# Plan A, The Grand. Plan B....?????



## Rustie (Jun 24, 2010)

I don't remember what the permit system for Cataract Canyon is, but we did that as a shakedown for the Grand once upon a time, it it was pretty glorious.


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

I hope the situation is resolved before your trip. If not:

Plan B for me would be a float of the longest possible length of the Salmon this time of year. Assuming it self-registration right now outside of the control season???? Corn Creek or primitive ramp above down to Snake. 

Plan C You could float for a week on the Colorado from near Cisco to Potash. Defininitely not exciting rapids wise. Road side.

Plan D: Upper Colorado......maybe sometime around GlenWood.

Plan E: Green River float through Uintah Valley. Not very exciting, though it has lots of potential to explore archaeology. End at Sand Wash, assuming they didn't close takeout, which I can't imagine is possible or was done.

Plan F: Day Float sections of the lower Provo. Bony but can be great fly fishing. Launches are primitive.

Plan G: Throw on a motor and spend a week slowly moving your raft down Lake Powell. Great explorations but miserable for a raft. Glassy this time of year. No services, as all marinas are closed. Section from Dirty Devil "ramp" to Halls Crossing (which is open) has amazing slot canyons. I assume the resource is theoretically open as it was never required to have a permit in the first place. Could be closed since it is part of NPS system though....not exactly how they are handling their recreation areas like Powell. If you like sea kayaking the lake is brilliant this time of year.

Utah is difficult beyond that right now. Rivers are either drying up or permits are inaccessible if not already acquired.


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Rustie said:


> I don't remember what the permit system for Cataract Canyon is, but we did that as a shakedown for the Grand once upon a time, it it was pretty glorious.


Permit required through NPS but no quota. I imagine that stretch is "closed" since it runs through the national park.


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## salsasean (Apr 20, 2005)

Christo,
Hope you get on the grand, if not head south. I will be in Guatemala boating with Roberto for the next month. Cataract sounds like a good second choice, ruby/horse/westwater?


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## salsasean (Apr 20, 2005)

oh yeah, what about a rogue river trip. only 5 days but beautiful.


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## benpetri (Jul 2, 2004)

Northern california coastal rivers might be an option, especially if they start getting their rainy season going. The Klamath should be floatable for a multiday, and if it rains sections on the Smith, Trinity, Eel, Illinois etc could come in. No permits that I know of.


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## hollek (May 23, 2009)

*Cataract Canyon*

Just ran Cataract from last Saturday to Thursday. They had temporary barracades setup at the takeout (Dirty Devil). As well, we were at Spanish Bottom on Tuesday. As the Rangers were leaving to go up river they said technically they should evacuate us off of the river, but also said it was not practical. So I imagine the Potash put in is barricaded as well.


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## mania (Oct 21, 2003)

hollek said:


> As the Rangers were leaving to go up river they said technically they should evacuate us off of the river, but also said it was not practical.


Okay boys bring in the heavy lifting choppers we gotta get these guys out of here to save some money. Still sounds odd as you launched before the shutdown. Looks like a bad plan B right now.


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## David Spiegel (Sep 26, 2007)

Green river to hite? Lots of flat but super scenic. Probably wouldn't run into anyone


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## mania (Oct 21, 2003)

Mexico!

SierraRios: Kayak, Raft, and Protect Rivers in Mexico and Peru


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## VandyIn541 (Jun 16, 2013)

salsasean said:


> oh yeah, what about a rogue river trip. only 5 days but beautiful.


You could float the Rogue from just below Lost Creek lake all the way to the ocean at Gold Beach. Probably 8-9 days and ~160 miles or so. Permit season ends on Oct. 15, so even if the government is still shut down, it's open season on the wild section at that point.

This link is for an old article. Gold Ray dam has since been removed.

'Epic' float to the sea | MailTribune.com

And if you're up this way, the Upper Klamath has a great day run, and the Illinois is a great trip if there's enough water.


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## Kilroy (Oct 23, 2011)

hollek said:


> Just ran Cataract from last Saturday to Thursday. They had temporary barracades setup at the takeout (Dirty Devil). As well, we were at Spanish Bottom on Tuesday. As the Rangers were leaving to go up river they said technically they should evacuate us off of the river, but also said it was not practical. So I imagine the Potash put in is barricaded as well.


That's nice, close off public land for public use... I just got off the lower rogue (did 3 long days) during the government furlough, and I had no permit. Just drove to the closed smullen visitors center, filled out a self-issuing permit and launched. They aren't monitoring boater/permit numbers right now. The note only asked us to follow the standard river rules when we launched. Just thought I'd pass that along. Galice resort is more than happy to drop your rig at foster bar for you, shutdown or not...


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## cosurfgod (Oct 10, 2003)

Ruby horsethief to hite. Cataract permits are easy to get and westwater is a free for all.


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## mania (Oct 21, 2003)

cosurfgod said:


> Cataract permits are easy to get


they are not easy to get if the office you call to get one is shutdown.


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## Kilroy (Oct 23, 2011)

One would say then "just go". The river police aren't out and it's public land that isn't being managed. Check for "self issuing permits" located at the river office/visitors center. That's what many offices are doing during the government furloughs according to an article on the BLM website.


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## JHMainer (Jun 27, 2011)

How about a Diamond - Pearce or South Cove? I know the takeouts are operated by the government....but if you floated too there would they make you leave your boats there?


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## richp (Feb 27, 2005)

Hi,

With regard to the possibility of a Diamond down trip, the Hualapai are not bound by the Federal shutdown. So that much should be OK.

But if you show up with a lot of river gear looking like you were going to launch, the folks at entry booth might want to see your NPS permit (required to run that stretch) before they let you go down the road. And of course if you don't already have one, you won't be getting a permit right now from the Park. 

It's also possible the NPS folks at the Meadview blockade might require you to produce your permit when you were leaving. Without one, you might be faced with fines, confiscation of gear, and all kinds of unhappy consequences.

Not 100% certain, but it's something to think about...

FWIW.

Rich Phillips



Rich Phillips


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## JHMainer (Jun 27, 2011)

Thanks. Thats about what I figured that scenario would be like.


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

Mf, main, lower salmon. We just got a ton of rain and the mf is up. You'd have to figure out permit for the mf, or lack thereof. I don't think the main requires a permit this time of year and lower salmon is self issue. You might be bending some rules but the usfs doesn't seem to be having "hard" closures liie nps.


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## yak1 (Jan 28, 2006)

Put in at Loma run down to Moab. You have nice canyon country, some pretty nice rapids in Westwater, and you can go all the way down to the confluance but unless you pirated it you'd have to jet boat back out to either Green River Ut or Moab. Have fun ps don't forget that even with all the federal land shut down this is a big country and there's a butt load to see and do.


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## eddy hopper (Sep 17, 2007)

It looks like Big Bend has water right now. Lots of options linking several canyons making for 100's of raftable miles. Being on the Mexico boarder I don't think the park closure has any affect on the river because it's international waters. The chihuahuan desert is beautiful and warm too. Still not the Grand


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## [email protected] (Jan 22, 2008)

*Plan A the Grand, Plan B...*

Hi There - you can do Westwater...they are open, also the Rogue (Oregon) is open, you can't do Powell, they closed up shop...We can verify that the San Juan (Utah) is open as well...

Best of luck!


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## mania (Oct 21, 2003)

[email protected] said:


> Hi There - you can do Westwater...they are open, also the Rogue (Oregon) is open, you can't do Powell, they closed up shop...We can verify that the San Juan (Utah) is open as well...


Pretty sure you can do Westwater and San Juan IF you already have the permit.


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## dirtbagkayaker (Oct 29, 2008)

Just got off the MFS Saturday and it was not too bad. Still boney on top. If I had 3 weeks, I'd run it 3 times (-:


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## climbdenali (Apr 2, 2006)

http://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/f43/san-juan-service-trip-50611.html


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## DoStep (Jun 26, 2012)

Loma to Hite can kill 2 weeks. Its a pretty good Plan B if you get shut out of GC.


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## h2obro (Apr 22, 2004)

Thanks for all the Ideas folks. Think were gonna throw caution to the wind and make an attempt at the Grand. Launch 22nd. Its too nasty to think they will open then close it. Fingers crossed. A close 2nd would be the Rogue. Great Trip Idea!!
Take care people.


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## salsasean (Apr 20, 2005)

Christo, 

Just heard that some friends of mine from Canon launched 2 days ago. I guess the Arizona stepped up in place of the Feds and opened it. Have a GRAND time, no thanks to the grand old party.


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## stuntsheriff (Jun 3, 2009)

Oh yeah. All because of the republicans.


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