# Kids pulled out a Aire Lynx on Local GJ Run



## flipper42

Saw some kids pull out a older aire lynx foam floor model at the walk way bridge near the orchard mesa skate park in semi rough shape the side tubes held air just fine the foam floor zipper was broke. when I asked the kids to call the number they acted like morons. I saw the number and tried to call it after they left 9702436545 or something close to it the line was disconnected. So if you own the boat be on a look out these kids are gonna be trying to sell it or run it.


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## mongopush

maritime law! Ship was abandon if owner wants it back he will be responsible for the retrieval fee which would be well more than the boat is worth. More power to the kids. Leaving a boat in the river is littering! I think that the owner of the boat should be fined for leaving it in the river.


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## Barney Fife

*Pay It Forward*

I understand the law and I also understand humanity and karma. What I don't understand are the circumstances which left this boat in the river. Until I do, I am leaving my judgement in my head and hoping that the owners are able reclaim their IK. If I had found that boat, some cold beverages and a generous thank you would do well for me; and I'd leave the legal stuff in the ditch. Flipper, I hope some tasty waves and a cool buzz find their way home to you.


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## ragdoll

Karma would be more about the owner of the IK not taking care of their property and the kids good fortune for finding the IK. Right? You have twisted the true meaning of karma and applied a western thought process on Indian culture. Go Merkia!


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## flipper42

the guy that found the boat had no intention of calling the number period or caring if someone was hurt just some disrespectful teenager but whatever I just hope if I had to take a swim and lose gear someone would call the number thats on my equipment.


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## Barney Fife

*Two Way Karma Street*



ragdoll said:


> Karma would be more about the owner of the IK not taking care of their property and the kids good fortune for finding the IK. Right? You have twisted the true meaning of karma and applied a western thought process on Indian culture. Go Merkia!


Karma could go either way, with whomever has earned it... Perhaps the kids have earned their good fortune, or perhaps they are earning their future misfortune now. The owners of the IK may have previously earned their karma as well, and now they are seeing the results. Regardless, the Merkia being cheered on may be karmic as well...

Maritime law does entitle the owners of the boat the opportunity to regain their property, and goes something like this: A successful salvor is NOT entitled to just keep the salved vessel, under any circumstances, but is entitled to a generous award. The amount of the award, under the law, is based on the following factors: 1) the value of the vessel and its contents after the salvage is complete; 2) the salvor’s skill and initiative in minimizing damage to the environment; 3) the degree of success obtained by the salvor; 4) the level of peril to which the salvaged vessel was subject; 5) the salvor’s skill and initiative in saving the vessel, human lives, and other property; 6) the salvor’s labor and expenses; 7) the amount of risk run by the salvor; 8) the promptness of the services rendered; 9) the availability and use of any alternative salvage resources; and 10) the readiness, efficiency, and value of the salvor’s vessel and equipment.

Considering all these factors, the kids should be compensated for their time and trouble, and in this case, the salvage of the IK most likely appears to be a “low-order” salvage, where the risk to a kids was negligible and the salvaged vessel was in little danger. Therefore, the premium would be relatively small. In a “high-order” salvage the total award can, under the law, be as high as (though it may not exceed) 100 percent of the value of the salvaged vessel and its contents. Bottom line: The kids automatically get a high-priority lien on the IK they saved and may keep the vessel until the owner posts security.

I believe this is accurate, regardless of karma or Merkia, and I hope the kids get a reward and the owners of the IK gets their boat back.


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## ragdoll

Barney Fife said:


> Karma could go either way, with whomever has earned it... Perhaps the kids have earned their good fortune, or perhaps they are earning their future misfortune now. The owners of the IK may have previously earned their karma as well, and now they are seeing the results. Regardless, the Merkia being cheered on may be karmic as well....


No not at all. Your still putting western ideas into an Indian principle. The bottom line is that the owner lost his IK. "Bad karma." The kids found IK and safely gained position of said IK. "Good Karma." Any attempt at any other interpretation of how karma played out is second guessing karma. Therefore possibly bring on bad karma by not letting karma play out. 



Barney Fife said:


> I believe this is accurate, regardless of karma or Merkia, and I hope the kids get a reward and the owners of the IK gets their boat back.


I could care less about the laws, but in regards to karma, this would be an attempt to circumvent karma's original will. Thus, setting ones self up for bad karma in the future by trying to correct karma. 

One should not meddle in the affairs of karma. If one truly believes in karma, they would let it play out! And trust that it will work out in the end. :grin:


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## dirtbagkayaker

OK, did I read this right. OP starts tread out "Saw *some kids* pull out a older aire..." and then his next post was "*the guy* that found the boat..." 

Hummmmm!!! Which story are you going to stick with? Curious minds want to know.


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## Jensjustduckie

ragdoll said:


> No not at all. Your still putting western ideas into an Indian principle. The bottom line is that the owner lost his IK. "Bad karma." The kids found IK and safely gained position of said IK. "Good Karma." Any attempt at any other interpretation of how karma played out is second guessing karma. Therefore possibly bring on bad karma by not letting karma play out.
> 
> 
> 
> I could care less about the laws, but in regards to karma, this would be an attempt to circumvent karma's original will. Thus, setting ones self up for bad karma in the future by trying to correct karma.
> 
> One should not meddle in the affairs of karma. If one truly believes in karma, they would let it play out! And trust that it will work out in the end. :grin:


So you're saying all the talk of "return my paddle for beers and good karma" is bullshit? We should keep the found items as our own good karma from now on? Because it seems like that is what you're saying... and that's how things run in 3rd world countries too.


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## ragdoll

Jensjustduckie said:


> So you're saying all the talk of "return my paddle for beers and good karma" is bullshit? We should keep the found items as our own good karma from now on? Because it seems like that is what you're saying... and that's how things run in 3rd world countries too.


 Yes I guess I am saying "for beers and good karma" is bullshit. Its a lack of understanding of the true meaning of karma. Its a western "idea" of karma. Its kinda like believing in Jesus through the word of Budda. It just comes out all wrong. But in no way am I trying to justify stealing peoples stuff. Also I am not saying that we should act like people in other cultures. Just to clarify, I'm not speaking to the ethics of the IK in question. I am just speaking to the use of karma associated with this issue. Get it?? Instead I'm thinking we should be careful to not take other cultures thoughts and ideas out of context. Its arrogant and for lack of a better word... just down right Merikan.


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## Barney Fife

ragdoll said:


> I could care less about the laws, but in regards to karma, this would be an attempt to circumvent karma's original will. Thus, setting ones self up for bad karma in the future by trying to correct karma.
> 
> One should not meddle in the affairs of karma. If one truly believes in karma, they would let it play out! And trust that it will work out in the end. :grin:


Okay ragdoll, I can see you know your karma, and most likely passed Religious Studies 101. Cool. Still, I hope that the folks who own the boat had good enough "fortune" to get off the river safely, and that those kids call the number on the boat and continue to help to get the vessel to its rightful owner. Lastly, I hope that the boys leave with a small fortune in their pockets, or at least in their hearts; unless that might interfere with karma in any way, then I would not wish that. Fair the well. Arrrgh!


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## highcountrypanic

Maritime law rules all apply here. Why is this even a question???


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## Barney Fife

*No Question*



highcountrypanic said:


> Maritime law rules all apply here. Why is this even a question???


There's no question at all. If the kids don't return the craft, then it amounts to theft and they will be identified as crooks, due to bad karma of course...probably. For sure, I don't really know what I'm sayin' about karma. But I sure hope that boat gets home and that the people who were in it are safe at home too.


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## highcountrypanic

I hope the boat makes it home as well all karma aside. Although it does depend on the situation. Maritime law can be looked at in many aspects. If the boat has a name/number on its karma on them (agreed). If not I hope these dudes rage the hell out of the vessel and don't sell.


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## highcountrypanic

Theft is not in the question if it was salvaged


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## mongopush

highcountrypanic said:


> If not I hope these dudes rage the hell out of the vessel and don't sell.


 
Agreed! Rage the hell out of the vessel. ragE, raGE - RAGE! :twisted::twisted::twisted:

But then again, I'm a bad person with no understand of Humanity or Karma.


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## jgrebe

Just to clarify the law. There is no such thing as maritime salvage law on inland waterways. A lost boat is just like any other lost property - you have to report it to the Authorities and turn it in or you are stealing. End of story.


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## jgrebe

Meant to say "non-navigable" inland water ways - which includes about all of the rafting and kayaking rivers


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## okieboater

I do not know the details of Karma or Maritime Law for what it is worth.

I do understand the USA concept of "right" and "wrong" as can be applied to most situations. What is right or wrong can be argued till the cows come home, but most of us know right or wrong when we see it in action.

In my, opinion, and for what it is worth, the right thing for the kids to do is attempt to contact the owner of the IK in good faith. Good faith might be just posting on Mt Buzz and/or calling any phone numbers found on the IK. Or, turning the IK over to the local river authorities. I know lots of gear is turned in to the Rangers on the ARK in BV/Salida CO and a lot of it does find it's way home.

If no answer to any of the above or what ever is appropriate actions, my opinion is the kids keep and use the IK.


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## Barney Fife

*Yep*



okieboater said:


> In my, opinion, and for what it is worth, the right thing for the kids to do is attempt to contact the owner of the IK in good faith. Good faith might be just posting on Mt Buzz and/or calling any phone numbers found on the IK. Or, turning the IK over to the local river authorities.
> 
> If no answer to any of the above or what ever is appropriate actions, my opinion is the kids keep and use the IK.


My understanding of Maritime Law, or most laws for that matter, are limited, and mostly based on what I can find online. My understanding of karma is based on the size of the bite marks on my ass. Like okieboater, I believe that the right thing to is for the people who found the boat to make good faith attempts to contact the owner of the boat and return it. If Maritime law does not relate to this salvage, then I would imagine that state law does. Regardless, I hope that the kids make attempts to return the boat to its owner. If they do so and are unable to connect, then I hope this Aire IK turns these intrigued teenagers into a life-long river rats.


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## JeremyH

Screw the karma or f-ing maritime law.

Calling a number on a piece of gear found = the right thing to do.

If you're a boater yourself, you know where to post (here, see the countless posts over the years of quality people attempting to find the owners of lost/found items).


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## MT4Runner

Boater karma /= actual Eastern religion karma.


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