# 2011 NFSP / Roberts Tunnel Flows



## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Saw that they turned up the tunnel to ~280 cfs. 

Called Denver Water to see what the plan is, but waiting to hear back (flows guy was out).

Keep checking the gauges!


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## Roy (Oct 30, 2003)

deepsouthpaddler said:


> Its shaping up to be a potentially good season on the north fork. The upper south platte basin headwaters is below average in some spots which means east slope supplies aren't huge.


How do you figure? I appreciate the optimism, but the basin's not just half full, it's fast approaching 130%!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

South platte basin as a whole is 130% for snowpack but that covers everything from the poudre down to the headwaters of the south platte above cheeseman and elevenmile. Poudre, clear creek, and big T were all 140%+ at april 1. On april 1 the upper south platte (farthest south portion of the south platte) was 96% of average. The 96% is a bit misleading though as its just a straight up average of the handful of snotel sites with no weighting on watershed size etc. 

If you look at the point maps of the colorado snotel sites, you can see a couple of upper south platte sites that are well below average. (one below 50%). 
See link below.

http://www.wcc.nrcs.usda.gov/ftpref/data/water/wcs/gis/maps/co_swepctnormal.pdf

Wet conditions kicked ass in summit, and along the continental divide of the front range, but as you get to the southern portions of the upper south platte drainage, you start hitting the dry areas that did not get snow, and everything to the south is well below average. 

If you look at drought conditions, which aren't just snotel, you will see that pretty much most of park county (headwaters of upper south platte) is dry. This means that although the 10,000 ft snotels along the continental divide are doing well, the portions of the upper south platte basin are relatively dry. See map below. Park county is the large county almost in the middle fo the state with the bulge in the yellow countour.

State Drought Monitor

Another factor is that lower elevations on the front range have been very dry this year, even though the high elevation has gotten slammed. This means dry soils, which can absorb water and dampen runoff. Even though snowpack might be X% of average, runoff can be a lower % of average due to dry soils that suck up some of the runoff. 

Its the upper south platte headwaters that is currently relatively dry that feeds antero, elevenmile and cheeseman which are the southern portion of denver waters supply system. The other portion is roberts tunnel, which pulls out of lake dillon on the blue river basin. If the upper south platte is below average with dry soil conditions, and the blue river is 130%+ then its a good bet that you will see decent roberts tunnel flows later in the season.

I spoke with Denver Water about some of my observations they agreed, and added to some of the above analysis. 

Its a bit long, but thats the logic behind the potential for a pretty good north fork season via the roberts tunnel.


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## stubby (Oct 13, 2003)

Thank you Dr. Foley for your analysis...many well used hours at work went into that analysis I'm sure.

The anticipation is starting to kill me!


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## Roy (Oct 30, 2003)

Nice work Ian! 

I guess I had been thinking that with it all coming into the S. Platte someplace, there wouldn't be much need to add to that by diverting more thru the tunnel, but if the source for Antero/Elevenmile/Cheeseman is low, then yeah--Bailey's gonna rock! Especially with the greater Colorado basin seeing an abundance of snowpack as well.


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## cadster (May 1, 2005)

Ian overlooked Aurora's Pan-Ark water coming down the SF:
http://www.auroragov.org/stellent/idcplg?IdcService=GET_FILE&dID=77083&dDocName=042117


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Cadster, I didn't overlook the Aurora water supply. Its treated separately from Denver Water operations, and doesn't have any impact on roberts tunnel or north fork operations. Different players, different system, even though it goes through a portion of the upper south platte briefly.

Denver waters main storage on the east slope is cheeseman, elevenmile, spinney and antero, which are all at the very southern end of the south platte basin.

Anyway... its going to be a kickass year on the front range regardless of how you look at it!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Denver water turned up the tunnel to 275 today.  They think they will keep it that way for the the weekend, but they could drop it down depending on the weekend rain. Check the gauges before you go. They typically change in the morning if they are going to do it.


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## El Flaco (Nov 5, 2003)

> *Water levels at leaking Antero Reservoir to be drawn down*
> 
> 
> Safety concerns about Antero Reservoir near Fairplay have prompted Denver Water to announce that water in the reservoir will be reduced by 2 feet beginning the first week of May.
> ...


I know there are two more reservoirs in between (elevenmile and cheeseman), but I wonder what this means in the grand scheme of things. I would guess that with the dry conditions in the drainage that elevenmile & cheeseman can absorb the excess, but you never know....


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## cadster (May 1, 2005)

Aurora's water competes for space in Strontia Springs with Denver Water's:

_Water is delivered to Spinney Mountain Reservoir through the Homestake pipeline for storage. As Aurora demand dictates, water is released from Spinney to the South Platte River for delivery to Strontia Springs Reservoir, in the foothills of the Denver metro area. Aurora owns 10% of the capacity of Strontia Springs Reservoir, or 700 acre feet; the remainder belongs to Denver Water._

My point is that even with little snow in the SF basin, it'll have Aurora's Pan-Ark water.



deepsouthpaddler said:


> I didn't overlook the Aurora water supply. Its treated separately from Denver Water operations, and doesn't have any impact on roberts tunnel or north fork operations. Different players, different system, even though it goes through a portion of the upper south platte briefly. Denver waters main storage on the east slope is cheeseman, elevenmile, spinney and antero, which are all at the very southern end of the south platte basin.


 
Less storage in Antero would seem to also me more flow in the NF this year.



El Flaco said:


> I know there are two more reservoirs in between (elevenmile and cheeseman), but I wonder what this means in the grand scheme of things. I would guess that with the dry conditions in the drainage that elevenmile & cheeseman can absorb the excess, but you never know....


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

4/25...

Denver water turned down the tunnel to about 150 cfs today. Rain over the weekend dropped the need for tunnel water. 

Denver water noted that water needs are hard to predict right now as it depends on where and how much rain hits denver metro, and what temps and weather does to the early small runoff. 

Denver water be making adjustments as changes in weather and demand dictate. Keep an eye on the gauges.


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## cmack (Oct 15, 2006)

Ian... any word on the current situation? It is flowing 350 right now and we were wondering if we should expect (we know we shouldn't) this to last through the weekend. 

-Mack


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## ACC (Oct 30, 2003)

Looks like they just bumped Roberts Tunnel back up to 330ish. Any intel on whether it will hold for the weekend, especially Sunday? 

Supposed to be really warm down here (lots of sprinkler systems turning on) so if that is why whater is moving then maybe it will continue?


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## stubby (Oct 13, 2003)

PSA: NF of S. Platte at Bailey up to 394 cfs...looks like it'll hold for Sunday I'd say.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Just got back from a week in the caribbean on the beach. Sorry for the lack of info for the past week. Denver water usually likes to hold flows for the weekend if they can, and lack of runoff combined with hot and sunny weather on the front range likely means they will keep flows holding for sunday.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

5/9 update...

Denver water is holding the tunnel stead at around 375 cfs, with 400+ in the north fork. Great early season flows!

Should see flows stay at similar levels for the next couple of warm days. After that it depends on what cooler weather and potential rain does to demand. 

Natural runoff has not really kicked off and hot weather in denver has caused high demand for water. As soon as natural runoff kicks in, tunnel water will likely slow down.

Denver water is trying to fill cheeseman reservoir, thus the low flows out of cheeseman. There is a lot of snowpack in the blue river drainage, and denver water is pulling from dillon throug the tunnel (and releasing into the blue) to drop dillon to prepare for runoff and deliver water to the front range.

Keep an eye on the gauges as things could be variable and day to day.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

5/11 update

Denver water turned the tunnel to 200 cfs today. They dropped flows due to rain. Denver water didn't know what the future would hold as rain and weather is a big variable right now.


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## ChasetheWater (Apr 19, 2011)

Ian, any word on flows tomorrow?


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

No word. I'll give them a call in the am tomorrow. Denver water is checking the numbers every am and making the call from there. At this time of year when the weather and rain is variable, its a day to day call.

If they do change flows tomorrow, they usually do it around 9-10 am. It takes about 2 hrs for flows to change from the tunnel to the run. If you put on around 9-10, you can get current flows. 

Alternately, wait until you see the 10am gauge updates to make sure they aren't turning it down on you for a later run.

Good luck.


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## ChasetheWater (Apr 19, 2011)

Sick man yeah I think we're meeting at 8 am so we'll be on todays flows.. thanks for the info, and thanks for the access issue post. I can't believe how much people take this run for granted.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

5/19 update.

Denver water turned down the tunnel to 150 cfs today. Plans are to likely turn it down to 100 cfs and hold it at that flow through next week. They are going to do some testing on the new valves they put in and need the flow to be 100 cfs for that for a while. 

Early season runs were nice!


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## Robb (Feb 14, 2007)

Glad we got on it this morning before the shutdown. Thanks Ian.


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## ChasetheWater (Apr 19, 2011)

Lots of new wood in Bailey.. I doesn't affect any of the rapids but just a good think to keep your eye out for. Looks like maybe a landslide or somethin.. But multiple trees down!


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## Phillips (Feb 19, 2004)

Actually it was pretty clean when Joel and I were in there at 475. Nice way to start the year.




ChasetheWater said:


> Lots of new wood in Bailey.. I doesn't affect any of the rapids but just a good think to keep your eye out for. Looks like maybe a landslide or somethin.. But multiple trees down!


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## ChasetheWater (Apr 19, 2011)

I was there Today? but you dont have to believe me I guess


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## Theophilus (Mar 11, 2008)

Thanks for the heads up..


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

5/25 update

Denver water has the tunnel on low flow (55cfs) for work on valves they put in this winter. The work should be done this week sometime.

Once the work on the tunnel is done, Denver water will start filling up cheeseman reservoir. Filling cheeseman means reducing cheeseman outflow and compensating by increasing the tunnel. Cheeseman outflow will likely be ~100 cfs. The tunnel should be in the 200-300 cfs range depending on water needs. It will likely take 2-4 weeks for cheeseman to fill depending on runoff.


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## miker (Jan 26, 2006)

YES!


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## DanOrion (Jun 8, 2004)

Whooohooo!! Turn on the tunnel!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

5/25 update #2...

I forgot to ask denver water when they will make these changes to start filling cheeseman. They are starting today. 

Denver water is turning up the tunnel to 225 today. They cut back on cheeseman to 150. This should put about 275 in the river at bailey. 

Water demand will be variable over the weekend with some warm days and some potential for cooler wet weather too. Denver water could bump up the tunnel if demand goes up.

Keep an eye on the gauges and remember that they usually make changes in the AM around 9-10. 

Smart phones are making water talk almost obselete. For those (like me) without smart phones, calling up the grant gauge and the tunnel flow on watertalk can help with planning if you are on the road etc. South platte basin is basin #1, NFSP @ grant is code 41, roberts tunnel is 55. I usually call up the tunnel prior to putting on to make sure they didn't turn it off on me! Also its about 2-3 hours for the water to get from the tunnel to bailey, so you can put on and catch the bubble before flows drop out on you.

WaterTalk Station Codes


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

5/31 update

Denver water is holding the tunnel at about 135 cfs. Natural flow is about the same with the gauge at bailey showing 270 ish.

Denver water continues to keep cheeseman outflow low (currently 100) to fill cheeseman. I expect the hot weather this week to increase demand for water and cause tunnel flows to go up.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

6/1 update. Denver water turned up the tunnel to 180 cfs today, with about 330 in bailey. Metro water demand is ramping up with the hot weather, but its unclear how much more tunnel water they will need to bring over since natural runoff will increase as well. Odds are tunnel will hold at current flows or bump up over the next couple of days.


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## Hans (Aug 21, 2008)

cool info Ian.

was curious what was up with Otero Pumpstation over on the Ark, like why there?? ... but now i see the east side is pulling all the way from the frying pan. 0.0 is there a diversion canal above the #s & a small res below otero, as the only diversion i noticed is river right (I believe right above #4?) & i would think the pumpstation needed a steady water level/res for starting/operating the pumps.

USGS Colorado - Upper Arkansas River Basin

i think u mentioned moffit tunnel (but i can't find it again)... which the water would be taken out of the blue & diverted through moffit... then into SBC & into the reservoirs nw of denver.

it's all becoming clearer now. dang, whenever i'm on the west side I like to flush often so vegas & LA can have water, but I see i'm helping us out over here too! :-D


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## sbratt (May 10, 2006)

HANS, 
Moffet tunnel water comes out of the Frasier. I remember hearing that 90% of South Boulder ck flows are Frasier water.


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## Hans (Aug 21, 2008)

deepsouthpaddler said:


> 5/9 update...
> 
> Denver water is trying to fill cheeseman reservoir, thus the low flows out of cheeseman. There is a lot of snowpack in the blue river drainage, and *denver water is pulling from dillon throug the tunnel (and releasing into the blue) to drop dillon to prepare for runoff and deliver water to the front range.*



did I misinterpret to mean water out of the blue (below dillon) is moved to the east side or that they are just dumping out of dillon into the colorado r. basin to prepare for the snowpack above? or do they move water out of the blue, presumably to the fraiser, then into moffet, then to the east side? 

i do see the fraiser r. now, forgot about that. such a small drainage from roughly the pass on 40 to winter park from which to get water.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Hans, otero pump station doesn't impact roberts tunnel flows. Otero is operated by Aurora/CO springs. My understanding is that Otero pulls directly from the ark river. Here is some more info on otero etc.

USGS Colorado - Upper Arkansas River Basin

Moffat tunnel pulls from the frasier river basin around winter park and dumps into south boulder creek. Denver water uses this water, but I talk mainly to the guys that work with roberts tunnel, so I don't deal with the moffat system much. 

The colorado water systems are complicated, and you can learn a lot about them by spending some time on google looking at maps and descriptions.

Yes I do think you misinterpreted that water released from lake dillon into the blue goes to the east slope. Dillon was built by denver water (I think) as part of a deal to get blue river water to Denver. Denver does not have rights to all of the water, so some of it flows down the blue and eventually into the colorado. I think denver water operates dillon and sends the water downstream or into the tunnel as needed.

If you want to do some research on it... Look at denver waters internet pages that explain their system, look at the colorado big thompson project to explain what the bureau of reclamation does for diversions. Also look at the arkansas fryingpan project. These are the big players in west to east diversions. There are diversions on the poudre too.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

6/6 update...

Bailey is running on mostly natural flow with only about 100 coming out of the tunnel. No updates this week, I'm out of town.

Front range is cranking up. Have fun out there!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

6/13 update...

The north fork is flowing great right now (along with most of the state)! 

Denver water turned up the tunnel to 300 today, which should put about 650+ in the river at bailey. Denver water thinks tunnel flows will be in the 200-350 range for the rest of the week. 

The uncertainty in flows is mainly due to the weather / snowpack. Warm weather will keep demand for water up, but its unclear is natural runoff will accelerate meaning denver water has to pull less water from the tunnel. Either way, the north fork should see continued good flows through this week from a combo of natural flow and tunnel water.

So many options... so little time. Gotta love June!

Reminder... use the park put in at bailey and leave the landowners from the old put in alone.


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## glcasson21 (Apr 16, 2009)

Just a quick update on the new put in:

We bumped into a couple of the guys that were in charge of the new put in that we are using. They were extremely friendly and stoked to have us stopping in there and using their place. There is a sign now at the old put in stating that we will no longer be able to put in there after Oct. 1...however the bathrooms are finished and the new put in is really nice. They are going to be doing some more work to free up parking on the other side of the building (next to the bathrooms) and when that is complete, they will be asking us to only unload on the feed lot side and then park on the bathroom side. 

And by the way...Bailey is really fun right now!


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## DanOrion (Jun 8, 2004)

...and the culverts at the road are huge and have plenty of clearance at 615 cfs on the Bailey gage. Be heads up for a low wire and some low bridges at high flow above 4 falls.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

6/15 update...

The tunnel is currently at 350 cfs, and the north fork @ bailey is close to 700 cfs. Thats an awesome flow for the north fork!

Denver water plans to keep the tunnel at similar flows for the next couple of days, and most likely through the weekend. 

Denver water wants to fill up cheeseman reservoir, marston reservoir, and chatfield reservoir by July 1. To do this they are keeping the outflow of cheeseman low (around 100 cfs), so they have to bring is a fair bit of water on the north fork to supply metro demand and to deliver water to fill chatfield and marston (both down on the plains). 

Althought denver water is reluctant to make predictions further out, my take is that we will likely see solid flows on the north fork through June until they fill cheeseman. 

Of course everything in the state is running, so many folks opt to pass on bailey in favor of other runs with a shorter season. If you haven't seen bailey at 600+ its a great time. Come paddle it with me this saturday!

http://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/f12/bailey-sat-6-18-a-37576.html


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

6/17 update...

Denver water plans on keeping the tunnel at current flows of 350 cfs over the weekend. Bailey is at a great level right now. Everything was clear of significant wood today.

The NF @ grant is reading 560cfs, but the bailey gauge is reading 720 and was up in the 800's this morning. I think the bailey guage is reading high. Waterton was 850ish with 100 coming from deckers, so it shouldn't have been over 750 coming out of the north fork. I think the grant gauge is more accurate and would guess 100-150 cfs comes into bailey along the entire run.

I'm running bailey tomorrow... takeout at 11am. Check the trip planner if you want to go.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

6/20 update

Denver water turned down the tunnel to 250 cfs today (from 350). They may turn it down to 200 this afternoon or tomorrow depending on what the rain does to inflow into strontia. Still good flows for boating on the north fork.

Denver water still needs a week or so to fill cheeseman, so for the next week I would expect decent flows on the north fork. Rain in town has moderated demand, but demand should go back up later this week, and I would expect tunnel flows to go up too.

I noted this before, but I think the bailey gauge is reading high and the grant gauge is more accurate. Ran it this weekend and it didn't feel as high as the bailey gauge would suggest.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

6/23 update

Denver water has dropped the tunnel down to 100 cfs. Flows @ bailey are around 400ish. Denver water thinks flows will be between 0-100 cfs through the tunnel over the weekend. Cheesman is close to full and they are going to start ramping up cheeseman flows and keep the tunnel lower.

High water was fun while it lasted!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

7/8 update...

Denver water is planning on turning off the tunnel for the weekend. Lots of precipitation is limiting water needs from the tunnel. 10% chance they may keep it on for the weekend. Natural flow will probably keep around 300ish in the river. 

P.S. bailey fest is aug 13/14 this year... put it on the calendar!


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## johng (Apr 25, 2005)

Ian,

_Many thanks_ for these updates. On those lines, I gotta' say that I'm more comfortable on Bailey at 350 than 700, so I'll vote for a longer rather than 'bigger' season ...


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

7/21 update. Denver water has had the tunnel off for a while due to lots of rain. The rains have lowered demand for water on the plains, and have lowered demand in metro denver. The rains have also bumped up flow in the rivers, so the combo means that Denver keeps roberts tunnel off. 

Denver Water expects to not need to the tunnel for a while, at least until the afternoon storms go away for long enough to keep demand up.

Bailey Fest is coming soon... Aug 13/14. Hope to see you there.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

8/8 update...

Denver water is turning on the tunnel to 75 cfs today. Natural flow is about 100 cfs right now, so that should be about 175 cfs in the river as of today. Denver water thinks that they will likely make another bump up in tunnel flows in the next day or so. Might get up into the mid 200's for bone zone runs. They will likely set the final flows for Bailey Fest fri afternoon.

I am planning on doing a pre bailey fest friday run. There is a log in 4 falls that needs to come out prior to the fest and I could use some help getting it out. Hit me up if you want to do a friday run to help with wood. Flows will likely be low on friday prior to the final bump up in the tunnel. Bring the mank boat and help set up bailey fest!


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## danger (Oct 13, 2003)

hey ian, what time on friday? 

dan
303.949.1825


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## [email protected] (Apr 26, 2006)

I think I can rock a friday mank lap to pull the log out, I'm guessing early afternoon?


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Dan / Tom, probably sometime between noon and 2PM for a friday launch. Depends on how quickly I get all the gear I need to bring for the event, and also might depend on when denver water is turning up the tunnel. Should have a better idea as we get closer, but thats my best guess now. I'll get a firm time later this week.


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## cadster (May 1, 2005)

Flow jumped this afternoon. Going up at least to 275 CFS.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Yep... Denver water turned up the tunnel to 155. Hopefully they will keep it up through the week to allow for a friday pre-fest wood clearing run.


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## stubby (Oct 13, 2003)

Friday crew represent!!! Give me a shout on timing for Friday Ian, I should be able to make it.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

BAM! Up goes the tunnel. Denver water turned up the tunnel to 250 today (8/9). They think they will probably bump it up again tomorrow. 350 in the river today total, maybe 400 by friday.

Friday crew is shaping up. Pre-Fest run with a log removal mission in 4 falls. Thinking takeout at 2PM. Gotta run errands and drop a lot of crap off at the camp ground friday AM. 

If you want to rally with the friday crew, hit me up!

Also, folks will be camping friday night for anyone who wants to come up friday.

Ian
303-907-1373


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## miker (Jan 26, 2006)

Yeah! 

I will be up there after work on Friday. Let me know if you need me to pick up anything.

Mike
303 903 8934


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

8/15 Update...

Denver water turned the tunnel down to 250 cfs, meaning about 350 in the north fork @ bailey.

Denver water plans on turned the tunnel down through the week to 150-200 cfs. No word on exactly when they will make the next bumps down, could be a little bit every day.

Bailey Fest was awesome! Great weekend, see you all next year!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

8/17 update...

Denver Water turned down the tunnel to 175 cfs. Should be about 275 in the river at bailey. Denver water thinks that the tunnel will be in the 150-200 range in the near term (next week or so).


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

8/24 update...

Denver water turned up the tunnel to 275 cfs today. Flows current 330ish at the grant gauge. Nice late season flows on the north fork. 

No word on how long it will last. If we don't get rain, it should stay about where it is. NWS is forecasting potential for rain and wetter weather, and rain could lower demand and cause the tunnel to go down.

Get it while its good!

P.S. Respect the 4 falls landowners. Do not urinate on their property, or in visibility of them. There are bathrooms at the put in in town and at the takeout, please use them. Portage or scout 4 falls quickly and courteously. Move through as quickly and as safely possible. Keep boats out of the road on the side of the trail to allow the landonwer to pass by if they are there. If you see or meet the landowners, be respectful, courteous, and do your best to be good representative of the kayaking community. Don't argue regardless of the topic. Pick up trash if you see it and keep the place clean.

Also, please use the put in at McGraw park in the town of bailey. The rawhide / old farmers union folks have asked us not to use the driveway next to the culvert bridge that was the standard put in for several years. Please respect their wishes.

Good relationships with landowners is key to continued access to Bailey.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

8/30 update...

Denver water is holding the tunnel steady at 277 cfs. With continued hot weather and minimal rain in the forecast they expect to keep the tunnel at (or close to) current flows for the next couple of days and potentially through the weekend. I'll update thur or friday for weekend flows. Keep your fingers crossed.

Flows are 320 @ grant and 364 @ bailey... good late season flows.

Reminder... use the town put in, not the famers union / rawhide put in at the culvert bridge.

Also, respect the four falls landowners. Don't piss at four falls, especially not on land, or in front of landowners. Be courteous if you see the landowners. Move through 4 falls quickly and safely. Pick up trash. Keep your boats out of the road in case the landowner is driving through.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/1 update

Denver water is holding the tunnel steady at ~275 cfs (320 @ grant, 360 @ bailey). 

While dependent on demand, plans for the weekend are to keep the tunnel in the 275-300 cfs range over the weekend. Should be a nice labor day weekend for Bailey.

Enjoy!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

FYI, they just did measurements on the grant and bailey gauge. Grant was almost spot on, and bailey was reading high by about 30 cfs. Not a huge deal, but we paddled tuesday and agreed that flows were closer to the grant gauge than the bailey gauge. Tunnel hasn't changed, but bailey gauge is reading 335 instead of 365.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

8/3 update....

Denver water turned up the tunnel a hair today. Up from 275 to 291. My guess would be flows would stay up over the weekend, but check the gauges before you go to make sure.

Great happy boof-day run on friday!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Doh! Back to 275. They must have had a power trip and had to ramp back up. Still a good flow... Enjoy!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/6 update...

Talked to denver water this morning. They were just getting in from the long weekend, but thought that they would either keep flows constant or maybe go a little higher this afternoon. Looks like more late season flows for the north fork. Get it while its good!


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## stubby (Oct 13, 2003)

Yingchun5207 said:


> Once the work on the tunnel is done, Denver water will start filling up cheeseman reservoir. Filling cheeseman means reducing cheeseman outflow and compensating by increasing the tunnel. Cheeseman outflow will likely be ~100 cfs. The tunnel should be in the 200-300 cfs range depending on water needs. It will likely take 2-4 weeks for cheeseman to fill depending on runoff.Coach Bagscoach outletcoach factory outlet


Troll, get the F$#% off the buzz. I'm pretty sure no one here wants a Coach bag anyway...you're barking up the wrong tree.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/7 update...

Denver Water is turning down the tunnel to 225 cfs (from 275 cfs). Rain bumped up the flows a bit last night. Once the rain bump has passed through, I would expect flows in the north fork to be about 270 @ bailey. Getting boney! 

Denver Water is planning on lowering strontia reservoir by 10ft to help with dredging work that has been ongoing. To drop strontia (which is at the bottom of the waterton run), they are lowering tunnel flows to drop inflow into the reservoir. Should take then a week or two to drop the level. They may bail on the level drop and bump flows back up if someone in the system balks at dropping the reservoir level. Apparently lowering the level of strontia picks up different sediments and impacts taste quality of the water in Denver. It never ceases to amaze me how many variables go into the Denver Water Operation.

For the long term outlook... the tunnel will be shut down all winter starting in november for maintenance work. Because of that, Denver Water wants to keep Cheeseman more full than normal, and plans to pull more water from the tunnel through the fall. Whether or not that means boatable flows depends on demand, but I'm keeping my fingers crossed for some fall bailey days.


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## adgeiser (May 26, 2009)

Ian, an guess as to wheather the tunnel shut down will mean november boating on 11 mile?


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

RE: tunnel shutdown and nov boating on elevenmile....

Highly unlikely. Water demand during winter is much lower than the spring/summer/fall. They typically turn the tunnel off in the winter anyway. The issue here is that they know they can not deliver any water through the tunnel all winter, so they want to be prepared with extra water in cheeseman, so its essentially extra contingency planning.

Primary water deliveries for denver water in the winter will be cheeseman reservoir and there will likely be minimal flows between elevenmile and cheeseman to keep the fisheries healthly.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/8 update...

Denver water is turning the tunnel down today. The Denver Water contact wasn't sure how low the flow was going to get but quoted me 125-175 out of the tunnel. Tunnel is at 150 now on the interner gauge. Rain yesterday dropped demand way down, thus the tunnel cut back.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/10... 

Looks like denver water turned up the tunnel today. Tunnel currently about 300... She's back in the zone. Have fun!

Had a great day on gore yesterday... love having bailey and gore... great combo of runs to have late season.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/12 update...

Denver water is keeping the tunnel steady at 300 cfs today. Odds are they will keep the tunnel up tomorrow as well. Good late season flows on the north fork!

Denver Water punted on lowering strontia due to equipment problems, and they turned the highline canal on... both of those together bumped up flows.

If they figure out the strontia lowering they could drop flows down again. There is also a weather system coming on wed/thur with a chance of precip. My guess is mon/tue would be the best bets this week for good flows.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/13 update...

Just got off the phone with Denver water...

The bad news: my request for 600 cfs was denied.

The good news: They bumped the tunnel to 320 cfs yesterday, and they don't think that they will drop it today... may go up a bit... still working the numbers, but will make a decision later today.

Great late season flows!

Also... pissing on things may be funny for a sticker for ******** with big trucks, but pissing on land near four falls is not funny to the landowners. Don't do it!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)




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## adgeiser (May 26, 2009)

Can we get that as a sticker?


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

No stickers... 

Tattoo only.

I'll get a tattoo artist out for bailey fest next year.


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## bobbuilds (May 12, 2007)

when were you asking for 600cfs and why? just curious.


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## Nathan (Aug 7, 2004)

Why not?


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## adgeiser (May 26, 2009)

That might be the onlything that could make bailey fest better. Reduced rates for the ink of course.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

bobbuilds said:


> when were you asking for 600cfs and why? just curious.


Its a joke. Thought I would lighten up the standard update.

I do make a habit of letting denver water know that the more water the better for kayakers and I let them know what flows are good for us. Every once in a while I'll jokingly ask for 600 cfs for my birthday or something like that, they laugh, and say no way.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/14 update...

Denver Water dropped the tunnel today by about 100 cfs down to ~220 cfs. Probaly means about 250-260 in bailey? Demand dropped due to rain, thus the tunnel dropped.

Rain and cooler weathe is in the forecast for the next to days. Flows are likely to drop, but Denver Water isn't sure.

Got a great after work run in on bailey last night. Huge rainbow at the takeout when we were setting shuttle. The poison ivy along trashcan was brillaint red, and the bushes are just starting to turn yellow in a few places. Routing from first falls to supermax with my go to bailey after work partner with big smiles, few words, fun eddies and high speeds was a real treat.

Also, the new put in parking lot in Bailey is in service. Its just to the left fo the ATF liquor store. Its got ample parking, but park along the fence to the left and don't block the gate to the water treating plant. The bathrooms are nice for a put in... flush toilets, running water. You can walk over the small footbridge and into the little park to put on just upstream. All in all, its a big improvement in the put in vs. the little 3-4 car spot in the driveway that we used to use. Big thanks for the folks who put all this together.

P.S. Please don't use the old put in anymore. They don't want us to park there, so use the put in at Bailey instead.


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## bobbuilds (May 12, 2007)

thanks, I am just getting used to 350-400 in there. was hoping i did not have to step it up just yet. really digging the high3's


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## krakeld (Jun 8, 2008)

*releases*

do you think there'll be some releases later in the fall for foxton?

and, how is the lower foxton run, from the road down to the confluence, in the 280's where it is now? at 400 it was fairly boney....i thought anyway.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

Future releases are uncertain. Hard to say. There have been years when the tunnel flowed consistently below min flows and we didn't get late season runs. There have also been a handful of times when a late season bump in the tunnel gets flows above 300. I've run bailey in october and november, so it just depends on the weather and demand. 

Foxton at 280 is below my min, but your mileage may vary.


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## DanOrion (Jun 8, 2004)

krakeld said:


> do you think there'll be some releases later in the fall for foxton?
> 
> and, how is the lower foxton run, from the road down to the confluence, in the 280's where it is now? at 400 it was fairly boney....i thought anyway.


Having run Foxton far more than I care to admit, I can say it still floats boat down to about 220. 
<220 - not worth it
220 - 300 terribly boney
300 - 350 very boney
350 - 450 still boney
450 - 600 starting to be less boney, but still hitting rocks
>600 super fun play boating
>700 really super fun (great v-shaped surf waves around every bend)
>800 gimmie some more! (surf waves faster)
>900 ??? Always wondered how much more fun


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## KSC (Oct 22, 2003)

I cut my class III teeth at Foxton. It's low but doable in the low 200s. Don't go all the way to the confluence though - past the standard takeout would be way low. Boulder garden to that standard pullout takeout would be the run to do - or else drive down to Waterton and just do laps on that (probably better option).


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## cayo 2 (Apr 20, 2007)

280 is pretty low,what KSC said.

750/800 is maybe the best level , 970 is not really any harder /better - on middle and lower anyway - a little pushier with bigger waves/holes, but some stuff washes out. 550/600 is when it starts getting good on all parts of it.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/15 update...

Denver water cut back the tunnel by about 25 cfs down to 200 cfs. Bone zone! The basin had a lot of rain last night and demand has dropped. No word on what flows will be for the weekend. Warmer weather over the weekend could bump up demand, but denver water could also keep low flows through the weekend.

Best bet is to check the gauges around 9-10am if you want to run bailey and see if there is a bump. It takes a couple of hours for a bump in flows to get from teh tunnel to bailey. If they turn up the tunnel at 9am and you put on after noon, you will probably get the increased flows.

The good news is that gore is still at great late season levels...


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/19 update...

Denver water cut back the tunnel today to ~150 cfs. Rain over the weekend lowered demand.

No word for what flows will do later in the week.

I'm out of the country through the end of the week, so no updates til I get back in town.


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## ednaout (Jun 3, 2005)

Hope you had safe travels Ian, any word on Bailey would be great, when you have a chance. I would love to try to get a Tuesday morning run in, if its on!

B


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/26 update...

Denver water is planning on keeping the tunnel at current flows of ~150 for the rest of this week. They are keeping tunnel flows below 200 cfs for the rawhide flyfishing folks that are doing instream work on the river channel. 

FYI, the rawhide folks also built the new put in complete with running water, flush toilets and a parking lot that can hold lots of cars. Thanks for the good work guys!

Earliest the tunnel could potentially go back up will be Oct 1. They have to shut down in river work in october due to brown trout spawning regs from the DOW.

October flows are pretty fickle on the north fork. Its not unheard of to get a few days of 300+, but its typically the time that water demand drops and cold weather set in. Hoping for another good day before she's done for the season.


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## ednaout (Jun 3, 2005)

Thanks, guess I'll just keep an eye on the gauge and my fingers crossed!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

9/30 update...

Denver water plans on turning up the tunnel by 100 cfs to 250 cfs tomorrow morning (Oct 1). This should put about 280 cfs in the river @ bailey. Low, but good to go in my book. 

Denver water has been keeping the water from the tunnel low recently to allow for some in river work by the fisherman at the bailey put in. Work has to stop Oct 1, thus they are turning up the tunnel tomorrow and plan to ramp cheeseman outflow down to about 100cfs.

They plan to be around 250 cfs out of the tunnel for the weekend.

Enjoy the fall boating and great weather!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

10/3 update...

Denver Water is holding the tunnel steady at ~250 cfs. 290 cfs in the river at Bailey. With warm weather predicted this week, Denver Water thinks flows will hold close to this for the next several days. 

Go get some October bone zone!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

10/5 update...

Denver water is planning on holding the tunnel steady at 250 cfs today, with ~ 300 cfs in the river @ bailey. They plan on holding cheeseman outflow at ~ 100 cfs through the end of the week, so changes in demand will be the variable that changes tunnel flows in the near term.

Cooler weather is predicted for the metro area on friday, with rain predicted on sat. Denver thinks they will turn down the tunnel as soon as demand goes down with the cooler/wet weather. My guess is that flows hold at 250 for today and thursday. Friday is iffy. They may opt to drop it down a bit in anticipation of lower demand on the weekend, or they may wait until the weekend to drop flows after the rain.

As always check the gauges prior to heading out. A good tip is that Denver Water typically changes flows in around 10ish (9-11 window), and maybe a bit earlier on the weekend. If you see flows at a boatable level the day before you want to paddle, and you are concerned about flows dropping, try and get on the water before the flows drop. Also note that it takes 2-3 hrs for a change in flows to go from the tunnel outlet to the bailey put in. I'd shoot to put on around 9-10ish to stay ahead of changes if you try to get out, or alternately to wait until later in the day to check the gauges to make sure flows have held.


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

10/6 update...

Denver water is holding the tunnel steady at 250 cfs. Flows in the river @ bailey are in the 290's. 

Denver water expects to have to turn the tunnel down after the cool weather and rain forecast to hit the area materialize. No word on exactly which day they will cut it. Might be friday, more likely to be sat/sun though. Keep your eyes on the gauge.

Enjoy the fall flows!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

10/10 update...

Denver water turned the tunnel down to 125 cfs today from 150 cfs. Denver Water plans on holding cheeseman outflow constant at 100 cfs and using the tunnel to meet changes in demand. This time of year is highly variable for water demand. One one side of the coin, this weekend's first snow likely has lots of people turning off sprinklers and blowing them out for the season. On the other hand, a solid week of relatively warm and sunny weather could increase demand. Denver Water doesn't know which way it will go...

Keep an eye on the gauges...

Great fall boating on the north fork this past friday. Love the fall color boofing!


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## deepsouthpaddler (Apr 14, 2004)

10/13 update...

Denver water is keeping the tunnel steady at 125 cfs. Demand has been fairly constant, and denver water isn't expecting any big changes.

The good news is that gore is still running at great flows for october!


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## bobbuilds (May 12, 2007)

you got me... I was hoping for a bump.

back to gore.


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