# FYI Rangers on Trough Road



## mr. compassionate (Jan 13, 2006)

Just an FYI that instead of patrolling the river as they should a ranger gave us a lame $80 ticket for helping a couple people on a shuttle. Apparently against the law to have people in a trailer or on raft on trailer for the shuttle.

Legal to ride in the back of pickup but not trailer. Pretty lame, the rangers should be patrolling the shitshow on the river and educating people in tubes to wear PFD's.

SHAME ON YOUR RANGERS!


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## PhilipJFry (Apr 1, 2013)

its against the law to haul somebody in a camp trailer too. (but it's okay in the back of a motor home) I agree that it's a little stupid, but it's spelled out clearly in most DMV handbooks. it's a risk, and risks have a cost. (it appears as though this time the cost was $80) I hope the shuttled folks helped in that cost considering they accepted the risk.


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## mr. compassionate (Jan 13, 2006)

PhilipJFry said:


> its against the law to haul somebody in a camp trailer too. (but it's okay in the back of a motor home) I agree that it's a little stupid, but it's spelled out clearly in most DMV handbooks. it's a risk, and risks have a cost. (it appears as though this time the cost was $80) I hope the shuttled folks helped in that cost considering they accepted the risk.


 
Point being, they should focus enforcement where it matters. Typical of law enforcement it's all about generating revenue vs. serve and protect. Warning would have been plenty sufficient.

And no, we told the people to ride there, they offered to help and we said no.


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## MTHC3 (Oct 25, 2009)

what River were you on ? and where did this happen?


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## PhilipJFry (Apr 1, 2013)

hauling somebody in a trailer, you run the risk of hitting a bump and knocking them out, they then get hurt, it's a safety issue. 

Drunk driving, they're not hurting anybody... until they do. not as safety issue until it is. 

Both get the same attention from cops because of what could happen. $80 fine sounds way better than the crap you would have to go through for a DUI. 

You made a bad decision, and you're sore that you got fined. But would you want somebody driving drunk to just get a warning, because they were driving somebody home and doing them a favor? And other people are being stupid on the river.. so they should pay attention to them instead?


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## mr. compassionate (Jan 13, 2006)

PhilipJFry said:


> hauling somebody in a trailer, you run the risk of hitting a bump and knocking them out, they then get hurt, it's a safety issue.
> 
> Drunk driving, they're not hurting anybody... until they do. not as safety issue until it is.
> 
> ...


 
I guess my Libertarian views differ from your left wing nanny state. I will be responsible if I hurt someone. Obviously driving a lot slower with people in the raft who were hunkered down rather than sitting on the edge. NO WAY IN HELL could they have been bumped out! 

Warning would have been plenty sufficient and again they should be educating people at the put in.


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## PhilipJFry (Apr 1, 2013)

*ha ha* thanks for the laugh. I'm far from left. And idaho is waaaay right of Colorado. 

But face it dude, you fucked up. Smoke your weed, drive drunk, speed.. do all sorts of stupid shit. just be ready for the consequences. 
consider the $80 a deterrent along with warning. *boo hoo* 

but I agree, it would be nice if they were on the river doing their job too. Fine the non PFD wearing tubers, instead of giving them warnings. *ha ha*

your thinking sounds more left (whaaa give me a warning, I don't want a fine.. I want the medal even though we got last place!)


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## mr. compassionate (Jan 13, 2006)

MTHC3 said:


> what River were you on ? and where did this happen?


Pumphouse to Ranch Del Rio Upper C


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## Sherpa9543 (Jul 22, 2014)

Mr. Compassionate. Yes the shitshow is on the river true, but access to said river is on trough road. The shitshow doesn't magically disappear on the boat ramp. 


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## Livingston (Jan 8, 2004)

Trailers are not a safe place to ride. Hitches fail and sometimes the hitch comes off the ball. Lots of home made stuff out there that isn't inspected. There is a good reason for that law. Don't be a snowflake, just own up to your mistake.
-d


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## mr. compassionate (Jan 13, 2006)

Livingston said:


> Trailers are not a safe place to ride. Hitches fail and sometimes the hitch comes off the ball. Lots of home made stuff out there that isn't inspected. There is a good reason for that law. Don't be a snowflake, just own up to your mistake.
> -d


 
Back of pickups aren't safe either so one is legal the other isn't. Just a warning here trying to save others $80-fucknuts.


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## MTHC3 (Oct 25, 2009)

Iam glad the river rangers are out there for people like you. pay your fine and stop wining on the internet.


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## carvedog (May 11, 2005)

mr. compassionate said:


> I guess my Libertarian views differ from your left wing nanny state.


Please stop with the name calling and trying to make people fit in boxes that you want to contain them with the name calling - this isn't The Eddy. 

Sorry you got popped. I know a river guide who died in an unfortunate trailer incident. If people didn't do stupid shit then they wouldn't make stupid laws. 

I am a Libertarian too, even more so these days, but that doesn't mean NO laws.


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## Livingston (Jan 8, 2004)

Truck beds are usually bolted or welded to the rest of the truck, therefor safer. Perhaps you should petition for a stiffer law on truck bed passengers?
-d


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## yesimapirate (Oct 18, 2010)

Mr. Compassionate, what did you expect to accomplish by starting this thread? You were in the wrong and wanted to publicly complain that you were in the wrong? I get pissed at cops when I've gotten speeding tickets, but I'm not going out on public forums and saying cops are the devil for giving them to me for doing something that's illegal. It does no good to say the rangers should only be patrolling rivers. It's a mute point. You did something illegal. They enforce illegal activities. You're in the wrong.

I can't believe I'm defending a law enforcement dept, but this was presented in a way that makes you seem like my 3 yr old crying about not getting candy when he hasn't eaten dinner. Don't bad mouth the rangers for something they're paid to do.


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## Managan (Mar 9, 2015)

There was an accident on Saturday afternoon where a passenger in the back of a pick up fell out and cracked his head open. It happened right at the Radium turn off. May have been why the Rangers wee on point.


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## trevko (Jul 7, 2008)

carvedog said:


> Please stop with the name calling and trying to make people fit in boxes that you want to contain them with the name calling - this isn't The Eddy.
> 
> Sorry you got popped. I know a river guide who died in an unfortunate trailer incident. If people didn't do stupid shit then they wouldn't make stupid laws.
> 
> I am a Libertarian too, even more so these days, but that doesn't mean NO laws.


No shit! You go into tired and lame stereotypes and name calling as soon as somebody disagrees. 

Yes, it could have been handled differently, particularly since you were helping someone out. Maybe the ranger had to deal with the clean up from an accident where someone was riding in a trailer, maybe they needed some loving and didn't get it, maybe they are just an ass. All this is lost by your reaction to someone who has a different point of view....


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## Andy H. (Oct 13, 2003)

mr. compassionate said:


> Obviously driving a lot slower with people in the raft who were hunkered down rather than sitting on the edge. NO WAY IN HELL could they have been bumped out!


Let me get this straight, you were driving with people sitting in the raft on the trailer going down the Trough Road for a stretch of 5 or 10 miles. And you didn't think it was dangerous or that you'd get a ticket if a LEO saw you?

But you'd be willing to take responsibility IF something had happened and you'd killed one of them...

Ok...


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## paulster (May 27, 2011)

At the risk of getting political: I can relate to the irritation of trying to do someone a favor and getting a ticket for it, but the whole concept of picking and choosing which laws we follow and letting others do the same seems pretty problematic. That is what stops me from embracing fundamental libertarian doctrine. 

It could just as easily have been the river ranger busting you on the river for dumping your ashes in the river. Is that a sensible rule and should it apply to you? Does that infringe on your freedom? I've wondered about that.


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## yesimapirate (Oct 18, 2010)

So, now we're bozos? http://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/f42/lost-stolen-blue-sawyer-oar-rancho-82482.html#post601818

If I can piece the 2 threads together, you went to yarmonyfest with hundreds of other people. Then you lugged some back to your campsite in your trailered boat where a ranger then gave you a ticket. I have even less sympathy if that's how things played out. On top of the above news of a fatality, the rangers were having to deal with the mess of a river fest and it's overflow on to mountain roads. Of course they're gonna stop you. They're trying to keep the debauchery to a minimum. Common sense would've told me not do something that might draw negative attention in that scenario.

Sorry you lost an oar, but not sorry you got the ticket.

edit - not fatality. head cracking.


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## Lebowski (Aug 19, 2015)

The irony is thick in this thread...


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## quinoa (Jul 5, 2009)

You need to show the Rangers some respect, and maybe they'd send a little your way. A Ranger enforcing a law when they see someone doing a bozo move is not lame. Just the opposite actually. Their job is not always easy or fun. You only need to scrape someone's brain off the road, or pull somebody's bloated corpse from the river one time to get a little perturbed when you witness irresponsible behavior. 


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## caverdan (Aug 27, 2004)

mr. compassionate said:


> Apparently against the law to have people in a trailer or on raft on trailer for the shuttle.
> 
> 
> 
> SHAME ON YOUR RANGERS!


Don't let them pesky rangers tell you what to do!  You have to be smarter than them......charge more for shuttle. :mrgreen:


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## dafewillis (Jun 21, 2014)

Can't add anything to this thread that hasn't already been said, nor do I want to get into a political discussion. But I WOULD like to at least thank the original poster for the heads-up. However misguided his anger might've been, I was unaware of this law and I've shuttled hapless tubers this way once before. Now that I know there are consequences, I'll never do it again.


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## bystander (Jul 3, 2014)

mr. compassionate said:


> Back of pickups aren't safe either so one is legal the other isn't. Just a warning here trying to save others $80-fucknuts.


Is it actually legal to ride in the back of a pickup where you are? It sure isn't in California.


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

I think its legal in CO if the bed is walled on all 4 sides, ie no flatbed and not with tailgate down.


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## markhusbands (Aug 17, 2015)

I think that is correct: A person is prohibited from riding on the outside, top, hood or fenders or any other portion of a vehicle except that they may ride, while in a sitting position, in the cargo area of a vehicle if the area is fully or partially enclosed on all four (4) sides. (§42-4-201(6)) A driver shall not knowingly permit a person to ride on the top, hood, fenders, or any other portion of a vehicle except that a passenger may ride, while in a sitting position, in the cargo area of a vehicle if the area is fully or partially enclosed on all four (4) sides. (§42-4-201(6).


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## mattman (Jan 30, 2015)

So it's ok to put a passenger in your trunk, but not truck bed surf and chug a beer, ride up to the Ruby parking lot on the hood of a car, or put a hitch hiker in the top of the five stack on a commercial trip. Got it!


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## mattman (Jan 30, 2015)

So then how about hanging out the door of the bus on the way to the way to the put in...


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## MountainmanPete (Jun 7, 2014)

I was hitching recently on the same stretch of road and got the similar ticket. Ranger
Was "cool" but I ate the $80 fine instead of the driver who was just trying to help a boater out. The ranger had mentioned some recent carnage from a similar situation including multiple victims but did not go into specifics. I agree that they should be at the rivers edge handing out tickets to gumbys in tubes with no flotation devices, but I think the lesson here is to tell others to either duck real low when riding in trailers or do like Hayduke and arm yourself with a fist full of caltrops for aversion purposes. Just don't drop em in the boat!


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## mkashzg (Aug 9, 2006)

mattman said:


> So then how about hanging out the door of the bus on the way to the way to the put in...



Don't they call that Darwinism!?


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## mattman (Jan 30, 2015)

mkashzg said:


> Don't they call that Darwinism!?


Yes, but it doesn't always work, surprised some of us made it through our 20's....


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## mr. compassionate (Jan 13, 2006)

Thanks all for the comments, just trying to give all a heads up and save them an $80 ticket and possible worse. I shouldn't have blamed the ranger I guess he has a crappy job to do although better than a city cop.

Yes, legal to ride in pickup bed with 4 sides.


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## bystander (Jul 3, 2014)

mr. compassionate said:


> Yes, legal to ride in pickup bed with 4 sides.


That depends on where you live.


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## trevko (Jul 7, 2008)

mr. compassionate said:


> Thanks all for the comments, just trying to give all a heads up and save them an $80 ticket and possible worse. I shouldn't have blamed the ranger I guess he has a crappy job to do although better than a city cop.
> 
> Yes, legal to ride in pickup bed with 4 sides.


Thanks for the heads up, it is appreciated.


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## jonseim (May 27, 2006)

Is it legal to ride in a trailer that is enclosed, i.e. 4 sides and then the raft on top?


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## markhusbands (Aug 17, 2015)

"cargo area of a vehicle". I don't think they mean to include trailers as vehicles in this case.


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## Fuzzie (Jan 23, 2009)

To me, there is a take home message from all this. At the Upper C, there is going to be more law enforcement and regulation...


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## squirrelnuts (Apr 20, 2014)

Any encounter with law enforcement that ends without blood or bracelets is just gravy, "render unto Caesar" and go have fun!


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## PhilipJFry (Apr 1, 2013)

jonseim said:


> Is it legal to ride in a trailer that is enclosed, i.e. 4 sides and then the raft on top?


I don't know about CO, but in ID it is against the law. (can't haul people in a camp trailer or horse trailer)


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## Mopdog (Apr 24, 2014)

Back of the truck is legal in ID only if ALL available seats are occupied with seat belts in use.


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## mattman (Jan 30, 2015)

That's probably a really good take home message Fuzzie, remember when you never saw a law enforcement presence, now way too busy down there for that.

Thanks for the heads up Mr. Compassionate, it is appreciated, and I can't say i have never let anyone ride in a stack, or done it myself at least once. Some of us are perfect citizens and have never done nuthin' they shouldn't have, can't say i'm one.


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## outathaboatBruce (Mar 2, 2017)

I got a 180 dollar ticket in Pilar New Mexico for having people in the bed of the truck. Ranger waved at us as we pulled out and then pulled us over....what a dick.


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## mkashzg (Aug 9, 2006)

Here we go again!!


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## Schutzie (Feb 5, 2013)

Lesson in life; Schutzie swears this is a true story.

Back in the day we'd run multiple trips on the Gore range. After getting tossed out of State Bridge Bar (when did that burn down, and why hasn't it been rebuilt?) we'd all load up in the trucks with their overloaded trailers and head back to the Kremmling warehouse with a stop at the pump house to pick up round trip vehicle(s).

So this one time one of the guides who thought he was funny decides, he'll jump from the Suburban roof rack (really; we'd pile them that high) onto the trailer to see if he was missed when we got to the warehouse. Instead, he missed his target. Given the alcohol level in the suburban, no one noticed the "thump" as we turned into the pump house.
As we were sorting out who had the keys to the toad (yes, we named our trucks as well) and finding any left over beers an old guy swings in and casually mentions that it appeared we had lost one of our guides, you know, back up at the turnoff.
We found the now gimpy guide in the middle of the road, trying to crawl to safety in the ditch, tire marks clearly showing on his back and left knee.
A trip to the hospital confirmed; he had torn tendons in that knee.
And, the next day he and a couple other guides had planned to leave on motorcycles to take in the sights in California.
No problem. Duct taping a broken paddle shaft to the cross bar allowed the wounded guide to prop his wounded leg up, per doctor instructions, and off they went.
Unfortunately, somewhere in Utah a logging truck blew our gimpy guide off the road and into a tree. Neither the bike or gimpy guides right knee took the impact well. A trip to a local hospital resulted in our hero now having casts on BOTH legs. Fortunately (or not) a little rearranging of gear left room for gimpy to ride Pillar the rest of the way to California, where the trio decided Disney Land was just the thing.
Getting a wheel chair for gimpy allowed the trio to jump lines and avoid little sticky people and until early afternoon they had a fine old time.
One ride did not permit leg casts, much less two leg casts, so while the other two partook of the ride, gimpy rested in his chair at the exit. 
Which, it turns out, was at the top of a hill. A hill steeper than wheelchair brake engineers had contemplated.
In short order Gimpy rolls down the hill, hits the mini train tracks, and is unceremoniously dumped on his ass, but now entangled in the collapsed wheel chair.

And, darn the luck, the train is coming.

A fellow steps over to evaluate the situation, and remarks that some days it just doesn't pay to get out of bed.

The moral of the story is; sit your butt in your seat, fasten your seatbelt, and under no circumstances should anyone be permitted to ride, or attempt to ride, in a moving trailer.


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## Dsuth82 (Apr 2, 2012)

Glad to hear the rangers are out doing their job and trying to keep people safe. Sucks about the ticket, but it happens. 

Hopefully they hammer that area and it becomes less of a shit show. I used to spend a fair amount of time on the Upper C. I don't find it too appealing anymore.


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## Lebowski (Aug 19, 2015)

So, don't ride in the boat going down the road or I might get run over a by a train at Disney Land. Got it. 

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## MountainVisions (Jan 6, 2017)

carvedog said:


> Please stop with the name calling and trying to make people fit in boxes that you want to contain them with the name calling - this isn't The Eddy.
> 
> Sorry you got popped. I know a river guide who died in an unfortunate trailer incident. If people didn't do stupid shit then they wouldn't make stupid laws.
> 
> I am a Libertarian too, even more so these days, but that doesn't mean NO laws.


This thread was entertaining until you ruined it with sensible comments. Wth? 

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## MountainmanPete (Jun 7, 2014)

Shutzie Quote: 
"Back in the day we'd run multiple trips on the Gore range. After getting tossed out of State Bridge Bar (when did that burn down, and why hasn't it been rebuilt?)"

It was rebuilt but the management is (to say it nicely) unmotivated. They had music there the first year they reopened (2011) consistently. The following year less, and virtually none in 2013. 

The last time I was at State Bridge for my buddies bachelor party in early 2017 I talked to the owner about how great the venue was and how I wished they would re-open the bar/venue. He responded that he really would like to see a show there too. WTF? I don't get it.


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## mattman (Jan 30, 2015)

Sometimes I wonder if we are really doing the right thing, making laws to prevent people from dying tragically, do to there own stupidity. It sucks for the individual, and is grisly sometimes for the Ems workers who have to clean it up, but it seems to be encouraging people to make fucked up decisions. 
It used to be, that if you did really dumb stuff, you had a very real chance of ending up dead( still kinda true). It was a great motivator to help you to make good decisions, and if you refused to think through what you did, it cleaned up the gene pool.

It should be pointed out, that I'm not talking about the trough road episode specifically, and I have worked in EMS before, having to deal with some ugly stuff first hand. It made me wonder if it really is best to make rules every time, to try and prevent death and dismemberment do to stupidity, or let nature run it's course, just like it did before law making began. 
Food for thought, at least.


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