# Middle Fork Salmon information needed



## Jbertone (Aug 17, 2012)

Good day to all! 
Well after submitting permits for 12 years, I got the middle fork. I know relatively nothing about it, in the way I usually like to know. Advice, etc., etc. would be helpful, to this novice. Direction to resources would help as well. Just bought the book on amazon. The Middle Fork of the Salmon River : A Comprehensive Guide
Thanks in advance!


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## Paul7 (Aug 14, 2012)

You'll get some advice but use the search function you will find more than a guide books info on older threads covering the same topic.
!!!!CONGRATULATION!!!! 

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## zcollier (Jan 1, 2004)

Here are a few great resources:

- Whitewater Guidebook description: Middle Fork of the Salmon River | Whitewater Guidebook

- Blackadar Boating (rentals and shuttles): Blackadar Boating

- Snowpack: Snow Station Information - BANNER SUMMIT

Have fun!


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## carvedog (May 11, 2005)

What's your date?


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## cahatch52 (Jan 6, 2010)

Ditto: June 1, MF and Aug 10 MF are not the same river.


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## Notch (Jan 16, 2012)

I'd also be interested to hear info/advice about the MF in June....I entered the lottery for the first time this January and somehow scored a permit for June 9! Looks like a big snowpack so far - what are peoples opinions about the difficulty level changing after a big snowpack? I figure this June may be > 6ft?


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## OregonRafter (Jan 30, 2013)

http://www.amazon.com/Middle-Fork-Salmon-River-Comprehensive/dp/1424302668

Matt Leidecker book for the MFS. Best guidebook I've ever used for a river I've floated. Highly recommended!


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## RichardJames (Feb 16, 2015)

most memorable things from our June MFS trip,

Amazing weather
Running at 3.5'
Get to the put in ramp early in the day before commercial trips monopolize the boat ramp and wheelbarrows down to the water
At 3.5' water level at put in, be prepared for the wild side of the river to start immediately as there is swift water and little bite for your oars
Every campsite was amazing
If you bring a tarp or river wing for kitchen shelter make sure to have the heavy duty grommets installed before the trip
Make sure to enjoy the feeling of nearly taco'ing at Velvet
Chugging beers after read n run on Tappan
And get to the put in campsite the day before and leave time before dinner to hike up to dagger falls

Enjoy. I will keep applying every year..hope its not long before we get to go back


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## Jbertone (Aug 17, 2012)

June 12


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## carvedog (May 11, 2005)

I am shooting off the cuff here as I haven't had my usual time to obsess about flows. 

A couple of things. The road to Boundary may not be open by then. June 9th or 12th. That means flying in - an excellent option - or doing Marsh Creek. Which can be excellent but can also be challenging. And it can also suck balls for the unprepared. 

The funny thing is the FS has a budget for plowing the road but they often choose not to. A few years ago they were doing road clearing and wet slough slides started coming down on the other side of Fir Creek summit so they stopped. That is legit, when one of the rangers told me they wouldn't plow because they wanted the camps to recuperate more.........WTF.....we went and shoveled it out anyway. 

It all depends on when it comes off but I was thinking peak around that time and that may mean much more than six feet. But don't forget I am a bullshit talking, ex-guide who hopes the river gets over 10 feet for a few different reasons. For what it's worth. I think the upper is easier at 8 feet than 6 but still scary since you are moving a solid 10 to 12 mph or more. That's all I have for now.


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## Paul7 (Aug 14, 2012)

I've never been on the MFS, what's Dagger like after Marsh? Trip report I read states it's a portage. 

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## michaeljorg (Feb 12, 2016)

You can run it in a kayak, no problem. (And at high flows looks like it goes in a raft...) 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDOE1EHeiW4

At lower flows I'd think oar rigs would be challenging.


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## zcollier (Jan 1, 2004)

I answered this question 3 times yesterday to friends who "won" June Middle Fork trips and decided to write the following blog post. I would love feedback from anyone before I publish it. Enjoy!

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Title: June Trips on the Middle Fork of the Salmon

June is a great time to visit the Middle Fork of the Salmon, but also very unpredictable so here are some tips to help you plan your trip.

<h3>Snowpack and Water Flows</h3>

You'll probably check the snowpack almost every day from now until your trip. I use the Banner Summit Snow Station page (Snow Station Information - BANNER SUMMIT) which tells you how this year compares to and "average" year.

You'll also probably be checking the flows every day for the month preceding your trip. Most people use the Northwest River Center MF Salmon - Near Stanley ((MIDI1) MF SALMON--NEAR STANLEY Station Summary) web page. It has flow prediction which I tell people is "for entertainment purposes only" since it's a good guideline but not terrible accurate.

I consider a snowpack between 80% and 120% of average a pretty typical year. The river will likely peak sometime the first week of June and get up to 6 or 8 feet. A few really experienced groups will get on the water and have a great time, a number of unexperienced groups will cancel their trips, and a few unexperienced groups will go and have some sort of major problem. The second half of June is likely to be great.

If the snowpack is higher than 120% of normal then expect higher flows for a long period of time with a peak at 8 feet or higher. When this happens the whole month of June could see high water.

It's important to note two things that typically happen and throw a wrench in trip planning.

1. We have a normal snowpack (80% to 120%) through March but a cold, wet spring and the snowpack jumps to 150% of normal plus.

2. We have a huge snowpack (120% and higher) followed by a warm spring and an early snowmelt peak in May. Flows in June end up being normal or even lower than normal.

So no matter how many times you check the snowpack and flows, your big decisions will happen a week or even a couple days before you actually launch.

<h3>The Road to Boundary</h3>

When the snowpack is high the road to Boundary can be closed in early June. Sometimes the Forest Service plows the road early and sometimes and intrepid group of paddlers goes in with shovels and opens the road. Again, you'll be checking the message boards every day waiting to hear when the road is confirmed to be open.

If the road isn't open, here are you options:

1. Fly everything into Indian Creek and start your trip there. Most groups don't want to pay the money for the flights and/or miss the first 25 miles so they choose the more difficult and dangerous second option.

2. Launch your boats on Marsh Creek. You can paddle down Marsh Creek down to Boundary Creek in a day. This section is continuous and often full of wood so this option should only be attempted by experts. At flows higher than 4 feet this section becomes much more continuous and dangerous. If you choose run Marsh Creek you'll have to either run the Class V Dagger Falls or portage it. At flows above 5 feet most people portage it - which is no easy task.

The first group down Marsh Creek each year typically reports back about the wood situation here. Before you go please search out and find this information.

<h3>The Whitewater</h3>

In June the flows are higher making for a more dangerous experience. The most dangerous part is the first 20 miles where the river is the steepest and recovery from a flip or swim is very difficult. Here are general notes about flows.

- 3 - 4 feet: this is the sweet spot! The whitewater is great and here are eddies to catch along the way.

- 4 - 5.5 feet: things start getting real with some bigger holes and moves that need to be made. There are still eddies but they are harder to catch.

- 5.5 - 7 feet: this is where there are very few eddies in the first 20 miles. The moves are all Class IV but there is little room for mistakes. A flip or a swim can be very difficult to recover from. Your group should be full of solid Class IV boaters who know each other and work as a team. There should also be a few people who know the river well.

- 7 feet and higher: You should be solid experts who know the river well and want to be challenged. It's common to have logs coming down the river at these flows.

If you've made it through the first 20 miles with style then you'll love the rest of the river which will have plenty more big rapids but with more recovery room in between rapids.


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## Paul7 (Aug 14, 2012)

Can't ask for a better post than that, thanks for the effort. 

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## Notch (Jan 16, 2012)

That's some great stuff ZCollier - Thanks!


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## tteton (May 16, 2014)

LOON! ❤❤❤❤❤


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## Jbertone (Aug 17, 2012)

What's your thoughts on a put in on July 12?


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## zcollier (Jan 1, 2004)

July 12th should be a pretty amazing time to go on the Middle Fork.

Here's a link to a refined blog post I just finished about June Middle Fork trips:

Pro Tip: June Trips on the Middle Fork of the Salmon | Whitewater Guidebook


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