# Deschutes River Rant: SAGE



## yesimapirate (Oct 18, 2010)

Sorry about your river issues, but kudos for taking not one but TWO little ones on an over nighter!


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## Avatard (Apr 29, 2011)

we usually do just Warm Springs to Harpham. Overnight/Launch at Mecca Flats. Do a layover near North Junction.

you get to take out at Harpham around 3-4pm --- the time there is nobody there. You avoid the fun rapids but also avoid the jackasses at Sandy Beach takeout.

I guess your option works too but you really need to camp down below Buckskin and get on the river early if you want to miss all the commercial traffic on the last day ...


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## orto11 (Mar 8, 2013)

I have been on the Deschutes 3 times. It is one river I never need to go back to. The water is Boring!, nothing but riff raff out of Portland and 5000 boats to bumper car with all day. Everyone gets hyped over some little rapids that are on the river and it is basically a burnt waste land. I have NO idea why someone would even go there over the other Oregon options.

The Cluster F at the boat ramps are the worst I have ever seen anywhere, The outfitters customers block every slot on the ramp and just sit there. Also why do people rig there freaking boats on the ramp over there?? drive the trailer in the water , launch the boat and you are clear in 1 minute , pretty damn simple. I saw someone pull up to the ramp black a open slot and start airing up his raft on the ground. DOUCHE 
They can have that place


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## Rustie (Jun 24, 2010)

I will add to this that I just talked to the owner of Sage, and he was a stand-up guy about it. Said he would address it with the guide, and that yeah, he probably does need to remind his shuttles about staking out the ramp at Sandy. He's a local to Maupin and sure doesn't want to own a company with a bad reputation. Then again, the Deschutes needs more than just one polite outfitter... Like most popular ramps, it would take airport curb police to straighten out some of those ramps.


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## Rustie (Jun 24, 2010)

One more addition, which I think pertains to a lot of pissed off boaters. I emailed the Prineville BLM, who manages this section. I described this incident, and got a very sympathetic and "we will not let this pass" sort of response. If you have similar complaints, you might try the same. I looked up the manager of the Prineville BLM unit's email address, should you have occasion for it, let me know.


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## Duce (Sep 5, 2011)

I have mixed feelings about the guided trip thing. On the lower rogue between July-August foster bar ramp is a loser from noon on. They have it and I don't even try to get anything other than the rocks north of the ramp. Primary larger camps are the same way. They send runners in the early morning and they are gone. What sucks is when some of the former none primary spots start getting filled (upper wildcat/ river right up from Missouri etc). I get it but I don't want to hear bitching (which I have) when a private group does a layover at one of the good spots. It was it is and I get it in the summer months. Never had any major problems on the lower with any of the guided trips (always polite), just frustration when they are at a camp you haven't seen them before.


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## LochsaIdaho (Jun 25, 2012)

Just a basic blanket statement here: there are at least 2 sides to every story.

In addition, we private boaters need to remember when we bash outfitters that outfitters exist to service the public. This is the same public, like you and me, that "own" our public rivers. People that go on outfitted trips are just people without gear or the knowledge/skill to do it on their own. So even though the employees of the outfitter were apparently rude and unprofessional (far to common), the outfitters are not the root of all evil. It is not their fault that they bring loads of people down the river. If the river trip were not in such high demand by the general PUBLIC, there would not been long flotillas of commercial boats. 

In general, people are rude, selfish, and ignorant. In addition many river rafters lack the skills to read water and lack the skills and knowledge to slow a boat down while rafting. That "guide" in the boat that rammed the cat certainly was a goon and probably deserved a slap across the face with a wet neoprene glove for endangering the children. My point is that outfitters are not the root of all evil and the ones to blame for every digression of polite decorum that happens on the river. In fact, it sounds like this outfitter man'd up and took responsibility and hopefully will fire that shitty guide and shuttle driver.


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## solboater (May 9, 2011)

Duce said:


> I have mixed feelings about the guided trip thing. On the lower rogue between July-August foster bar ramp is a loser from noon on. They have it and I don't even try to get anything other than the rocks north of the ramp. Primary larger camps are the same way. They send runners in the early morning and they are gone. What sucks is when some of the former none primary spots start getting filled (upper wildcat/ river right up from Missouri etc). I get it but I don't want to hear bitching (which I have) when a private group does a layover at one of the good spots. It was it is and I get it in the summer months. Never had any major problems on the lower with any of the guided trips (always polite), just frustration when they are at a camp you haven't seen them before.


So Duce do you have any solutions to these issues? Personally I think it is a shame the way the boaters on the Rogue are hyper competitive in regard to camps. I would be very grateful for a mechanism to take the stress out of finding a camp, particularly below Paradise. My current solution is to only guide lodge to lodge trips and only do four day private trips, which only helps a little.


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## Rustie (Jun 24, 2010)

Having formerly been a raft guide, I actually like seeing outfitters on the river. It's just a shame when you have to use the name on the side of the raft to complain about them. I haven't done the Rogue during the height of summer, only the off season, so there is my solution to that river, although it's not a perfect one. In the case of the Deschutes, the ranger probably needs to police the ramp better, hence my getting in touch with the ranger.


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## TriBri1 (Nov 15, 2011)

solboater said:


> So Duce do you have any solutions to these issues? Personally I think it is a shame the way the boaters on the Rogue are hyper competitive in regard to camps. I would be very grateful for a mechanism to take the stress out of finding a camp, particularly below Paradise. My current solution is to only guide lodge to lodge trips and only do four day private trips, which only helps a little.


I did not like the idea at first, but having reservable camp spots on the Main Salmon was amazing. Not all camps are reservable, just the more popular camps or the camps where you have to go out on a limb to get it. For example, last camp for a few miles or before hitting a large rapid. On our 8 day trip, we had 4 nights reserved. It took the stress out of racing to camp since we knew that the camp would be empty when we arrived, so we could spend the day enjoying the river, hiking and taking our time.


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## Duce (Sep 5, 2011)

I personally try to get in 2-3 trips prior to the peak summer season. I also prefer smaller groups so I don't have to race for a camp spot. As for a solution, I don't have an answer for that other than expect the larger more popular spots to be taken. I suppose assigning some of the larger spots might help however; I don't know enough about that system to offer a experienced opinion. On anther note Dulog camp looked more appealing this year. Maybe I just noticed it more with the low water.


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## Learch (Jul 12, 2010)

In June we launched on the deschutes and the guides took the private ramp, there were no check in Rangers. The July trip we took had a Ranger, so the private ramp had only private Rangers. It doesn't make much sense why they don't have a traditional ramp for the guides and a launch ramp for private boaters. 
I've had as much trouble with private boaters at the take out as I have with guides. 
I'll say this, the last time I went we had a last minute addition to my trip, and I forgot to get an extra permit the day of. I paid to have my van driven to the bottom, so I didn't have a vehicle. One of the Rangers asked a guide bus to haul me to town, and they did at no charge. The guy was super cool, and asked for nothing in return. 
The point of the story is this; for the bad things that happened to you that day, somewhere on that river a guide helped someone, maybe saved someone, and contributed to the economy. Since it is a popular river and lots of non-whitewater people like us do use the river and pay more to do so, we have places like the Oasis, Imperial lodge, and Deschutes pizza company while we go there too. 
I'm a little surprised that a raft got that close to you without noticing. I have my head on a swivel in a raft and a car. I'm just starting to take my littles down stuff like that, and I've never had a raft run in to me like that. (I can't remember the last time someone intended on hitting me like that either) 
Sorry for your bad experience.


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