by taking point in recruiting intelligent, experienced whitewater individuals to run the logistics of the events. Seems like pretty much every river fest in the state has been experiencing issues with running whitewater events fluidly lately...and I think thats because tto much of it falls on volunteers, many of whom tend to be unprepared/unaccustomed to perform in these types of situations, or just plain don't care that much, cause they are there to party...


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## BoilermakerU (Mar 13, 2009)

Or maybe, just maybe, those volunteers also have very busy lives and have jobs, families and other obligations - including boating of their own to do. I'd say everyone that's bitching about it should volunteer to run one - and actually do it.

Had the volunteers not stepped up and given their time (and they didn't get any prize money either by the way), there wouldn't have been an event. Then all the butchers would be belly-aching over that too.

Next year, somebody please provide a Whambulance for all these whiners and complainers......


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## glenn (May 13, 2009)

Never heard about the poudre race having these issues.


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## Id725 (Nov 22, 2003)

I personally would love it if there was no Gore race, Boilermaker. Much rather be in there and enjoy the canyon quietly with a few friends.
I understand that not everybody feels this way.
So I say if people want to have an event, that's fine IF:
1. It does not deny access to non-participants
2. It does not negatively impact the environment
3. It is well-run and safe.

If it is going to be loosely organized and poorly run, then it does more harm than good.
That's not to blame volunteers individually; that's to blame the organizers.
It's not enough in this case to give it the ole' college try.
If you're not going to do it well, DON'T DO IT.
We don't need a damn carnival up there to enjoy that canyon.


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## Cutch (Nov 4, 2003)

glenn said:


> Never heard about the poudre race having these issues.


That's just because nobody times the race.  There's a beauty in tossing a rock in the air, and saying go. 

Timing at a race is a often thankless volunteer job that takes way more organization and patience than most kayakers exhibit. 

The best race safety will always be a team race, as a boat in the water is usually more helpful than a throw rope. Agreed that racing Gore is kind of like running it solo. 

Historically, I can recall a few Gore races where spectators weren't allowed into the canyon, and after each event it was concluded that it was a bad idea. Yet, the idea comes back every few years. Thus, seems like this is a BLM issue and not a race organizer issue.


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## erdvm1 (Oct 17, 2003)

Honestly everyone should just relax and stop pointing fingers. The Gore race needs volunteers with skills motivation and time. This event could be great everyone pitches in instead of feeling entitled for it all to be done without their participation

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## tango (Feb 1, 2006)

BoilermakerU said:


> Or maybe, just maybe, those volunteers also have very busy lives and have jobs, families and other obligations - including boating of their own to do. I'd say everyone that's bitching about it should volunteer to run one - and actually do it.
> 
> Had the volunteers not stepped up and given their time (and they didn't get any prize money either by the way), there wouldn't have been an event. Then all the butchers would be belly-aching over that too.
> 
> Next year, somebody please provide a Whambulance for all these whiners and complainers......



Get real. If someone pays $35 to participate in any type of event, whitewater or not, he or she reasonably expects to have the promised services delivered. I have raced several times, and participated in safety in years past. If I said, "Hey everybody I will shuttle cars on this or that river for $5," and then never followed through, people who already paid for the service would be pissed.

Again, Lakota did a great job organizing everything except the finish line. If people want to paddle gore for fun on race day, get up a little earlier, put down the fucking dope, and make it happen.


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## KSC (Oct 22, 2003)

I learned after watching my first Gore race not to trust the safety. That's true in general. If someone is setting safety for you and you have no idea who they are, you shouldn't assume that they're going to do a good job. 

When I race Gore I consider it a solo run, as it's easy to encounter "group think" or people who aren't prepared to do a rescue. Unfortunately it's happened numerous times on race day. 

I like Peter's idea of letting racers provide input into where they want safety. That's how it's done when someone decides to run a drop.

The Gore race is a great tradition though and worthy of continuing on into perpetuity, or at least another year.


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## Mads970 (Aug 27, 2013)

Hey I understand that people or upset and frustrated rightfully so. I would like to personally apologize since I had something to do with the timing. Let me explain how that whole day played out…first off I called Lakota at the beginning of the season and asked if I would be able to ride in with the train station since I tore my acl meniscus in April and I have ran safety in the past for Lisa and Timberline. Things changed as all you boaters should know and I was asked to do timing at the start… then the finish so on so forth…I went with the flow. (The only thing that stays the same is change) I told everyone I had hiked in there twice and I had never seen the finish line…so I went with blm. I’m not going to point any fingers because it is what it is and maybe we shouldn’t have listened and just kept hiking in but I will defend myself and the other VOLUNTEER. I asked several people and multiple times if we were in the right area, we also put up a finish sing with rocks but if you didn’t notice there was a slight breeze that day and those were the materials we had to work with. We had a time for every person that came through the rapid…I know it was the wrong spot and like I said IM SORRY!! (but why not just keep paddling when you didn’t see anyone timing and people told you that!! We were less than a mile away) Next year I think maybe someone who know where they should be can do that…not me since I’m just an idiotic women timer!! Thanks Westernslopeslayer. Sorry again for anyone that “wasted” money driving up and thought they were going to win some money… glad it went to a good cause. 
It will be better next year…


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

lmyers said:


> Perhaps we need a solid Colorado event organizing crew. Veteren boaters that want to further the sport by taking point in recruiting intelligent, experienced whitewater individuals to run the logistics of the events. Seems like pretty much every river fest in the state has been experiencing issues with running whitewater events fluidly lately...and I think thats because tto much of it falls on volunteers, many of whom tend to be unprepared/unaccustomed to perform in these types of situations, or just plain don't care that much, cause they are there to party...


This is a good theory and it's already in place for most events. For everyone on the buzz with an idea, only a fraction will offer to volunteer, and only a fraction of volunteers will actually show, and only the smallest fraction can be counted on to assist in planning and organizing. The folks with the skills, motivation, time and commitment are already organizing events in bv, steamboat, Lyons, vail, dgo, golden, gunnison, bailey etc. 

Major issue IMO is that boating events fall during boating season and even my best paddling buds get iffy on committing to help or plan when the would rather paddle than work. 

It's really up to the single organizer of committee to figure out how to get it done. Sometimes minimal is the answer. Black rock race planning consists of some emails, a buzz post, and in 20 mins at the takeout a handful of paddlers figure out timers etc. done. Poudre race is elegant in its simplicity which means minimal work, max fun, and max participation. 

Gore is tough, primarily because of the put in parking shortage. Everything else should be fairly easy. Raft co is a good fit for running it because if the ability to mobilize shuttles as in the past. I think timberline did a pretty good job in the last times they did it, but frankly there is not a whole lot in it for organizers other than the love of the sport and many high fives and thanks.


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## BoilermakerU (Mar 13, 2009)

tango said:


> Get real. If someone pays $35 to participate in any type of event, whitewater or not, he or she reasonably expects to have the promised services delivered. I have raced several times, and participated in safety in years past. If I said, "Hey everybody I will shuttle cars on this or that river for $5," and then never followed through, people who already paid for the service would be pissed...


You missed the point ENTIRELY.

The volunteers did not get paid, unlike a shuttle service where the people moving your vehicle are in fact getting paid.

Services were delivered, there was a race. You didn't like the outcome, but there was a race.

Looks like you are volunteering your time next year to organize it, run it, etc?

Didn't think so...


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## TonyM (Apr 17, 2006)

Um, can we just get some times posted? I would prefer the times from MADS970 since I actually only stopped briefly at the traditional finish line, saw no one and paddled down to Pumphouse. I'm confident I won the whole race. As I told you all the night before the race, I was the best paddler on the water all weekend. There is no way I could have lost. I timed myself and came in at 16:47. Yea, I know it's record breaking, but as I said, you guys all suck balls. Come back next year if you think you have what it takes to beat the best. 

Front Rangers don't even bother showing up, you don't have a chance. I-70 "Mountain" guys (Vail, GWS), you may as well stay home too, GBTI70 Hobie. Fort Collins crews didn't even bother to come out this year 'cause they knew better. Boulder paddlers usually have hot ladies with them so it's cool if you bring them out to camp, just be ready to lose 'em to some real OG west slope kayakers. MacArthur, you better show up so I can beat your old ass again, same goes for you Kennedy. Tango, eat some more big mac's you pawn to the corporate water authority. Cody Beach, you're a beater and everybody knows it, go buy a belly yak. See you there in 2015.


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## Dwave (Mar 23, 2009)

TonyM said:


> Um, can we just get some times posted? I would prefer the times from MADS970 since I actually only stopped briefly at the traditional finish line, saw no one and paddled down to Pumphouse. I'm confident I won the whole race. As I told you all the night before the race, I was the best paddler on the water all weekend. There is no way I could have lost. I timed myself and came in at 16:47. Yea, I know it's record breaking, but as I said, you guys all suck balls. Come back next year if you think you have what it takes to beat the best.
> 
> Front Rangers don't even bother showing up, you don't have a chance. I-70 "Mountain" guys (Vail, GWS), you may as well stay home too, GBTI70 Hobie. Fort Collins crews didn't even bother to come out this year 'cause they knew better. Boulder paddlers usually have hot ladies with them so it's cool if you bring them out to camp, just be ready to lose 'em to some real OG west slope kayakers. MacArthur, you better show up so I can beat your old ass again, same goes for you Kennedy. Tango, eat some more big mac's you pawn to the corporate water authority. Cody Beach, you're a beater and everybody knows it, go buy a belly yak. See you there in 2015.


Brilliant !!!!


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## mhelm (Jun 28, 2008)

Yeah, we had a shuttle driver that was taking the truck to Radium. We did not appreciate the mile walk added to the 4 mile paddle in, and you are welcome for pulling the swimmer out above Pyrite and getting him to the tracks. There were three of us, along with the lone safety boater. Safety needs to be better, period!!!


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## onefatdog (Oct 25, 2003)

If you are going to charge, more than ever I think, to run a race and you cannot fullfill the most basic aspect of the race then you have failed and let people down.
When you close public access to a public river, you added insult to injury and pissed a lot of people off.
Spectators belong there and parking is ample. I can remember cars parked along side the road going way back without issues.
I've been spectating, racing and volunteering Gore races for 20 years (seen organizers come and go) and have never heard of such a debacle.
Lakota, get it together or leave it alone. We'll be just fine without you. Boaters will come, camp, shuttle, park, race, party and pay the BLM what's required and NOBODY will be denied access. As it should be.


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## Lakota (Jul 17, 2014)

*Funny*

Man, Mountain Buzz is funny! You all have gripes. They are all valid... 
We will still run the race next year. 
We will fix the timing. 
I'm sorry, but our safety was on it!! If you have a problem, volunteer next year to give your input and sit on this side.
The safety team is more skilled than most others there and deal with swimmers all summer long, that is the nature of the job. The teams at each rapid were full of class V guides that run that section and know it well. 

Lakota lost exactly $2,125 to run the race, it's a service to the whitewater community. $35/paddler for 58 participants. it costs a lot more than that to put on the race...There are no sponsors and limited volunteers. We knew there would be growing pains, obviously did not expect a race timing issue. I expected complaints about access and will continue to look other ways to keep unskilled boaters out of the canyon on that day. 

There is something called "liability" that comes along with putting on a race. We are willing to take on that risk and take on the criticism. Again all feedback is welcome…feedback though, not bitching. Please call and talk to me if you have any true constructive criticism…constructive. 

I really enjoyed being with you guys and it was good to see some old and new faces. I just received the photos today from Kirschbaum and will hopefully get the times to you soon!

Now everyone needs to freakin' hug it out.


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## mhelm (Jun 28, 2008)

I'm going to go ahead and disagree about safety first because I sat with Buddy for more than half an hour above Pyrite after carrying his boat up to the tracks before anyone from your team came to check him out. The three of us that pulled him out probably have more than 300 days in Gore combined and have been guides, instructors, & first responders. I watched 4 people throw bags before we stepped in to help. If those weren't your guys... I wanna know what your guys did! Also, it made no sense whatsoever to deny access to people like us that had shuttle drivers. Who do you think you are? Next time you can walk in!


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## deepstroke (Apr 3, 2005)

Constructive criticism: Other than discouraging people with words, just give up on the idea of keeping unskilled boaters out of the canyon. It will create nothing but problems. It's public land and not your job to determine who is qualified to access.


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## erdvm1 (Oct 17, 2003)

I may be able to help with sponsors, music and ultimately money which equates to more staff and better safety.
Not a guarantee yet but if the lead coordinator wants to contact me about next year's event we can discuss further.

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## jimr (Sep 8, 2007)

Constructive criticism-
1. If the the best boaters in the state say your safety sucked then it did! You wanted everyone to get in laps before Sunday for practice where was your safety and time volunteers sat? Prolly helping the class 1 sup race. Instead on sat it was guided trips and privates pulling each other out like bosses!!!! 
2. It's a race and you had volunteers doing the stop watches? Fail
3.most gnar "race" in Colorado and public wasn't allowed? never been to a "race" like that
4.private/public=bomb safety crews that have bomb proof experience when shit goes down... Public/private boaters are the ones with mad back country safety experience not sure why that's a bad thing? 
5. "You lost money and that is the cost of doing biz?" Weird pretty sure I could go out and raise 50k from all the top product producing companies In the industry for next years race no problem!! Not sure how you are still in biz with that mindset and you obviously have never ran an event before. Said donations could be used to actually pay some people like emt, safety and gasp wait for it the people running the times! With the rest of the money donated going to winners and a organization voted on by the participants such as AW in the companies names. You could even make a dope trophy which travels like the Stanley cup with the winner for a year and a company could donate to have their name on it every year. Endless possibilities to get money for this event, unless their is some federal/state rule saying u can't get sponsors or donations? Event planning 101 for races is you can never have enough sponsors, donated money, safety, time, and volunteers. 

Everyone is stoked it went on and y'all probably didn't have/put a lot of time into it this year, but now is the time to start planning for next year. Peace, pot and avocados.



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## paulk (Apr 24, 2006)

I blame Ian (sorry, I mean Denver Water) If it weren't for his blatant disregard for our need to run bailey and drink our faces off prior to gore, everyone would be a lot less grouchy about this. 

Oh look, the poudre is still at 2.4?


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## miker (Jan 26, 2006)

*Jeez*

Classic Buzzard talk.

Ya'll sound like a bunch of gapers, and I know you are not. Come on…the race was not a race. They F'ed up and took responsibility. It was great to get together, party and run Gore. There is room for a ton of improvement. Folks that paid 35 bucks do have a right to complain. If people think they can do better and raise a bunch of money then get involved next year. I admit I had to bail on safety because I could not wait around in the canyon all afternoon waiting for Tango and Cripps to get down the canyon. We had a swimmer running Gore left-left and still got down before the safety caught us. Most racers can self rescue, they might loose their boat, but they can swim to shore. Having extra safety is a luxury. In years past the crowds added to the safety factor. It also added to the entertainment factor. If you are not racing then you go in there with a crew and leave as a crew. 

I don't know why anyone would want to organize a race for a bunch that does not give any appreciation. 

OK… you can attack me:twisted:!!!

Show the photos.


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## erdvm1 (Oct 17, 2003)

Jimr, if you can raise 50k cash no problem I would really like to speak to and potentially hire you for the Lyons Outdoor Games. I am not joking.
Call me.


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## craven_morhead (Feb 20, 2007)

_Having extra safety is a luxury._

This is a bit of a derail, but in my view extra safety isn't a luxury on the gore race. I suspect there are a fair number of boaters who would not want to run Gore solo but who still enter the race, because setting safety is part of the deal.


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## miker (Jan 26, 2006)

craven_morhead said:


> _Having extra safety is a luxury._
> 
> This is a bit of a derail, but in my view extra safety isn't a luxury on the gore race. I suspect there are a fair number of boaters who would not want to run Gore solo but who still enter the race, because setting safety is part of the deal.


True


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## KSC (Oct 22, 2003)

Does the insurance company have a policy about non racers in the canyon? I'm kind of surprised that the racer coordinator would be liable for everything that happens in the canyon. If there's a cycling race and a spectator jumps over the barrier and in front an oncoming racer and gets injured, surely the race sponsor is not liable for that unless there was something about the setup of their venue that was negligent.


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## Phil U. (Feb 7, 2009)

erdvm1 said:


> Jimr, if you can raise 50k cash no problem I would really like to speak to and potentially hire you for the Lyons Outdoor Games. I am not joking.
> Call me.
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900V using Mountain Buzz mobile app


There isn't a whitewater event in the country that raises 50K from sponsors.


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## eaproductions (May 8, 2009)

jimr said:


> Constructive criticism-
> 5. "You lost money and that is the cost of doing biz?" Weird pretty sure I could go out and raise 50k from all the top product producing companies In the industry for next years race no problem!! Not sure how you are still in biz with that mindset and you obviously have never ran an event before. Said donations could be used to actually pay some people like emt, safety and gasp wait for it the people running the times! With the rest of the money donated going to winners and a organization voted on by the participants such as AW in the companies names. You could even make a dope trophy which travels like the Stanley cup with the winner for a year and a company could donate to have their name on it every year. Endless possibilities to get money for this event, unless their is some federal/state rule saying u can't get sponsors or donations? Event planning 101 for races is you can never have enough sponsors, donated money, safety, time, and volunteers.
> 
> I have to say Jimr is delusional and must have been stuffed in Ginger for a few too many rotations. Getting sponsor $ from industry sponsors is as easy as trying to wrestle a grizzly bear with an impacted canine tooth to the ground, tying it up with a throw rope and then shoving a sponsorship proposal up its ass! That said this vid is from back in the day when the Gore Festival grew too big for its britches. Nothing personal Jim but running the event has always been a thankless labor of love and my guess is you could not get a penny, put that on the top of your list for event planning 101!
> ...


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## smauk2 (Jun 24, 2009)

The hate going on here is absurd. They lost money organizing the race and that's a reason to give them flak? Too much time in front of the computer and not enough time on the river, less anger more kayaking.


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## Andy H. (Oct 13, 2003)

eaproductions said:


> Getting sponsor $ from industry sponsors is as easy as trying to wrestle a grizzly bear with an impacted canine tooth to the ground, tying it up with a throw rope and then shoving a sponsorship proposal up its ass!


I think that about sums it up. Even though the organizers have been for-profit businesses, MB offers free advertising to the event because it really is a non-profit thing. No one's making big bucks off the gig. I think someone said "labor of love" and that's what it is. Thanks to Lakota for putting on the race.

-AH


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## GratefulOne (Jun 12, 2010)

enough of this non-sense, who won the SUP race?


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## miker (Jan 26, 2006)

GratefulOne said:


> enough of this non-sense, who won the SUP race?


The timers were at State Bridge…a lot of DNFs.


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## Blade&Shaft (May 23, 2009)

Yeah, too much bitchin and not enough kayaking, it's raining nice-like and flows are up a bit, plenty of boating to get after! 

And thanks to Lakota for putting on the race. I'm sure it will only get better next year and hopefully a lot of us can pitch in and help out. A lot of good ideas going on here, and I'd say it probably is about time to go ahead and get started on planning for next year!


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