# Wildfire Deaths



## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Sadly as the season goes along we continue to see more fires and more deaths. Wildfires are popping up along many of our western rivers jeopardizing lives, historic properties and thousands of acres of land. Be safe out there in what is shaping into one of the worst wildfire seasons in our lives. To put it into perspective there are currently 29,000 personnel fighting a total of 96 uncontained, large fires across the West. Sad to here that three more individuals were confirmed just today:

Three Firefighters in Washington

Lake Tahoe Fire Kills One & Another Hospitalized

California Fire Fatality

Phillip


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Here is a broad map of the fires and smoke patterns affecting our region:


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

It was pretty hazy as far east as the Upper Arkansas yesterday....


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## Blade&Shaft (May 23, 2009)

Hazy as a mofo last few days in the RFV, was wondering if it was coming all the way from Cali....


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## soggy_tortillas (Jul 22, 2014)

Pretty hazy up here too... I actually had a brief moment this morning in which I thought it was fog...

I know there's been several small fires in Moffat County, I think on Monday or Tuesday they said there were 20 started by the lightning storm the night before, 17 of them were contained... Meeker area there's one in the 100 acre range.


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## BigSky (Apr 2, 2015)

Very sad stuff. Those guys and girls are braver than I could ever hope to be.

Smoke's gotten pretty awful up here. Mission Valley before and after.


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

The Twisp Fire that killed three people this week is part of a larger complex that quadrupled in size in less than 24 hours. That is a massive leap and it has become obvious these newer fires popping up are sadly understaffed, and not from a lack of agency requests. According to a recent Senate hearing there has been just less than a 20% reduction in the number of wild land fire personnel in the last 4 years. The US is now calling in reserves and even international help because of the sheer numbers of fires burning across the west.

Lets hope the predicted El Nino brings in rain and not anymore dry lightening storms that seem to be doing the bulk of the damage/starts rights now. We definitely don't need anymore wind at this time. Sadly, the predictions are for at least another month of above average fire conditions for the areas most affected this season:










Phillip


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Currently about 1.4 million acres are actively burning. So far this year 7.2 million acres have burned; this is almost double the ten year annual average record up to this yearly date The fact that this many acres have burned so early is frightening for the rest of the season. 

Hoping for the best for all of the people in Cali and the PNW.

Phillip


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## Learch (Jul 12, 2010)

Oddly enough in Oregon we have had 2 major fires that were human caused. Don't take that wrong, many more have been lightning caused, I watch the wildfire season very closely. The Stouts fire was caused by a lawn mower illegally mowing. The County line 2 fire was small utility trailer that lost a wheel and was dragged several miles before it stopped. It started seven spot fires that joined together and is now a 60,000 acre fire. (Very similar to a fire on the Payette 20 or so years ago) Close to my house in the coast range a fire started from what must be a human cause near Willamina. It is not very large. Even our local volunteer departments are out working these large fires across Oregon. The Willamina fire took more of our limited resources and our chief was having a hard time getting move-up support. We had a group of our volunteers working one of our worst fires just south of John Day. Scary shit to say the least.


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## Mattchu (May 29, 2015)

Fighting fires is about like the war on drugs...a waste of time, money, and resources.


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## cataraftgirl (Jun 5, 2009)

restrac2000 said:


> Here is a broad map of the fires and smoke patterns affecting our region:


The map explains why it's so bad here in Salt lake City. I live at the mouth of Little Cottonwood Canyon. Usually I can see the tram at Snowbird from my back deck. I can barely even see the Wasatch Mountains at all. Can't see across the valley at all. 

So sad to hear of the firefighter deaths. They are brave folks to do the work they do to protect people's homes, towns, and our wild places.


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## duct tape (Aug 25, 2009)

cataraftgirl said:


> So sad to hear of the firefighter deaths. They are brave folks to do the work they do to protect people's homes, towns, and our wild places.


Agree fully. It takes great courage and skill to do what they do on a regular basis. Living here in Colo Springs, where we saw two large fires in consecutive years consume many homes, it sometimes seems we only fully appreciate their service during our time of need.


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## PhilipJFry (Apr 1, 2013)

Mattchu said:


> Fighting fires is about like the war on drugs...a waste of time, money, and resources.


we'll remember that when the flames are approaching your house..


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## Flying_Spaghetti_Monster (Jun 3, 2010)

PhilipJFry said:


> we'll remember that when the flames are approaching your house..


Yeah no shit. There is a balance of letting it burn, but not to much. That has to be hard to judge. They do put fires out so I don't think it is a waste.


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Winds are shifting


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Things are bad enough in WA they are now soliciting volunteers to help. It was initially a broader net but now they have qualified the request with either previous certification ("red card") or at a minimum approval from a local firehouse. This is the first time WA has done this.

Volunteers

Be safe out there. Glad they qualified the request as a fire line can be a dangerous place as anyone with a red card knows. We are now up to close to 33,000 personnel on the ground fighting wildfires.

Phillip


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## Beeks (Aug 22, 2011)

Mattchu said:


> Fighting fires is about like the war on drugs...a waste of time, money, and resources.


Could you be more ignorant? Look at what's going on in the NW right now, we're not talking about wilderness, we're talking about homes, people, and entire towns.....


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## Mattchu (May 29, 2015)

If you want to live in the woods you should be able to protect your own property. Think defensible space. 

I just shake my head when I see all these Californians building million dollar cabins in cheatgrass and or standing dead lodgepole pine areas. Geez. I guess it's on because uncle Sam will spend a billion or so bucks a year to protect your property.


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Mattchu said:


> If you want to live in the woods you should be able to protect your own property. Think defensible space.
> 
> I just shake my head when I see all these Californians building million dollar cabins in cheatgrass and or standing dead lodgepole pine areas. Geez. I guess it's on because uncle Sam will spend a billion or so bucks a year to protect your property.


There is a better way to have that conversation than such blanket statement. For example, in Utah, most agencies will not send crews into private property unless there is defensible space and appropriate egress; its not a justification to exclude protection but a bare minimum. Its an important conversation but takes nuance. I think many people question the relationship between private property and government fire suppression in some fashion but can also have some compassion for people caught in the current state affairs.

And to be fair, not all wild land fire fighting is justified by structure protection. A lot of times they have to build line and manage fires because of fuel densities (often related to poor understanding of fire ecology in the past) even in areas that benefit from burning. The fire near my place in Utah is an example as are the ones burning in forest lands in Idaho. They can be less expensive up front but can be as expensive to monitor in the long run (the Twitchell Fire in 2010 new me cost close to $10 mil during its 2 month burn and only destroyed 2 structures). 

Phillip


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Winds are shifting again; amazing how much of the county's air quality is affected by this wildfire season:










Phillip


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

There should be some revealing and interesting facts and professional opinions expressed this coming Thursday at a Senate hearing for anybody interested. Considering how regularly wildfire effects large portions of the western united states population this type of hearing has lasting influence on everything from procedure to budget.

Hearing: testimony available afterwards via link within announcement

Phillip


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## pearen (Apr 28, 2007)

Really good book by a buddy and fellow boater came out this spring that explores the Yarnell Hill Hotshot fatalities a couple years back and fire suppression in the West. Its worth a read:











On the Burning Edge: A Fateful Fire and the Men Who Fought It: Kyle Dickman: 9780553392128: Amazon.com: Books


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## carvedog (May 11, 2005)

Mattchu said:


> If you want to live in the woods you should be able to protect your own property. Think defensible space.
> 
> I just shake my head when I see all these Californians building million dollar cabins in cheatgrass and or standing dead lodgepole pine areas. Geez. I guess it's on because uncle Sam will spend a billion or so bucks a year to protect your property.


I guarantee you all the homes in Washington that have burned weren't millionaire California clueless transplants. The DC10s in Lake Chelan were bombing neighborhoods not forests. 

Not sure which biased news story you were watching, but the firefighters are making a difference, saving lives and helping people. 

They saved our community here twice in the last 10 years. I sincerely hope that you don't have to see your stuff burn one day. My good friend from Lake Chelan knows several, longtime locals including the widow of his shop teacher, who have had to watch their homes burn. But many were saved too, by extraordinary effort. 

Don't let your cynicism and political views diminish the efforts of some truly brave folks who are working hard for us.


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## tteton (May 16, 2014)

carvedog said:


> I guarantee you all the homes in Washington that have burned weren't millionaire California clueless transplants. The DC10s in Lake Chelan were bombing neighborhoods not forests.
> 
> Not sure which biased news story you were watching, but the firefighters are making a difference, saving lives and helping people.
> 
> ...



+1 carvedog


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Support. Plus, power, water and historic infrastructure protection. Even with the best concepts of defensible space fires jump lines, winds lead to spot fires including on structures, and entire communities can be jeopardized. I don't know of any person educated on the ecology and human dynamics who believes in a "let it all burn" approach. Could we benefit by reevaluating how government actions interplay with risky propert development? Yep, but not right in the midst of one our eras worst fire seasons that is challenging most of our resources. Until things calm down a little compassion and thoughtfulness goes a long way. 

Phillip


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## Mattchu (May 29, 2015)

I see your point. It's sad seeing all of that timber burned up. So many resources burned up instead of logged.

I'm here for rafting not to talk politics or environmental issues. I should not have posted.

Have a good one all.


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