# REI changes their Return Policy



## Pizzle (Jun 26, 2007)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NGVjR4o2RU


Personally I think REI can suck it.


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## Stiff N' Wett (Feb 18, 2010)

That was the only reason I bought stuff there. They're losing my business.


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## BilloutWest (Jan 25, 2013)

They still have my business.

If you have gone to their yard sales over the last few years you can see why they did this.

It wasn't one guy doing a 'rental' on a dry suit.
There were thousands of people doing 'rentals'.


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## bolsito (Aug 26, 2007)

I don't understand all of the hate against REI. I needed some dry bags recently for a last minute overnighter, was very happy that I could get them that day. Convenience is nice.

It's unfortunate that people take advantage of their return policy to the extent that they do. As the dude might say, "You aren't wrong, you're just an asshole."


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## cataraftgirl (Jun 5, 2009)

One year is still a generous return policy. I've got no problem with that.


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## Altahills (Feb 5, 2013)

You know REI stands for " Return Every Item". They have always treated me right and I will continue to give them my business.


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## lemsip (Sep 11, 2009)

The one year return policy does not cover normal wear and tear. "REI’s guarantee doesn’t cover ordinary wear and tear or damage caused by improper use or accidents.


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## Avatard (Apr 29, 2011)

Never returned a goddamn thing to REI, except a rental. I do understand however how some jack holes might abuse this ....


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## gannon_w (Jun 27, 2006)

So people are nice to you (REI) and it is best to take advantage of them? What if they intentionally sold that guy a broken snowboard and refused to give his money back....wouldn't that be just like he did to them?


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## GPP33 (May 22, 2004)

When I got some new hiking boots a couple of years ago I asked if they could also repair my old ones (expecting to have to pay) the dude behind the counter said "if you bought them here just return them", to which I replied, " but I've use them for about 10 years" to which he replied "we'll still give you a full refund". 

I just couldn't do it. They make nice work boots now. 

One year is still plenty to weed out any manufacturing defects. Beyond that it's just that you used the product and either grew out of it, abused it or used it until it's intended end of life. Stop being selfish entitled little cock suckers.


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## rivh2o (Jan 17, 2013)

*R.E.I.*

R.eturn E.quipment I.mmediatey 1 yr ain't so bad


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## RiverCowboy (Mar 14, 2011)

To the crowd that put together the video: I hope you all drown...in a bathtub full of your own miscreance. 

No questions asked warranties exist on the premise that a few individuals will abuse it, but by and large American consumers are good people, who do right by companies that are so willing to back their product. Go ahead and ruin that for the rest of us, and don't be suprised when there's no throwbag sent when you want one.


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## lemsip (Sep 11, 2009)

Or they exist to put small stores out of business.


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## mjpowhound (May 5, 2006)

I don't understand how you can be pissed at the people "ruining it for everybody else". That seems to imply that 1) You think people that return things beyond a reasonable point in time or state of wear are in the wrong, but also 2) You want to be able to do the same thing. I confuse.

I think 1 year is more than reasonable.


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## Avatard (Apr 29, 2011)

mjpowhound said:


> I don't understand how you can be pissed at the people "ruining it for everybody else". That seems to imply that 1) You think people that return things beyond a reasonable point in time or state of wear are in the wrong, but also 2) You want to be able to do the same thing. I confuse.
> 
> I think 1 year is more than reasonable.


It's a coop. The prices are higher because of the policy, which some abused. Maybe they will become more cost competitive

A. Member


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## Don (Oct 16, 2003)

*REI*

Here is a link to what I was talking about earlier: Return Policy

Listen folks know me. Paddling has been my life for a bit now. Because of that I used to get some deals every now and then and it felt good to feel like I was saving money on the things I love and often needed in a hurry. REI gives me the chance to save 10% on everything else with their membership program. And, if you plan ahead they also have regular sales and you can stock-up on what you need. REI is still a good company and serves the greater good. 

REI is good to me, because they have things I need when I need them, like listed above you can use products and find out if there defective. (Really if it doesn't happen on the first few trips... IT'S YOU) Real problems are covered in the policy above. Orginal company deals will be ownered and if is a problem with construction it will be covered.

REI's shift is just a reflection of the times. It became the norm to return things when they wore out. And, that was never the original purpose of the REI policy in the beginning.

LL Bean became who the were because when they launched as mail order company they listed their orginal Duck Boot (Rubber Buttom and Leather Upper). The glue they used on that first batch was bad and almost all of the first 100 pairs fell apart. Needless to say they would be no more if they would not have supported their products, and that they did. LL Bean replaced every pair and so built the legend and the company. 

Other outdoor companies followed the LL Bean model as a way to build customer loyality and respect. 

In fact the qualities most highly sought after in a retailer are... 1) Be an expert in what you sell. 2) Stand behind what you sold. 3) Provide availability of product. REI still does that for me in all the things I'm not an expert in. I'll continue to buy there and other places. I would encourage you to do the same.


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## Stiff N' Wett (Feb 18, 2010)

I wouldn't say it's abusing a policy when the guy at the counter tells you to return it. I'll be buying a lot more stuff from my local mom and pop stores that's for sure.


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## spider (Jun 20, 2011)

Real sporting goods stores have guns, ammo and camo! I don't shop at stores that carry hippy sandals. I miss old fashion army surplus stores.


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## BilloutWest (Jan 25, 2013)

Don said:


> Other outdoor companies followed the LL Bean model as a way to build customer loyality and respect.


Consumer Reports does a yearly rating of customer satisfaction with different stores. LL Bean has consistently beat out REI by a whisker. Together, they are the best.

I'd recommend either depending on the item being purchased.

=======

When there was only one store in Seattle we'd load up in my VW Van and make it soon enough to still be within a block of the door at opening.
I do miss that level of camaraderie with everyone else. Just seeing a Whittacker brother in the store was special to a simpleton like me.


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

If you don't like the fact that REI has changed their return policy use it as an excuse to actually buy your boating gear at a paddling shop.... you will get better, more knowledgeable service anyway. Plus, the people that own your local paddling shop probably actually raft or kayak.... so your helping someone else enjoy the sport you love, not supporting a national corporation that stocks boating gear simply to turn a profit.


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## Stiff N' Wett (Feb 18, 2010)

I agree with Imyers.... AAA, cks, DRE, wilderness exchange, confluence etc. should be getting business from the front range boaters. I don't know why everyone is all of a sudden so loyal to a big corporate company. If it was Starbucks we were talking about I know everyone would argue you should buy your coffee from a locally owned shop.


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## Avatard (Apr 29, 2011)

I've always thought REI had great boating gear --- if sea kayaking was your thing. Most of their camp gear is inadequate unless you are a backpacker

In all the years of being a member I think I bought about 10 pieces of gear there that go on my boat. A hat, two carabiners, rope, and two pulleys, first need filter, a whistle, etc.

Maybe it's just me but I don't understand why someone would buy boating gear from them unless they didn't know there was someplace else who stocked it.


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## powdahound76 (Jul 20, 2006)

Absolutetly, couldnt agree with Lmyers and Stiff, but dont forget about Golden River Sports too. I have been going in there for years and have had great experiences. You can get your questions answered by someone with actual knowledge vs what they read on the tag or were told by their "hard core" buddy.


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## Mark the dude (Mar 18, 2005)

REI's generous return policy is part of what made them so successful. Of course some people are going to abuse it and cost REI some money; their old CEO was smart and realized that this was money well spent. A lot of people are willing to pay a little extra on a tent knowing that if the zipper blows out in a couple years, they're covered. To me, having only a one year guarantee shows an extreme lack of confidence in your products. Only time will tell, but I think this new CEO is making a huge mistake.


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## BilloutWest (Jan 25, 2013)

Mark the dude said:


> REI's generous return policy is part of what made them so successful. Of course some people are going to abuse it and cost REI some money; their old CEO was smart and realized that this was money well spent. A lot of people are willing to pay a little extra on a tent knowing that if the zipper blows out in a couple years, they're covered. To me, having only a one year guarantee shows an extreme lack of confidence in your products. Only time will tell, but I think this new CEO is making a huge mistake.


A zipper blowing out in a couple years shouldn't be a return item anyway.

Their history isn't from boating. They were climbing and backpacking and have done some movement into bikes and small boats but mostly clothing.
Don't expect them to have great river knowledge or gear.

This change has been foreseen by virtually all in line at a recent REI yard sale. The amount of crap going on made this smart. I bought items at the yard sale that were returned because someone didn't like the design but apparently it took them a dozen uses to figure that out.

This is a cultural thing within our society. We have changed.
Talk to someone who deals with returns in any store. Not good at this point.


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## Mark the dude (Mar 18, 2005)

BilloutWest said:


> A zipper blowing out in a couple years shouldn't be a return item anyway.


Apparently now it is definitely not a return item, which is a shame. In the not too distant past, if you spent hundreds of dollars on a tent, you could expect it to last more than one or two years.


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## co_bjread (Oct 26, 2004)

Mark the dude said:


> Apparently now it is definitely not a return item, which is a shame. In the not too distant past, if you spent hundreds of dollars on a tent, you could expect it to last more than one or two years.


After a couple of years, on any decent tent, it isn't a return, it's a warranty. You send them back to the manufacturer who in my experience (Sierra Designs) puts in new zipper pulls and gets it back in a couple of weeks for nothing more than shipping 1-way. I've done this twice on my 14 year old tent, and it is still going strong, even though I did buy it at REI and could cash it in.

Also bought an REI brand sleeping bag, and the draft collar draw cord lock broke the 2nd use. The REI guy offered a full refund, but that seemed , like a waste. It was actually harder to talk him into a free warranty repair, but we got there, i still have it. 

I think warranties will still back users, but REI shouldn't have to pay for someone's abuse of another companies product. A year is fine, and I don't see that stopping a boarder from getting free rentals every year, if they shop in the fall and return in the spring...still slime, but they can do it.


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## cayo 2 (Apr 20, 2007)

It seems a lot of people have misconceptions about REI as some evil company.I am about the last guy to defend a corporation but I think they are one of better more honest ones.It is a co op of sorts :members/customers get to vote for the company 's officers.Their prices are reasonable.They offer a broad selection not the highest end stuff or complete junk but about everything in between.They had a very generous return policy and the new one is about average. It blows me away that people feel entittled to trash something and then return it.If it is a defective piece of crap., sure return /exchange it.What ever happened to being an honest person?

I generally agree with the sentiments about running mom and pops out of business, but don 't see REI as really doing that.My experience with them regarding kayaking gear is that the clerk, who was not knowledgeable about whitewater boating,RECOMENDED CONFLUENCE KAYAKS! Who buys WW gear wy REI anyway.For camping and climbing they are pretty good and the staff is very knowledgeable (at least at the fl.agship store) .The climbing stores that are a ream job are the ones in resort towns.How many mom n 'pop outdoor shops are there around? Mountainmizer went out of business, maybe in part due to REI.K -mart, Walmart, Target, etc.all sell camping stuff. I bet Walmart hurt small outdoor retailers way more than REI.I like the old Army Surplus down on Broadway for clothes,tools and dome camping stuff


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## cayo 2 (Apr 20, 2007)

but for boating?If you are a serious paddler or cyclist you buy from a shop that specializes in those sports.


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## MtnGuyXC (Jul 20, 2006)

There's a time & place for everything & every situation...that includes what & where you buy any outdoor product..I have always been a proponent of trying to buy from my smaller local shops for whatever type outdoor gear I need...but that being said...I have been a member of REI for about 4 decades now & they have RARELY let me down in any way...The one way I'll mention is when I go into the store to research a product & I end up actually educating the personel more about their own product than they do me.....but that often happens in bigger corporate stores due to the attrition of personel that commonly goes on within them & is a major reason why I prefer smaller locals who have a much more invested interest in their store/product.......but...... many times over the years it just made more sense to buy from REI for me depending upon the circumstances......

Their return policy change is just a reflection of the changes in our society where so many people these days do not take responsiblity for their own actions & circumstances they put themselves in...then they selfcenteredly (is that a webster word or my own? ha) take advantage of whatever situation they can...unfortunately we all end up paying the price for their bullcrap abuse......REI is not technically saying they longer back up their products due to it's quality..they are just finally being pushed into a situation where they needed to make some changes Thanxs to folks such as to why this topic is here....Time will tell if it backfires on them.....One thing people need to understand that many of the products that REI sells are just other big manufactures lines of goods... & If those companies product quality is becoming less then that's not directly REI failing us....but that being said....if REI continues to carry another companies product that has notorious issues then they are in fact letting us down... & I can actually say that I have encountered that situation recently with one of their shoe companies they carry......

If you are a hardcore outdoor junky as I am & truly put your gear to the test then make sure you do your research so you can trust to get what you pay for...If it fails way before it's time then you should hopefully be able to fall back on that company to back their product...if you abuse the gear & get it's fair life out of it then please accept That Fact & quit trying to abuse the system....Because we ALL pay for it in the end..

Anyway..Bla Bla Bla...A year return policy is not a terrible amount of time to sort a product out depending on what it is & how hard it is actually being used....

Geeze!...what the hec am I doing on here? I should be boating....off I go...


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## NWO Whiewater (Apr 27, 2011)

Would be nice to see a movement towards repair of quality gear instead of constant replacement anyway

I don't know how to sew, but Kirkhams (SLC) repair department has extended the live of the only tent I've ever owned to almost 18 years, and counting


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## Mark the dude (Mar 18, 2005)

co_bjread said:


> After a couple of years, on any decent tent, it isn't a return, it's a warranty. You send them back to the manufacturer who in my experience (Sierra Designs) puts in new zipper pulls and gets it back in a couple of weeks for nothing more than shipping 1-way. I've done this twice on my 14 year old tent, and it is still going strong, even though I did buy it at REI and could cash it in.
> 
> Also bought an REI brand sleeping bag, and the draft collar draw cord lock broke the 2nd use. The REI guy offered a full refund, but that seemed , like a waste. It was actually harder to talk him into a free warranty repair, but we got there, i still have it.
> 
> I think warranties will still back users, but REI shouldn't have to pay for someone's abuse of another companies product. A year is fine, and I don't see that stopping a boarder from getting free rentals every year, if they shop in the fall and return in the spring...still slime, but they can do it.


All very good points. I hope I'm wrong about this being a bad business move for them. I've always liked REI for things like camping gear and hiking boots, etc. Never really bought any boating gear from them though.


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## adgeiser (May 26, 2009)

most of the gear at REI comes with a good/great manufactures warranty anyway.

I once brought a tent to a local mom and pop store. Anyway... i brought the tent in to see if i could pay for new poles for it, the tent was a walrus... i was told that MSR bought out walrus, and MSR sent me a new pole and a letter apologizing for not having a replacement for the rainfly that ripped when the pole snapped.

NSR replaced a dry top sent in for repair for free. (bought from confluence and then brought in to confluence for gasket replacement) 

non of these did i ask for or even expect... but i am a loyal MSR and NSR fan now.

point being both the tent and the top were well used and the manufacture stepped up without being asked or expected to.

buy quality and stick with the companies that back their own gear


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## upshitscreek (Oct 21, 2007)

Pizzle said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NGVjR4o2RU
> 
> 
> Personally I think REI can suck it.


so my only take away from that is that 70% of snowboarders are complete douchebags. 

i realize it's less dramatic and all but perhaps next time, if he felt the *unnecessary* need to give a reason to REI for the return, uhhh....maybe "sorry, wrong color." vs bashing a new board against the pavement ? don't know,call me crazy....

anyway, REI continues to get my dollars too. it's one of the few good, big companies... front and back. 

also, one reason they have slightly higher prices is they actually allow the little guy vendors to charge them prices that allow the vendors to make $$$ in the deal too and stay in business. Companies like Dickhead's Sporting Goods, Gander(borderline criminals) or a Walmart rape the vendors $$$wise to where they are making nothing on the deals or even losing money. It's accepted by vendors in the often vain hope of making money with them down the road, keeping a foot in the door and "exposure". The reality is the best thing is forward it to your competition and let them get fucked in the ass instead of you.


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## tmacc (Sep 6, 2009)

NWO Whiewater said:


> Would be nice to see a movement towards repair of quality gear instead of constant replacement anyway
> 
> I don't know how to sew, but Kirkhams (SLC) repair department has extended the live of the only tent I've ever owned to almost 18 years, and counting


Yup. Kirkham's has repair zippers for us several times. Another good company in SLC that will custom sew anything you can think of is Wave on 21st S and around W. Temple. They've sew custom gear bags, straps, harnesses, etc. for us. Great folks to deal with and fair prices.


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## orto11 (Mar 8, 2013)

upshitscreek said:


> so my only take away from that is that 70% of snowboarders are complete douchebags.
> 
> i realize it's less dramatic and all but perhaps next time, if he felt the *unnecessary* need to give a reason to REI for the return, uhhh....maybe "sorry, wrong color." vs bashing a new board against the pavement ? don't know,call me crazy....
> 
> ...


I agree with this statement, in the river world NRS is the one running the little guy out and carrying a huge margin while the very few US manufacturers they are still using are cut to such a small margin they can barely get by. NRS wants a 200 %mark up while the guy making it gets 10% to feed his family and pay taxes. I love the thought they are selling you a NRS drysuit that cost them 100.00 and you pay 800.00 of course they have great service and can replace stuff you paid for 8 of them in the beginning.


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## Aroberts (Apr 20, 2009)

REI better drop their prices. Most things are over priced and unless you use you 20% off coupon for a tent or sleeping bag you are getting ripped off. I was willing to pay more for a sleeping bag, tent, camp stove because of the return policy. Not anymore I guess. 

Go online and you will see you can find most items cheaper.

Are they grandfathering the items you bought to the old policy if you bought them before they implemented this new policy?


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## cayo 2 (Apr 20, 2007)

yeah buy it online and cut out the local retailer completely and screw your state out of the sales tax..you really get s good look at it that way too...REI is way too expensive?what planet are you on..the small shops charge more for stuff because they have to to stay in business, but they provide local service and advice that has value ...some local shops are the hub of thei r boating communities providing training, coordinating events, river cleanups,kayak porn movie showings, etc...buy it from some faceless remote company because you are a cheap greedy little bastard and see if the shops can still provide these things you take for granted ....


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## cayo 2 (Apr 20, 2007)

not saying REI is small /local but that local specialty shops are more expensive but give additional value. that should be taken into consideration..REI does mot really sell much boating stuff anyway..one thing I did /you can do if you find a good deal online is have the local shop get it for you even if they don 't carry it.I found a Kokstst drysuit on their site could have ordered it at MSRP but if I get it through John at Confluence I pay the same MSRP AND my local shop makes the difference beteeen wholesale and retail price.If you buy it direct at MSRP then the manufacturer is acting as retailer and profiting twice.


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## BilloutWest (Jan 25, 2013)

Aroberts said:


> REI better drop their prices. Most things are over priced and unless you use you 20% off coupon for a tent or sleeping bag you are getting ripped off.


One should not buy from REI at regular price.
One should not buy anywhere at regular price.
{We paid off our home and all other debt years ago.}

= = = = = = = = =

A thing to consider when buying from REI is employee welfare.
They do treat their employees far better than a WalMart and many local stores/manufacturers. (There was a recent thread on an employee from a well known manufacturer that didn't have health insurance for her bout with cancer.)

========

When buying 'ethically' there are many things to consider.


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## Aroberts (Apr 20, 2009)

As a consumer who does not have a bunch of cash I try not to pay more for something than I have to. If my local shops have items in stock it makes it much easier. When I look to a more expensive item like a dry suit or even a kayak I explore my options. Why pay full retail of $1,000+ when I can pay $800 or less. I have bought multiple brand new boats at msrp from local retailers. I feel it's irresponsible not to explore your options. $200 is a lot of money to me and I work hard for it. 

I wish I made mad cash so I could support my local shops with every purchase but the reality is I don't and I can't always support them.


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## cayo 2 (Apr 20, 2007)

yeah know where you are coming from...lower middle class myself. ..did not mean to be so harsh..just pointing out there are hidden costs and benefits.most of us have to go cheep sometimes..just wish there was more big picture thinking and doing the right things far more often than not......


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## Aroberts (Apr 20, 2009)

cayo 2 said:


> yeah know where you are coming from...lower middle class myself. ..did not mean to be so harsh..just pointing out there are hidden costs and benefits.most of us have to go cheep sometimes..just wish there was more big picture thinking and doing the right things far more often than not......


No problem, I get it and try to do the best I can to support the local economy.


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