# Snowmobile for ski access?



## Dave Frank

I know enough about sleds to know that one will do ok on trails, but not go up anything steep or through any real powder. Look for 7-800 to be able to go off piste. Also look for longer track and deeper paddles.

Oh yeah, if you get one you will no longer be able to call yourself a conservationist.


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## tacocat

go bigger


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## crane

as it was explained to me by a "sled head" today.
long track good for climbing
short track good for jumps
wide track stable for climbs and straight aways
narrow track for lots o turns
engine size based on rider weight and towing capacity
600 is fine for 1 rider at 175# in the BC
bigger if you are towing skiers/ boarders

hope that helps


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## ZGjethro

I have owned an Arctic cat 580 and presently a Polaris RMK 800, both of which are one person powder sleds. If you are looking for a sled to tow skiers up roads, a touring or work sled would probably work better due to lower gearing (less belt wear). they sink like an anchor in Colorado sugar snow though. If you are looking for a sled to tow off packed surfaces, you will need a powder sled with deep paddles and a long track (144 or longer). 700 triple or 800 double as minimum. Are you looking for a sled for touring access or yo-yo skiing? 
As Dave noted, you can't wave the self righteous environmental flag any more, but your friends who do will be happy to be towed. I love my sled as it gets me ten miles from the hordes where I can tour in total solitude or with a friend or two. invest or build a good ski rack. Good ideas can be had at Wildsnow.com under snowmobiles.


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## threepin

crane said:


> as it was explained to me by a "sled head" today.
> long track good for climbing
> short track good for jumps
> wide track stable for climbs and straight aways
> narrow track for lots o turns
> engine size based on rider weight and towing capacity
> 600 is fine for 1 rider at 175# in the BC
> bigger if you are towing skiers/ boarders
> 
> hope that helps


I bet you heard this from Jack? Good advice.


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## ntibbs

Thanks for all the help guys,

I've never thought of myself as self rightous, I work as a conservationist for the usfs, using atvs to control weeds, and snowmobiles to go deep in the woods to track wildlife on skis on timber sales in our beetle kill forest. Not waving a flag here. 

just wanted advise, not judgement.

I'll be using the sled to access ski terrain off a groomed snowmobile system and packed snowmobile trails. I've never owned a sled, just want to be sure what I'm getting into.


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## Dave Frank

Sorry if you thought I was flaming you for wanting one. I'd have one if I could afford it. I just saw the conservationist thing in your profile and figured I'd mention it.


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## ZGjethro

ntibbs, I did not mean to imply you were self righteous. I just experience a lot of that as I slowly pass people going up snow covered roads. It does not seem to matter how slow I go or how much room I give people, they often let me know i'm not welcome on "their" road. Just be prepared for similar judgements from those doing human powered activities . As for sleds, there are some great 4 stroke sleds out there also, but since they are newer, they tend to be more expensive if you are looking for a used sled.


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## danimal

i have owned that sled... we used to guide on them.. they are work horses and you can beat the crap out of them and they still work.. With some mods they can be awesome ski sleds. Id suggest fat skis and a 2 inch paddle track. Dont expect to break trail on a super deep day, but for hauling gear and people on a somewhat packed trail they will get it done...dont get me wrong they are not ideal but they don't overheat and they are solid running machines. I have one that needs some love ill sell it cheap. If money is no object and you just want to ski with it get a wide track.


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## Jahve

How much money do you have to spend? I got a 08 m1000 for sale that pulls well..

I would look into at least a 600 liquid cooled machine from about 99' and up - 01 and up would be better. 144" track or longer would be best... I ride a 153" x 2 1/4 in track and it pulls just fine. Some of the super long tracks these days are overkill.. 

That 550 is a fan cooled machine and a liquid cooled machine will run much better for a skiing application... With that said the 550 will get you up a groomed or packed trail..

Also stay away from tripples.. The RMK's are not a bad machine. I like cats and the efi from 01 up.. Super simple they start on the 2nd or 3rd pull everytime. Cat started the with the m7 in 05 and that is a great start up machine that can be found for about $3500..

If the sled is super cheap buy her and if or when you want to upgrade you will have a 2nd sled for a friend...


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## danimal

550 killing it.


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## ZGjethro

is the 550 an older two stroke or a newer four stroke? I have a friend who was given an older arctic cat 440 long track fan cooled sled. It is geared low enough (work sled) to tow two up paved road grade and it never overheats on frozen slush roads in the springtime, unlike liquid cooled sleds. It is no fun though if you want to play.
Sometimes a cheap used sled seems to fit the bill, but be wary of buying someone else's headache


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## RDrangstveit

Last year we bought a Mountain Cat 900 159" track, and a Mountain Cat 800 for skiing. It was still difficult to pull skiers once you got off the packed trail. Its eaiser if you ride double where one person stands on each side of the sled. I would get at least a 700 with a 2" track, bigger the better though. Buy something that you will enjoy riding!!!! Eventually you will realize thats its more fun to ride the snowmobile than it is to ski. I used to ski almost everyday until we got the sleds. This year we bought an M1000 and M8, I haven't thought about skiing since.


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## ZGjethro

RDrangstveit said:


> Last year we bought a Mountain Cat 900 159" track, and a Mountain Cat 800 for skiing. It was still difficult to pull skiers once you got off the packed trail. Its eaiser if you ride double where one person stands on each side of the sled. I would get at least a 700 with a 2" track, bigger the better though. Buy something that you will enjoy riding!!!! Eventually you will realize thats its more fun to ride the snowmobile than it is to ski. I used to ski almost everyday until we got the sleds. This year we bought an M1000 and M8, I haven't thought about skiing since.


I have to second what he said. Ten years ago I bought a 1997 used xr400 dirtbike for late season access to dirt roads for ski touring (late spring) Ten years later dirt bikes are my main summer sport. From a thrill aspect, the dirt bike surpasses the mtn bike and it is way more physical!


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## Jahve

I have had my years where I snowmachine more and years where I snowmoboard more... Last year I rode my board just about every time that I went out. Maybe due to the depths and never ending new lines that are covered only once a decade or so..

On my first sled we (3) of us went in and got one together.. A cat and a tough ass cat. Still have her - we beat the hell out of that sled. Many days we would 2up the sled and pull a skiier!! She has now had 6 different owners and pulled skiiers for over 7500 miles. I just got a new engine for her and she will be back on the snow for my slack ass friends who do not have a ride..... Your first sled is just that and as you dont need a top end play boat to learn to kayak in you dont need a top end sled to start to get the idea of what you are gettin into....

Have to disagree about the liquid sleds vs fan sleds. If you know what you are doing or buy a set of ice scratchers and a liquid should never overheat. LQ sleds will put 30% more ponies to the snow (a 500 lq will pull harder than a 600 fan) and as we all know on a sled in the BC you can not have too many ponies!!!

I also had a 159" cat stand up 900 for a season. That sled pulls hard and ran well for me.. You are goin to love the m8 and m10... I have both and love the MG but spend plenty of days on my m8... One of these two I feel are the best sleds avalilable for the west and the way I ride..

Yea pullin is not the way to go unless you have huge sleds and a packed trail. The best way I have found is to 2-up with someone who knows how to ride then they jump off just before you have to make your trun in a high mark.. Then starts that hike and the billy goatin......


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## ZGjethro

RDNEK I agree with all of your post. I did not want to get into ice scratchers and other cooling and track lube issues with a newbie rider. My RMK overheated and would melt the track to the hifax before I put on scratchers. I still have to watch the temps on long hauls in the spring of frozen roads. My old 580 arctic cat never once overheated. I would smoke belts, but that was because of the misuse of a small single person sled pulling several friends (cheapskates who wouldn't cough up a grand for their own sleds).


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## ntibbs

great info, thanks guys

do you think that a polaris 600 touring sled is noticably more powerfull that a 550 (both air cooled)? Of course I would love something bigger, but money is a factor, as well as not knowing what the hell I'm doing ha,ha.


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## Faucet Butt

*2 vs 3 cylinder sleds?*

I've got a question to piggy back off this thread. Does anyone know how 2 and 3 cylinder sleds compare reliability wise? Any experience with the polaris xlt 600 touring vs their 550 touring - power, reliability?- used for 2 to 3 people to access ski terrain off a maintained trail system.


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## Jahve

I would stay away from any 3 cylinder sleds.. Like the cat trippples of the late 90's.. You dont want a tripple..

Also stay away from the mid 00's polaris rmk's they had their share of problems and I would not buy a 900 rmk of any year. They will blow a crank inside of 1400 or so miles.

You gotta get what you got the $ for but I would look into 00-03 Polaris Rmk's 600 or 700 liquid. These do have trailing arms and if you hit a rock hard you damage the foot cup and the tunnel - big long expensive fix - good runners but trailing arms are just not needed.

The best sleds IMO are 01 - 04 Mtn cat 600 or 800 liquid. Or 05 and up M sleds.. The m7 and m8 are great sleds a bit more but worth it IMO. 

Skidooers in the early 02 - 05 (rev 800's) also seem to have a problem blowin up pistons about every 1500 - 2000 miles I believe it is the pto side every time.... 

The cat m series and motors/driveline are tested and now 5 years old. If it were my $ I would go with a arctic cat mtn or M sled. AT LEAST 600cc and 800 would be better... Any older than 01 and you are lookin at a sled that will need a bit more love and is not designed to work in the hills and elevations that we run at around here.

Just my opinions and like I said I am a cat guy...


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## pinetree

If you use a sled, is it backcountry anymore?


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## smittyvwbus

Oh it's backcountry...but let's not get into that pissing match.

Anyway good info from RDnek...a bit Cat biased but hey he said he's a cat guy. 

The Yamaha triples are strong sleds and bulletproof, but as said before I would shy away from the Cat triples?? 

Also if you haven't ridden that much those 1M chassis cats (Early 2000's) Mtn Cats are big and heavy and cumbersome in my opinion..and I have quite a bit of seat time on an 02, 800. I think the Ski-Doo ZX chassis sleds of the same era have a much lighter feel and are priced similarly. 

But as RDNEK said if you can afford it an M-sled would be good and it's really hard to beat the fun factor of a Rev. 

Good luck with your decision and see ya out there


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## Jahve

pinetree said:


> If you use a sled, is it backcountry anymore?


Nope... 

The only way it counts as BC is if you load up your dreads in a sticker covered subaru (make sure you have the - if it was easy it would be called snowboarding sticker), then drive at least 60 miles to the trailhead, use pachuli wax for your tele's, and make sure you are draggin 5 barkin dogs up the trail... Only then can you know what the BC is about!!! 

Pine no need to hijack this thread - start your own if you want to hate on snowmachines...


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## Jahve

Smitty has some good info.. Sorry I did not think about the trippples from yamie. I had a friend that had a 700 and it did run well. With all the turbos on the 4strokes from yamie that is what I think of now days when I think of yammie.. The main reason I dont like tripples is just the extra parts that can go wrong. One more piston, ring, rod, rings, jug, and the rest is just one more thing that can break. The performance on some of the tripples that were running well was cool to see.

In the years from 99 - 03 or so any of the larger polaris, skidoo, or cat sleds will get you up on the hill and as anyone gets into performance a move to the M or Rev / xp will up the fun factor... The skidoos from that older era were great runners but I dont have a lot of seat time on one. The new polaris sleds are great but in the early to mid 00's skidoo and cat were makin better mtn sleds.... 

I also would stay away from a sled with a bunch of mods.. Unless you like to tinker with the sled a lot... The closer your first sled it to stock the better it will run day in and day out. Now when you have owned a few you may want to mess with some things but I would stay away from a way mod used sled...


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## ntibbs

ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,


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## ManuelHung

Where is the best sled access skiing in CO?


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## ZGjethro

Not anywhere near Aspen where access is being shut down right and left! Anyone with any interest in motorized access needs to make comments on the White river national forest management plan before Jan 6?


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## backcountry-jibber

*Love to use snowmobiles to acess backcountry!*

I love to use snowmobiles to access the backcoountry. They can take you to areas 20 miles away from pavement that is not really accessable except with a helicopter.

My favorites have been the skidoo REv and REV XP. I do have friends that ride M7 and M8 sleds and they have been great too. I would definitely go with a mountain sled rather than a touring if you plan to get off the hardpack.


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## ntibbs

Hey everybody!

We bought a polaris 550 touring sled all set up with ski tubes and tow ropes. Found a really good deal on one and it runs great! would have loved to buy a bigger one that's better in the powder, but you get what you can afford.

This has been one of the most fun posts I've been involved with, thanks for all your help and humor. 

We have a saying around these parts, "patchouli is not a soap"

See ya out there!!


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## caseybailey

RDNEK said:


> Nope...
> 
> The only way it counts as BC is if you load up your dreads in a sticker covered subaru (make sure you have the - if it was easy it would be called snowboarding sticker), then drive at least 60 miles to the trailhead, use pachuli wax for your tele's, and make sure you are draggin 5 barkin dogs up the trail... Only then can you know what the BC is about!!!
> 
> Pine no need to hijack this thread - start your own if you want to hate on snowmachines...


 So is this hijacking a hijack? Am I hijacking a hijack's hijack? I'm so glad we have people to tell us what ethical internet use. RDNek...thanks for being big brother. What we need is more people telling us how to act.


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## ZGjethro

caseybailey said:


> So is this hijacking a hijack? Am I hijacking a hijack's hijack? I'm so glad we have people to tell us what ethical internet use. RDNek...thanks for being big brother. What we need is more people telling us how to act.


Casey, I have to back RDNEK on this one. The thread was about which sled would work for a given usage. It had nothing to do with someone else's opinion of whether or not it should be "correct". If you want to dis sled usage, feel free to start your own thread. On this site, which is read very often by environmentally aware people, any moto topic seems to degrade into an argument about people's opinions on motor usage. Its called a hijacking since someone steers it away from the intended path and it is not cool. It may be fun to read written sparring, but is is also a waste of time for readers who want to get info or contribute a meaningful opinion. Sometimes a good natured jest is welcomed though. Just my 2 cents.


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## bradnoble

Get a ski doo skandic wide track with a Powderack. Check out powderack.com, great ski/snowboard racks for trail sleds.......


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## lovemypow

I have two 1996 Arctic Cat trail sleds that I bought at an auction a couple of years ago. Just came down from Vail Pass where we had some fun freshies all morning. Stock trail tread sucks for snomo skiing, am changing out to 2" paddles and 1.75" deep tread on one sled since I could find it used on Craig's list. It is a learning curve, but a fun way to get around the backcountry, and yes, you will get sneers at best from holier than though types who judge you by your sled. Oh well, the turns are sweet. 

I attached 6" PVC pipe to drop the skis into on the side of the sled and designed a steel cage for the back of the sleds to stow packs when riding in/out. Had metalwork done for $75/sled by a guy who does steel fabricating, then use straps to hold skis in place against the side of the cages, with tails of skis in PVC so that they angle up at 45 degrees.


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## ZGjethro

Brad, I was checking out skandics online and they look pretty good for tow in access. I was put off by the low horsepower numbers though. I think it was 67 hp for the 800 four stroke. Could it be that low and does yours seem to have enough power to double up riders and pull two?


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## Jahve

Also for super sick new ski sled look at a cat bearcat z1 four stroke turbo w/156" x 16" track... It would be sick and run for 10k miles.

If you are lookin for a sled here is mine for sale $6500 cash.. 

Firm cash... Will take home this pup. She will get you where you want to go.. m1ooo, just enough mods to make her rip, 1500 miles or so, and runnin great. I just started to ride my new one so this guy has to go!


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