# Lets hear it Kayaks Vs. Rafts



## freexbiker (Jul 18, 2005)

So I know the fued but lets hear the pros/cons. They both have good qualities but i want to hear some of the less heard qualities. Im a beginner kayaker and was thinking a raft would be fun 
so I decided it would be fun to see what comes up 
Luke


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## freexbiker (Jul 18, 2005)

*sorry*

excuse the four other posts i have horrible time on this frickin site


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## alacy1 (May 17, 2005)

I enjoy both. In the spring and early summer, I use my creek boat for the adrenaline and adventure that i crave, and then I use my raft for the longer overnighters in the summer. Now that I am older (24) I find appreciation in having my own rig on the river with everything i need: beer, water, food, herb, etc. and rowing some nice III+ IV water, (Westwater, Cat, Hells Canyon type shit) seeing as how I am not an BV pro, is a huge rush. Completely different high than a kayak. I say, learn to kayak and rafting will be easy. You can always bring along the XXX for the killin' play.


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## gh (Oct 13, 2003)

Due to recent threads I am going to say rafts. Sounds like fun.


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## Dave Frank (Oct 14, 2003)

Definately need both. Obviously kayaking is WAAAY cooler. you can always run much haarder stuff in a kayak and the logistics are so much simpler.

As alacy1 said rafts have there place too. 

Great to be able to pack it all and not have to defend what you brought along to the uppity rafter who is carrying your shit.

Much more comfortable for long periods on the water, and much better place to have a drink holder and an umbrella in the dessert.

I don't overlook the challenge of rowing a heavy raft through slightly difficult whitewater either. If you are a decent kayaker, rowing is much more of a challenge and keeps it interesting on easier water, provided there is not tons of play to miss out on.

Honestly one of the worst parts of rafting is all the cleaning and the putting away of stuff that seems to linger on for half a week after a trip.


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## CUkayakGirl (Mar 31, 2005)

Rafts are fun to take friends and family down the river, you can carry more beer, it is more social and relaxed and it is easy to get paid to do it.

Kayaking is cool because you can go places rafts can't go, it is more of an individual sport and if you want to do something stupid than it is just you doing something stupid.

They are both fun, get one of each!


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## tuberslickmysweatyballs (Sep 24, 2005)

Yeah, dave franks comments are pretty spot on with the exception that kayaking is way cooler. both are very cool with the exception of playboaters,of course. :twisted:  

downside to rafting is that rafters tend to get stuck with all the logistics, planning, extra work of loading,rigging,unloading, dealing with the group poop(as in groover), the hours of gear checking/sorting/cleaning before and after a trip, dealing with the permit proccess and having the required permit gear at the launch. Along with the slight pressure that if you screw one thing up/forget one thing then you've ruined allot of people's vacation or weekend. Rafters tend to be better at all this too. Probably all the years of experience dealing with it and initially seemingly complex permit proccesses that become routine over time.

However, it an awesome feeling pushing out into the current at some hectic put in, putting the oars in the water ,relaxing abit and then disappear around the bend for a week of river camping, great food /beverage, whitewater and good company. It's all very worthwhile,at that point.

I should add that it is true that rafts and the whole rafting experience tends to make chics horny too. The booze,the warm sun, good food and going down a river all cleopatra style seems to get them going abit.


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## Skyman (Jun 26, 2006)

OK, here is my take. I have had my raft about eight years now. I do 1-2 multi day trips a season with 10 or so "day runs". Well I gotta tell you, i'm sick and tired of watching all you kayakr's going by me and having all that fun. Now I want to kayak. Hopefully I can have the best of both worlds. Doesn't seem that hard to strap the kayak on the back of the raft for long flatwater sections. How hard is it to learn to kayak anyway? 

Skyman


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## shady (Jun 7, 2006)

Rafts are a lot of fun and you can deffinatly haul more shit. Kayaks are small and dont have a whole lot of storage. The best thing is to have a raft carry all your shit while you have fun in a kayak. Having a raft around is not a bad thing, but I think having a kayak and a raft is ideal.


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## Braznut (Jun 23, 2007)

I'd have to place a vote for my ducky! I love kayaking to but I also like having maneuverability and being able to carry gear. 
I can still surf and run BIGger water like I am in my kayak, all while having my cooler full of beer right there. 

That said, I think rafts and kayaks are both great. Being able to do both makes you a well-rounded "waterperson." 

This reminds me of the Longboard vs Shortboard argument in the surfing community. My friends never understood why I did both.


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## shady (Jun 7, 2006)

I'll go with that a Duckie can be a lot of fun my wife paddles a Duckie. THats how I haul my gear.


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## oarbender (Feb 3, 2007)

TLMSB, has in NAILED. There is nothing like a raft, BUT there is SOOOOOO much shit that comes with it. IMHO, I truley belive thats where a lot of the Kayaker/rafter beef comes from. I have been on trips where some of the kayakers, just expected us rafters to take care of it, and i have been on trips where the kayakers, rip all day, super solid, and say, "we'll be at camp", and say adios........then they come, hand me an un-opened bottle of makers mark, and tell me to sit down..........I prefer a closer idea to the later, but just cause i have all the shit, dosn't mean i need, want or git to sit on my ass.

as far as the "vacation" idea of it, thats crap............its an expedition, not a vacation. If you wanna vacation, pay a commercial crew to run you down, simple as that.

BTW, I row a big rig, and if you have a good eye, you can see my angst squirt boat, in my avatar.

Yo!


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## tuberslickmysweatyballs (Sep 24, 2005)

oarbender said:


> as far as the "vacation" idea of it, thats crap............its an expedition, not a vacation. If you wanna vacation, pay a commercial crew to run you down, simple as that.


just semantics. i get 4 weeks of vacation a year. my vacations are usually spent on multi-day trips or rafting, climbing and fly fishing expeditions(expeditions-places that don't have guidebooks or much beta) or something else where I come back to work needing a real "vacation" to recover from my vacation.


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## brokenpaddlejon (Sep 11, 2005)

Both are awesome activities. Both have pros and cons. As a former raft guide and a raft owner I can say that rafting will always be special to me hanging out floating down a canyon in serenity is a very unique way to spend time. Then the partying is always real good in camp. Cons as has been mentioned rigging, total gear, permits have all been mentioned. One that hasn't been talked about is the cost, an adequate river set up will cost a minimum of $5000 retail, maybe less if you go used. Ouch. Kayaking is far more affordable, though still expensive you can count on about a grand for essentials if you go used. Running tighter lines, surfing, among others are things that I enjoy. Fighting for time with tubers(sometimes), dodging rafts(sometimes), gear storage can be tricky, and though the learning curve can be managed, it is not an easy sport to learn. That said I'm glad and fortunate to be able to do both, the river is definitely my summer salvation.


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## yakrafter (Aug 7, 2006)

*It's ok to go both ways...*

Ditto, Yaks're small easy to move around and get you in tighter spots, more personal, more fluid, Ditto, Rafts're more time consuming, tough to move, good for groups, beer, overnights, etc., Ditto, try rafting and you will do both.

Check out Creature Craft - The Ultimate Inflatable and watch some good vid.


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## CheckYoSelf (Jun 30, 2007)

In a raft you share a very similar and unifying experience with others.


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## Chip (Apr 7, 2007)

*Down to you—*

Do a personality check.

At the extremes, you might go for a tight little playboat (with a very long learning curve) that does one thing really well: thrills. On the other end, an 18-foot Grand Canyon beer barge will keep you in comforts for a 20-day trip, but will bust your gut rowing against the wind. 

Most people look for something closer to the middle. In a 'yak, that'd be an all-around river boat with enough volume to carry a bit of overnight gear. In a raft (or cat— my choice) that'd be a boat that can carry two and enough gear for 2-3 nights out: a 14-footer or thereabouts. 

Also in the middle ground would be a 2-person duckie (easy to paddle solo) or Pack Cat, that's good for day runs but can haul some overnight gear. 

Once you get a taste, then you can decide which way you want to go. Or you can get a big ol' beer barge and strap your playboat on. Recruit a guest rower or two.


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## Snowhere (Feb 21, 2008)

You need both, well eventually. I started kayaking when I was a single guy and now I have 3 yaks in my quiver. Every one needs a play or squirt boat, a river running yak for those longer runs or when you just do not want to be a sardine in a can, and a creeker for running the gnar. 

Then after many years, I ended up attached and with two little ones. So now I have a raft too and look forward to taking the fam down multiple day trips. And like everyone else stated, now I can carry my, and plenty more gear for the long haul. 

One is not necessary better, they both have their strengths and weaknesses. The right tool for the situation at hand is always a good thing.


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## UserName (Sep 7, 2007)

Dont forget about the inflatable Shamu!!!


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## tyaker (Dec 11, 2004)

Snowhere said:


> Then after many years, I ended up attached and with two little ones. So now I have a raft too and look forward to taking the fam down multiple day trips. And like everyone else stated, now I can carry my, and plenty more gear for the long haul.


How many kayakers can carry their two dogs? The pups always look dejected when I head out with my paddle in hand, but get waaay pumped when the oars come out.


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## captishmael (Feb 8, 2008)

For me, It's a raft! I like the feel of rowing as opposed to paddling. Getting your whole body into the motion, using your legs to propel the raft, nice. . You see more of your surroundings on a raft. Your ass is not in water all day long. Drinking is easier in a raft, as well as hauling a big frigging cooler. Cigars are better in a raft. You don't wear (usually) a cold, clammy, smelly dry top in a raft. Of course, kayaks are fun, it's just different. Kayaks are more about tricks, rafts are more about enjoying the journey.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

caprishmael said:


> For me, It's a raft! I like the feel of rowing as opposed to paddling. Getting your whole body into the motion, using your legs to propel the raft, nice. . You see more of your surroundings on a raft. Your ass is not in water all day long. Drinking is easier in a raft, as well as hauling a big frigging cooler. Cigars are better in a raft. You don't wear (usually) a cold, clammy, smelly dry top in a raft. Of course, kayaks are fun, it's just different. Kayaks are more about tricks, rafts are more about enjoying the journey.


 
Put down the cigars how does being in a raft allow you to see more? i don't know hw many drops im throwing kickflips off of so kayaking isn't all about tricks.... its about being on the water and with your buds and enjoying the moment. and when in the hell is anybody judging your stinky ass drytops. we are all wearing them...


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## RRHB (Feb 5, 2007)

When I'm in a raft they are the best and I look for elitist kayakers to run over, when I'm in a kayak I hate those working class slobs pushing rubber!!


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## mr. compassionate (Jan 13, 2006)

_In a raft you get to carry the groover!_


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## captishmael (Feb 8, 2008)

caspermike said:


> Put down the cigars how does being in a raft allow you to see more? i don't know hw many drops im throwing kickflips off of so kayaking isn't all about tricks.... its about being on the water and with your buds and enjoying the moment. and when in the hell is anybody judging your stinky ass drytops. we are all wearing them...


OOOHHH!!!! OUCH!!!! Touched a nerve, did I? Sorry about that! Where do I start?

1. You can take my cigars when you pry them from my cold, dead lips. 

2. You see more from the a) the higher vantage point offered by a raft (simple physics, y'know) and b) Yaks require that you pay more attention to the water in the immediate vicinity of your boat at the expense of the greater surroundings. Just the nature of the beast.

3. Nobody is judging you on the basis of your stinky ass drytops, I'm just stating the facts, ma'am, just the facts.

I didn't really intend to do a contentious posting, but hey, this is kind of fun! Anybody else want to play?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

caprishmael said:


> OOOHHH!!!! OUCH!!!! Touched a nerve, did I? Sorry about that! Where do I start?
> 
> 1. You can take my cigars when you pry them from my cold, dead lips.
> 
> ...


I figured you were only talking about the point of view.. just giving you shit is that swisher you are smoking? hopefully not.


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## Geoff773 (May 20, 2008)

I hated those kayakers when I was guiding. They looked like they had all the fun and when they were tired they drank beer on your boat. Bullshit!! If you can't beat them.... I picked up a kayak last year and with any luck i'll have a solid roll before I drown. 
The biggest factor is probably the cost. Like somebody already said 5K for a raft (used) is getting off easy. The raft is the cheap part then throw in sticks, frame, cooler, dry bags, boxes, tables, chairs, tarps, kitchen, groover, fire pan....you get the idea. I say if you can swing the raft get that first. The kayakers need you and will gladly swap rowing duties with you when you lock the beer cooler. If you can't swing that cost then get the kayak and get on the water. You'll meet the people who have the raft and you can swap with them. Do me a favor and don't leave them with the full groover at the end of the trip. probably the best way to never have raft support again. 
Oh yea, the midway option. A Cat is usually a little cheaper and the frames usually come with the boxes. Still pricey but I think I picked mine (Sotar 14') up for under 5K with Sawyer sticks. 
ORRRr. Quit your job. Become a river guide. Learn the sport of alcoholism for free. Get a tan. Get a chick a week. Get a Pro Deal for all your gear. Not necessarily in that order.


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## RiverGirl84 (May 23, 2008)

Rafting and kayaking BOTH have their benefits. Want to take your friends on a drunken booze cruise? Rafting. A trip longer than a day or two? Rafting. But you want to hit the river after work, definitely kayaking. Why must we separate (not to sound too cheesy) but seriously. We all love the river. It's an awesome natural influence that unites us together. Again, trying not to be too cheesy.


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## RiverGirl84 (May 23, 2008)

Geoff773 said:


> ORRRr. Quit your job. Become a river guide. Learn the sport of alcoholism for free. Get a tan. Get a chick a week. Get a Pro Deal for all your gear. Not necessarily in that order.


P.S. Being a raft guide is the s**t. Nice tan, booze, and ultimately good friends, stories, and good times. But as far as a chick a week, that's only if you are staying on her couch. We spend all our money on pro deals, not rent


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## the_dude (May 31, 2006)

my raft is for fishing. my kayak is for whitewater. pretty simple.


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## wayniac (Mar 31, 2007)

I raft because I can't kayak. And yes, I've spent some time in a kayak. Anyone who thinks it takes more skill to raft than kayak hasn't tried it. There is something to be said for successfully negotiating Marsh Creek in low water in a fully loaded 1200# raft though. If I could kayak all the stuff I wanted to run- I would- otherwise, I'll simply wait until I'm terminally ill to give it a shot.


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## mrkyak (Jul 11, 2005)

LEARN TO KAYAK IN CASE OF FLASH FLOOD


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## brettb (Apr 9, 2005)

Thats a tough one, lots a good vibes out there!
I own
2 kayaks
3 rafts / 3 frames
1 IK
and a really big cooler!!!

only...... 1 raft is a shredder way different from rafting
and another is a mini me and R2 R3 R4 you can take some serious kayak lines and bury the entire boat and often it feels like you are kayaking but with some buddies! my 12 foot rafts is good for higher water and of course taking your non river friends/family down the river!

I personally wish I could kayak more as the individuality experience is more satisfying..... but you do need to go with those whom you really trust much like tying into a rope and climbing 1,000 feet up! or skiing avy shit with dialed freinds!! its all good if your on the water!!


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