# Where to live based upon river selection



## k2andcannoli (Feb 28, 2012)

How big of a town or city... if you can live in bfe, there are a lot of options.


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## 100gold (Jul 30, 2015)

Take Boise off your list. Low wages and we are all a bunch of skinhead neocons. Really a bad bad place to live. No good beers and your skin dries out. Just sayin...


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## CoBoater (Jan 27, 2007)

Better take Colorado off the list too. Nothin bunch of yuppie posers with fancy boats, just wait til you see all the lost gear posts when the runoff hits. No good deals on places to live without bars on the windows. Denver sucks so hard you can't believe it, dont even think about Boulder. And you unless you want to catch hepatitis in the South Platte, you'll be spending 5 hours going 75 miles each way to the closest whitewater. place is expected to double in poopulation in the next 10 years so unless you like LA without the cool restaurants and a beach nearby, steer clear. And if you want to live where the water is and also have a job, you better get used to paying 75% of what you earn on a flea bag condo with 5 other guys, 3 dogs, and 2.5 girlfriends living there. 

West by god virginia is the place you ought to be. I-80 will be your best bet getting there. easy cruise all the way.


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## dirtbagkayaker (Oct 29, 2008)

Really hard to Bend OR. Its my far the best place for kayakers. Good beer, Weed, women, whitewater..... the list goes on. second would Portland OR and then hood river gorge. 3rd would be any where else in OR. No sales tax and they pump your gas.. Its freaking haven.


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## SteamboatBORN (Sep 22, 2012)

I like my neck of the woods. 30 mins to state bridge, 45 too The Eagle. 35 mins to yampa. 


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## curtis catman (Sep 29, 2015)

Yeah sure send em all to my state. Hell you can drive 1 hour and be at all the good runs. Plus we have water all year, you can always find a pull off to park in for weeks at a time. Weed is not legal but it aint exactly illegal. Most of the good jobs have left the state so it aint near as crowded as it was.


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## bucketboater (Jul 9, 2012)

100gold said:


> Take Boise off your list. Low wages and we are all a bunch of skinhead neocons. Really a bad bad place to live. No good beers and your skin dries out. Just sayin...


 I laughed because its so true. At least you have some good rivers.


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## 100gold (Jul 30, 2015)

No worries bucketboater. We do have two LCZ's. Blaine county and the northend of Boise. Always welcome there!


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## peachin (Feb 24, 2015)

Idaho Oregon Washington Colorado 


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## Max's Dad (Jan 5, 2010)

I have heard great things about the White Nile in Uganda. And cost of living is supposed to be very low


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## peachin (Feb 24, 2015)

*They are joking you...*

Boise is the gateway to whitewater heaven... Get a map out and look an hour up and North.... The Banks area further Northeast the Salmon begins... Slightly west is Hells Canyon all the great rafts are built here NRS, AIRE Cascade Raft and Kayak Maravia Cascade River Gear.... Don't forget to bring your WALLET


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## Outlaw (Mar 8, 2010)

I'll be honest and tell you that my experience living in Boise hasn't been that great. First off, I've had two jobs here that haven't worked out for the best. I always get the feeling at work that I am the last priority. I've never got the training that those "nice" LDS folks receive (they won't tell you, but you'll know it), and I was singled out as some bad liberal, openly. It's not that I talked politics at work, but I just didn't have the same attitude they did about things. It's really not too fun when your job depends on how conservative you can sound at work. With respect to the river; I have a few good friends here that I would trust with my life. That being said, it's a very clicky environment. If you show up to the put-in, people won't tell you they won't boat with you. However, try posting on the local email list and see how many responses you receive. Anyone who moves here seems to get a year's grace period. If you don't fit their set of values, you'll likely just be ignored. The silence is deafening. I can tell you that this was not the case for me when I lived in Colorado. Everyone is friendly and it's not clicky. Boise is a different story in my humble opinion. The politics is an utter disgrace to America! There's a reason why the "preppers" live in Idaho because you really can get in the mindset that the world will end when you're leaders are so lousy. I'm kinda there myself. Although the rivers are amazing and I have some good friends here and a girlfriend; I'm looking at jobs out of state. The cost of living is average in Boise, but the wages are currently 48th in the nation. They were 50th a few years ago. It's a shame that the state has been run into the ground. It's a beautiful state and there are good people here, but the feeling of being isolated and trying to find sustainable, gainful employment is becoming toxic to my soul. If you do find a job, a thousand other people would like to have your job. You're very expendable; especially if you're not LDS.


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## thecoach (May 3, 2014)

West Virginia Ooops forgot the period. Don't tell anyone....

Cheers


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## Outlaw (Mar 8, 2010)

One in 2 college graduates in Idaho leaves the state within 2 years of graduating to find better opportunities because the pay is so bad and the opportunities here are so few.


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## peachin (Feb 24, 2015)

I'm over 60... The Mormons are weak people and are scared to death of confrontation unless they're in a group.. I work for myself and my income is national. Boat people meet you half way... Youre the other half way easy to build a social life within the boating community and in this small city life... Eagle, Meridian and Nampa.... A whole other world


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## Anchorless (Aug 3, 2010)

I'd say Hood River and Bend are the pinnacle. Boise is pretty good but I'm not sure it's the same caliber of HR. 

Outlaw... maybe perchance your attitude and personality scare people away from boating with you? You seem like kind of a drain / buzzkill. Not how I want to spend my time on the river.


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## peachin (Feb 24, 2015)

Anchorless said:


> I'd say Hood River and Bend are the pinnacle. Boise is pretty good but I'm not sure it's the same caliber of HR.
> 
> Outlaw... maybe perchance your attitude and personality scare people away from boating with you? You seem like kind of a drain / buzzkill. Not how I want to spend my time on the river.


I guess I would agree with outlaw words like pinnnacle and caliber in terrms of northwestern river systems on the surface seem sophomoric


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## CaptBiggler (May 14, 2015)

Not a lot of love for CO on here, but how could you not say Fort Collins?? College town with great people, great beer, beautiful women, and a short drive to the Poudre which has anything from Cl I-V.


Also, Salida is a great location for boating and skiing. Heavy commercial presence means lots of tourists and a crowded river, but a great place.


In general, its hard not to go with somewhere in CO with 300+ days of sun.


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

CaptBiggler said:


> Not a lot of love for CO on here, but how could you not say Fort Collins?? College town with great people, great beer, beautiful women, and a short drive to the Poudre which has anything from Cl I-V.
> 
> 
> Also, Salida is a great location for boating and skiing. Heavy commercial presence means lots of tourists and a crowded river, but a great place.
> ...


That's because it's hard to recommend an area/river that only runs for a couple months a year.... the Ark Valley has more consistent water, but still not really comparable to the PNW for year round boating, plus it's getting so crowded around here that the majority of people can't afford rent anymore.

Honestly, other than a lack of yuppies I don't think Idaho is much of a better choice than CO... all the rivers are ice locked during the dead of winter, and the best runs require permits.


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## craven_morhead (Feb 20, 2007)

Yeah Colorado is great if you want different seasons for different sports, skiing, kayaking, and mountain biking fill the calendar nicely. But if its all boating all the time you're looking for this isn't the place


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## Gremlin (Jun 24, 2010)

Yeah, Colorado isn't great for year-round boating. I had to take two months off


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## Anchorless (Aug 3, 2010)

peachin said:


> I guess I would agree with outlaw words like pinnnacle and caliber in terrms of northwestern river systems on the surface seem sophomoric


Of course it's sophomoric to a certain degree; that's part of the fun. Like you said.... "gateway to whitewater heaven." How crass is that? But it's also fun.

I didn't create the thread; I'm just responding to it. 

But at the same time, some places are better than others in terms of river opportunities, quality, etc. Hood River is pretty darn hard to beat for variety and days per year on the river. The Boise area has really good class III, IV, and V runs that flow just about all year round, and is situated close to some world-class epics.


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

Gremlin said:


> Yeah, Colorado isn't great for year-round boating. I had to take two months off


I took 3 months off this winter, after 32 months straight running water in Colorado... but it's still not really fair to compare it to the PNW. Mostly it's extremely low flow and you essentially have 2 options, the Upper Ark if they are releasing water, and Shoshone...


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## BrianK (Feb 3, 2005)

> Honestly, other than a lack of yuppies I don't think Idaho is much of a better choice than CO... all the rivers are ice locked during the dead of winter, and the best runs require permits.


You need to take a trip to Idaho. Idaho is a much better whitewater state than Colorado. The season is much longer, they have a ton more water even in drought years and there are a lot of great non-permitted options. I live in Colorado for a bunch of reasons - but if I were deciding between Idaho and Colorado strictly for boating I would pick Idaho in a second. The numbers at 300 and shoshone at 800 cfs are not that great. 

It's real hard to beat Hood River in the west. It has legitimate year round boating of all classes real close to town. If kayaking is your primary goal this is the best place to live in this country, and I don't think it's close. (It's not the best rafting location)

There are a bunch of places out east that could compete with Hood River for kayaking in both the southeast and mid-atlantic.


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

BrianK said:


> You need to take a trip to Idaho. Idaho is a much better whitewater state than Colorado.


You got me there. I was basing my statement off second hand beta and assumptions..... thanks for calling me out.


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## k2andcannoli (Feb 28, 2012)

Morgantown, WV should be on any one's list. There's jobs, sports, nightlife, college girls, beer, it's affordable, and people are fairly friendly. Seriously challenging kayaking is all over, including the upper backwater and deckers creek. Fun stuff like the upper yough, and the cheat canyon are 30-50 miles away. Easy stuff like the lower yough, potomac, and cheat narrows are just around an hour away. You can absolutely boat every day if it's a mild winter, you can rally for dawn runs on the top yough or tygart before work, you can go skiing and if conditions suck boating is probably prime, you can go somewhere new every weekend for a year and not drive more than four hours...probably alot less if you can run anything.


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## BrianK (Feb 3, 2005)

I'm not sure if you are being sarcastic, but either way sorry to call you out. I have no idea if you've been to Idaho. It's a fun place to boat - so is Colorado. Let's go boating.


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

BrianK said:


> I'm not sure if you are being sarcastic, but either way sorry to call you out. I have no idea if you've been to Idaho. It's a fun place to boat - so is Colorado. Let's go boating.


No sarcasm. I haven't been to Idaho. I just assumed with it being an interior mountain region with snowmelt fed creeks that the situation would be similar to Colorado in the winter. Do the main river systems not freeze over in Idaho? I kinda figured even the Snake would be subject to ice...


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## Anchorless (Aug 3, 2010)

lmyers said:


> No sarcasm. I haven't been to Idaho. I just assumed with it being an interior mountain region with snowmelt fed creeks that the situation would be similar to Colorado in the winter. Do the main river systems not freeze over in Idaho? I kinda figured even the Snake would be subject to ice...


Snake is actually fairly warm, and there are parts of it you can boat all year. Other parts just don't have the flow. 

Generally you can paddle the Main Payette and SF all year round. There may be a few days a year that the SF ices over, but for the most part, good to go (and people do boat it). You can usually boat the NF year round too, but it will ice over and the low flows make it interesting.


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## BrianK (Feb 3, 2005)

I'm not an expert, but i think it's just that they have a lot more water to begin with/released water, and that keeps the rivers from freezing over. Those rivers drain huge basins. The Salmon, Snake and Clearwater basins each deliver more or at least comparable volume as the Colorado River before it hits the green. Another factor is that for many of the rivers in Idaho the whitewater/gradient is down the watershed after it has a chance to collect more side streams, as opposed to Colorado where a lot of the whitewater is at the top of the drainage basins. 

Like Anchorless said - the snake and payette systems have floatable water all year. The Salmon always has water and there are non permitted sections of that as well. Obviously, the water gets higher in the summer, and many of the smaller rivers don't run in winter, but there are options year round.


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## Ripper (Aug 29, 2012)

Local Texan here that is moving up to the Denver metroplex to join in the tourist trap fun in June. I cant wait till the epic melt hits, and I get to post lost and found threads so I can recover my gear later this year. 

I've boated out in Idaho, and if I thought i could make a living out there that's where we would have moved to... Cost of living is high in Colorado for sure. Work aside, I also wanted to see how many native Colorado residents I could piss off by buying up their land while confirming Texas stereotypes.

Idaho is awesome though... but not the easiest group to find a float with. Especially when you tell them your from Texas... lol, the next questions is instantly "what's your resume?". Haven't run into it as much in Colorado... but that could be because everyone is so lit they don't realize I've tagged along... lol.

I can vouch that the Veracruz region is cheap on the living, and has whatever you want to bite off going on down South...


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## LSB (Mar 23, 2004)

Ripper said:


> Local Texan here that is moving up to the Denver metroplex to join in the tourist trap fun in June.
> I also wanted to see how many native Colorado residents I could piss off by bguying up their land while confirming Texas stereotypes.


The best thing about Texans is that they love Texas too much to move away. they just visit, spend money, bloviate about Texas and go home. 
(couldn't resist) 
as for the OP, I like to be within a few minutes of a local run not 30 minutes or an hour drive. Durango and Missoula are the 2 best places I've lived for that.


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## Outlaw (Mar 8, 2010)

I guess I'd have to strongly disagree! I'll be honest and say that I use to feel similar. If you're from Colorado, you've likely seen the stereotypical Texan pulling up in a huge Dodge truck and bragging about Texas and rich they are. However, if you actually go to Texas, you see normal, hard-working, down to earth people that work hard, play hard, and strive to make their state a place of opportunity. Texans are generally kind-hearted good people, who get a bad rap from the news. I've spent a year working in Midland and surrounding areas, so I feel as though I have a good grasp on the state. As a former Coloradoan, I would urge people to have a little more class. 



LSB said:


> The best thing about Texans is that they love Texas too much to move away. they just visit, spend money, bloviate about Texas and go home.
> (couldn't resist)
> as for the OP, I like to be within a few minutes of a local run not 30 minutes or an hour drive. Durango and Missoula are the 2 best places I've lived for that.


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## LochsaIdaho (Jun 25, 2012)

Outlaw said:


> I guess I'd have to strongly disagree! I'll be honest and say that I use to feel similar. If you're from Colorado, you've likely seen the stereotypical Texan pulling up in a huge Dodge truck and bragging about Texas and rich they are. However, if you actually go to Texas, you see normal, hard-working, down to earth people that work hard, play hard, and strive to make their state a place of opportunity. Texans are generally kind-hearted good people, who get a bad rap from the news. I've spent a year working in Midland and surrounding areas, so I feel as though I have a good grasp on the state. As a former Coloradoan, I would urge people to have a little more class.



Very well said. I am a Montanan that married a Texas girl, had a kid, and now live in the PanHandle. All the people I know are good people that do not fit this "Texas Stereotype". Or let's put it this way- there are assholes in every state, in equal proportion. People are people.

JBW 


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## paulk (Apr 24, 2006)

To clarify, Texas is not where you should live based off of river selection.


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## Outlaw (Mar 8, 2010)

paulk said:


> To clarify, Texas is not where you should live based off of river selection.



That's funny 


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## Roguelawyer (Apr 2, 2015)

I am surprised that there aren't more people claiming Colorado. 

I think if all I needed to do was ride rivers during boating season and work in the ski industry during those dark months I would be in Bend, OR. 

I am sure that is because I take for granted just how great it is in Southern Oregon. 

I and within an hour of the put-ins for the Lower Rogue, Illinois, Smith and Umpqua. The Deschutes is about a four hour drive so that isn't terrible.

. . . and it is nice being able to go to Sotar or Sawyer on my lunch break.


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## SteamboatBORN (Sep 22, 2012)

Roguelawyer said:


> I am surprised that there aren't more people claiming Colorado.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I will chime in again for Colorado. No offense but snow in Oregon does not compare to snow in Colorado. If we want to add in skiing with boating than Centennial State wins. I have skied a lot of places and Colorado has the most consistent snow. 


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## spencerhenry (Jun 21, 2004)

i live within 45 minutes or less of all the put ins on the roaring fork. within 1.5 hours of dowd chutes. within 2 hours of the put in for the numbers on the ark. under 3 hours to westwater, 3 or so hours of cross mountain gorge. 45 minutes to shoshone.
some good boating for sure. but, if it were not for work i would leave this state in a heartbeat.

1. high property taxes/ rent
2. high sales taxes, over 10% in some places 7% is common
3. rules and regulations on everything you do (liberals are taking over)
4. corruption in local politics and law enforcement
5. rude people, 25 years ago people were friendly and helpful, now they are bitter and angry
6. boating season for anything better than class II is short
7. too many people

colorado is a beautiful state. i moved here 29 years ago, but times have changed. While i have met many good people on the river, there are so many bitter angry people in the roaring fork valley. i used to think of coloradoans as self sufficient capable people, now it seems to not be so.
i almost bought a place in montana this last winter, but my work is here and it is a job that most would dream of.


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## No-T (Sep 5, 2012)

Dudes...you're totally forgetting about Columbus Ohio. We got the most gnarls Class I sewage and runoff creeks you could ever ask for.
A 3 to 4 hour drive for all the sweets in western PA and 4 to 5 hours to the best WV has to offer.
Only 6 or 7 hour drive to best creeks in the SouthEast.
Actually that all sounds horrible and I'm tired of all the driving...I'd miss Fayetteville but damn I'm moving to Bend!


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

Don't forget all the things to do in and around the Ocean, I don't think I would ever want to live far from the ocean again.


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