# Carlisle Cracking



## hand8272 (May 24, 2011)

This last weekend I noticed one of my Carlisle oars had some cracking in the plastic covering on the shaft. The cracks are perpendicular to the length of the oar and some you can get your fingernail in. Has anyone had any experience with this? The oar has an aluminum tubing center so I'm guessing it's still structurally sound. Any thoughts?


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## wildh2onriver (Jul 21, 2009)

hand8272 said:


> This last weekend I noticed one of my Carlisle oars had some cracking in the plastic covering on the shaft. The cracks are perpendicular to the length of the oar and some you can get your fingernail in. Has anyone had any experience with this? The oar has an aluminum tubing center so I'm guessing it's still structurally sound. Any thoughts?


Seen it countless times. I wouldn't own a Carlisle oar and haven't for over 15 years. The only way to fix them is to toss them into the trash and start over with a premium line of oars.


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## Avatard (Apr 29, 2011)

Ditto. Common problem after a few years exposure.

You might want to remove and replace with roll on bedliner material. Never tried it just a thought. 

Your oar rights are designed for the diameter of the plastic not the aluminum


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## JerkmyBait (Jun 14, 2011)

My buddy has some that are probably close to 20 years old and they are cracked to hell all up and down the entire length of the shaft. They still work fine, I wouldn't worry about it.


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## mikepart (Jul 7, 2009)

wildh2onriver said:


> Seen it countless times. I wouldn't own a Carlisle oar and haven't for over 15 years. The only way to fix them is to toss them into the trash and start over with a premium line of oars.


If you are going to throw away perfectly good Carlisles because the plastic is cracking please let me know what dumpster you are using.


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## fishpyro (Aug 26, 2009)

Duck tape can fix all your problems.


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## wildh2onriver (Jul 21, 2009)

mikepart said:


> If you are going to throw away perfectly good Carlisles because the plastic is cracking please let me know what dumpster you are using.


The biggest reason I'd throw them out or donate them (you) or a worthy charity, is because they suck. You will bend or break them in situations that occasionally come up in class III+.
They are entry level oars, from my experience.


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## caseybailey (Mar 11, 2008)

wildh2onriver said:


> The biggest reason I'd throw them out or donate them (you) or a worthy charity, is because they suck. You will bend or break them in situations that occasionally come up in class III+.
> They are entry level oars, from my experience.


Carlisle oars have been the backbone of oar rigs for decades. Funny how something that still works should be thrown away because it isn't cute anymore.


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## pinemnky13 (Jun 4, 2007)

I have freinds who use them and let me tell you on some it would be better called a chasm. I upgraded last year but use my carlises for spares (its nice having 2) try the bed liner and let us now how it goes


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## wildh2onriver (Jul 21, 2009)

caseybailey said:


> Carlisle oars have been the backbone of oar rigs for decades. Funny how something that still works should be thrown away because it isn't cute anymore.


Well, I was being a little dramatic. However, they may get you down the river, but I don't trust them--had too many sketchy experiences, including broken/bent shafts. I have yet to break a cataract shaft or blade--although I've had shark bites a couple of times. So, it's not about cuteness and all about an opinion, which is worth .02 and that may be overly inflated.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

Granted they arn't sexy or the best, but I have rowed many many many class IVs with carlisles and never broke one yet (lots on low-water technical too). Might be user error on your part



wildh2onriver said:


> Well, I was being a little dramatic. However, they may get you down the river, but I don't trust them--had too many sketchy experiences, including broken/bent shafts. I have yet to break a cataract shaft or blade--although I've had shark bites a couple of times. So, it's not about cuteness and all about an opinion, which is worth .02 and that may be overly inflated.


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## wildh2onriver (Jul 21, 2009)

shappattack said:


> Granted they arn't sexy or the best, but I have rowed many many many class IVs with carlisles and never broke one yet (lots on low-water technical too). Might be user error on your part


Yeah, that must be it. I don't know why I didn't think of that. Or, maybe they aren't the best? Just grasping for straws. Anyway, they do crack cosmetically. That is definitely not sexy.


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## yesimapirate (Oct 18, 2010)

I personally run Cataracts, but I know AAA Inflatables have a heavy duty shrink wrap plastic that I've seen used to go over a pins/clips setup. It's kinda like slapping a condom on your pole. 

Or NRS Small Molded Oar Sleeve at NRSweb.com

Or duct tape. Nothing says this is my boat and I'm proud of it quite like some duct tape!


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

wildh2onriver said:


> Yeah, that must be it. I don't know why I didn't think of that. Or, maybe they aren't the best? Just grasping for straws. Anyway, they do crack cosmetically. That is definitely not sexy.


So plese tell us the story where you were rowing and you snapped a carslile and got all f-ed up and pinned your boat and someone died and lost all your gear. And please elaborate how you know that if you didn't have that carslile and had a cataract or sawyer or something else that everything would have been find and dandy. But I suppose you won't give us an actual story of how a carslile oar failed and caused a huge problem and that you know it was the oars fault and not the oarsman, but a smart ass reply instead.


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## DrBigDog (Apr 15, 2009)

*carlisle cracks*

Though it sounds too late, store your oars out of the sun.
For the cracks, try shoe goo to seal 'em.


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## wildh2onriver (Jul 21, 2009)

shappattack said:


> So plese tell us the story where you were rowing and you snapped a carslile and got all f-ed up and pinned your boat and someone died and lost all your gear. And please elaborate how you know that if you didn't have that carslile and had a cataract or sawyer or something else that everything would have been find and dandy. But I suppose you won't give us an actual story of how a carslile oar failed and caused a huge problem and that you know it was the oars fault and not the oarsman, but a smart ass reply instead.


Jeesh dude, sorry you got all butt hurt over me dissn' your babies. They are junk, but I shoulda' been more tactful I guess, didn't mean to hurt your feelings, sorry you're so sensitive and all. Kinda' fragile like a Carlisle it seems.

Are you and slave buddy's? What does elaborate mean? Is that how you fix the cracking?

Come on dude, really? Would you put those oars up against the premium oar makers?


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## hand8272 (May 24, 2011)

DrBigDog said:


> Though it sounds too late, store your oars out of the sun.
> For the cracks, try shoe goo to seal 'em.


Yeah, that's the problem I store them inside. I have been happy with them through the years just this one problem. I have Pin and Clips and I may try that bed liner idea but I think that my spare would rub too bad on my boat.


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## Stiff N' Wett (Feb 18, 2010)

Its not the best oar but its not going ro break. I've seen some old cracked carlisles not a big deal. It's a poor carpenter who blames his tools


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## billfish (Nov 22, 2009)

Stiff N' Wett said:


> Its not the best oar but its not going ro break. I've seen some old cracked carlisles not a big deal. It's a poor carpenter who blames his tools


I agree about the oars- shafts at least. It maybe my imagination, but the black ones don't seem to fall apart like the old blue or yellow. I have sworn never to buy another Carlisle shaft, but the things are cheap and they do not break. I do like the Cataracts much better.

What about blades? I have bent the crap out of Carlisle blades, and they cannot be re-staightened (w/o ultimate failure) but I still think they are a good blade for the cost. I have a harder time justifying the cost of the Cataract blades over the Carlisles, but I still buy both.

And what is a poor carpenter? Does that mean broke or crappy? I think I'm both, as well as a broke and crappy fishing guide. I usually blame the weather. No one can fix that.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

wildh2onriver said:


> Jeesh dude, sorry you got all butt hurt over me dissn' your babies. They are junk, but I shoulda' been more tactful I guess, didn't mean to hurt your feelings, sorry you're so sensitive and all. Kinda' fragile like a Carlisle it seems.
> 
> Are you and slave buddy's? What does elaborate mean? Is that how you fix the cracking?
> 
> Come on dude, really? Would you put those oars up against the premium oar makers?


Still waiting on the example of the situation where the carsisles did you wrong. p.s. we do have some cataracts too. But as I figured, it is all hot air and no substance.


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## wildh2onriver (Jul 21, 2009)

shappattack said:


> Still waiting on the example of the situation where the carsisles did you wrong. p.s. we do have some cataracts too. But as I figured, it is all hot air and no substance.


On smaller fast flowing rivers, such as the Eagle and the Arkansas, I've seen many broken Carlisle blades and shafts, operater error? Of course. I can only recall breaking a blade once, not sure, but I have bent a shaft or two (same as broken). Personally, I've never seen a Cataract shaft break, though I'm sure it can happen. Point is, in my opinion, they are far less likely to break than aluminum oars on those type of rivers and in those type of situations. Specific examples with the dates and times elude my memory. As to the cracking problem, I've had 2 or 3 that this happened to, and have seen many more. Not sure why this happens, and I really don't care as I haven't owned a Carlisle in at least 15 years.

Three problems I've had over the years with cataract oars was fiberglass splinters, magnum blades spinning in their sleeve and shark bites. The first two have been fixed and I haven't had a shark bite for years now. Maybe my skills are improving or I've just been lucky. An advantage that cataract has over Carlisle is that they float in the water if/when they come out of your hands but are still in the oarlocks, whereas Carlisle's will sink straight up and down causing more potential for oar carnage and cause the oar to pop out of the locks and potentially lose it if the leash snaps.

This is just my experience from which I base my opinion, yours may be completely different based on your experiences.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

wildh2onriver said:


> On smaller fast flowing rivers, such as the Eagle and the Arkansas, I've seen many broken Carlisle blades and shafts, operater error? Of course. I can only recall breaking a blade once, not sure, but I have bent a shaft or two (same as broken). Personally, I've never seen a Cataract shaft break, though I'm sure it can happen. Point is, in my opinion, they are far less likely to break than aluminum oars on those type of rivers and in those type of situations. Specific examples with the dates and times elude my memory. As to the cracking problem, I've had 2 or 3 that this happened to, and have seen many more. Not sure why this happens, and I really don't care as I haven't owned a Carlisle in at least 15 years.
> 
> Three problems I've had over the years with cataract oars was fiberglass splinters, magnum blades spinning in their sleeve and shark bites. The first two have been fixed and I haven't had a shark bite for years now. Maybe my skills are improving or I've just been lucky. An advantage that cataract has over Carlisle is that they float in the water if/when they come out of your hands but are still in the oarlocks, whereas Carlisle's will sink straight up and down causing more potential for oar carnage and cause the oar to pop out of the locks and potentially lose it if the leash snaps.
> 
> This is just my experience from which I base my opinion, yours may be completely different based on your experiences.


perfect response, actaul information someone can use to evaluate the product  So much of the buzz reponses are full of so much horse cock, it would be nice if we just got down to the facts and actual experiences , I am trying to get better with this myself


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## wayniac (Mar 31, 2007)

*carlisle cracking- a little history*



hand8272 said:


> This last weekend I noticed one of my Carlisle oars had some cracking in the plastic covering on the shaft. The cracks are perpendicular to the length of the oar and some you can get your fingernail in. Has anyone had any experience with this? The oar has an aluminum tubing center so I'm guessing it's still structurally sound. Any thoughts?


 I've got a few very old Carlisle shafts along with one of my original blades- I purchased in mid 80's, still around. Here's a few observations- none of which could be classified as scientific by any means:
- my early shafts took forever to even fade- much less crack- and they were the notorious red colored shafts
- my early blade (black) appears to be thicker and (possibly) tougher than the stuff I'm currently buying
- all later shafts purchased seem to have cracked and faded much earlier than my original 85's.
- on one of later shafts, I removed all the cracked plastic- leaving only the plastic under the sleeve (for sizing- and it wasn't cracked having been protected from the elements)- and still used it for a spare to this day

So I have no way of knowing exactly what's changed (if anything to be fair here) but my later Carlisles seemed to fade and crack faster in the sun. So that (may) mean they've cheaped them by not using a good plastic with an adequate amount of UV protection in the plastic. 

The blades appear to definitely be different- they 'seem' to be thinner and the plastic, compared to my (25 year old) blade seems cheaper, for lack of a better word. I'm easier on blades since I gave up pins and clips- but these blades definitely crack and chip easier- not as easy as the thicker systems out there- but every blade seems to have a limit. I still have yet to take a set of blades and wrap them with carbon fiber and finish them with a coating of urethane- can't find the time in the winter- and boating season is the time to boat. 

If you want the shafts to be covered, you can go to a heat shrink material if it bothers you that much- or duct tape as others have suggested. I've yet to move to the composite shafts- that's my next purchase- I like how light they are. I will probably- never- go with counter balanced shafts- I think the added weight has no place for the higher classes of rivers- great for floating and fishing- to much mass when you need quick strokes in my view. Especially true if you are trying to pack in your gear and save weight.

Perhaps there are plastics geeks out there who may want to weigh in on the UV concerns. I'm also wondering if the composites eventually become brittle in the sun- and give no notice when they finally shatter- something the seemingly inferior shafts wouldn't have a problem with. Has anyone seen this happen so far? Won't change my approach to buying them- just saying..... 
wayne


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## MT4Runner (Apr 6, 2012)

wayniac said:


> Perhaps there are plastics geeks out there who may want to weigh in on the UV concerns. I'm also wondering if the composites eventually become brittle in the sun- and give no notice when they finally shatter- something the seemingly inferior shafts wouldn't have a problem with. Has anyone seen this happen so far? Won't change my approach to buying them- just saying.....
> wayne


Very possible. 

If the clearcoat starts getting hazy, that's UV.
At this point, you could sand it down and refinish with a UV-inhibiting polyurethane.

Basically, the top coating becomes your sacrificial UV layer. Let UV destroy it and then replace the coating before you ever lose any strength in your fiberglass matrix to UV.

Most epoxies hate UV. Polystyrene resin isn't much better.


My oars and paddles typically live outside on the trailer all summer long, and then are inside for the winter. It's only 3+ months of exposure, but it's the most intense of the year! I guess for that reason, I can understand why some people tarp their rigs during the week while they're not on the river.


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## NickEwing (Mar 20, 2012)

*Carlisle blades breaking*

Regarding Carlisle outfitter blades: I've broken 4! The first two broke in the same pattern and NRS replaced them saying there had been a bad batch of plastic. They would not replace the third and I just broke the fourth the other day. Granted, all four of these were broken on the Main Tuolumne and the last one was in Clavey, nonetheless, that blade was nearly new and I didn't even feel the rock that I hit or pop the oar as a result. I'm going to give Carlisle a call...but I think I'm done with Carlisle blades...


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## carvedog (May 11, 2005)

Yes I have seen some bent Carlisles. One in Hell's Half Mile on the MF Salmon very recently and up close and personal. It was my bad not the oar and if it was a Cat shaft it would have exploded. How do I know? Seen two go down this way under very similar circumstance in the last few years. While my Carlisle bent I was able to still use it to finish the rapid, pulled over and straightened. Didn't take enough time to gently do this ( right above Velvet) and kinked it. I ran with it for the rest of the 95 miles just to see if it would fail. It didn't. I did get a shark bite up on Marsh Creek that I didn't even know about until we stopped at one of the four eddies on that stretch.

If you fill them with pipe insulation foam they float a lot better without relying on displacement. Tools are tools. Some people break lots of stuff. Some don't. I have been pretty careful and lucky I guess, but I don't really have much problem. So I guess high and low water Middle Fork and High water Selway and the Payettes are just class 3, since a Carlisle would obviously not work on Class 4.....

I did violently displace another oar from my raft several years ago. I swear it launched it forty or fify feet downstream in an arc that went way up in the air. Still don't know how I did that but it was something to see. We recovered the oar and put it back in with the new 'power curve' and it was fine. It's a spare now. Enough force to bend a Cobra lock though. 

Speaking of which I have a nearly new and totally straight shaft (yellow) for a 9 foot setup that I would love to trade for a 10 footer.


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## Avatard (Apr 29, 2011)

carvedog said:


> Yes I have seen some bent Carlisles. One in Hell's Half Mile on the MF Salmon very recently and up close and personal. It was my bad not the oar and if it was a Cat shaft it would have exploded. How do I know? Seen two go down this way under very similar circumstance in the last few years. While my Carlisle bent I was able to still use it to finish the rapid, pulled over and straightened. Didn't take enough time to gently do this ( right above Velvet) and kinked it. I ran with it for the rest of the 95 miles just to see if it would fail. It didn't. I did get a shark bite up on Marsh Creek that I didn't even know about until we stopped at one of the four eddies on that stretch.
> 
> If you fill them with pipe insulation foam they float a lot better without relying on displacement. Tools are tools. Some people break lots of stuff. Some don't. I have been pretty careful and lucky I guess, but I don't really have much problem. So I guess high and low water Middle Fork and High water Selway and the Payettes are just class 3, since a Carlisle would obviously not work on Class 4.....
> 
> ...


Sounds like you need a refresher of your skills


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## johnovice (Jul 17, 2009)

Hey OP, what did you end up doing? Did it work for you? (I ask because I just picked up a pair of used shafts and one has some cracks in the polyethelene tubing.) 
Thoughts (besides the bed liner, shoe gu, duct tape, ignore it): cut the tubing off (it's cracked above the sleeve) and wrap/glue polypro webbing to the aluminum shaft -- buy what glue??
Wrap/glue webbing right over the poly tubing -- what glue??
(The sleeves linked to earlier in the thread are for the smaller diameter shafts -- but might they work once the tubing is removed???)
Not trying to re-kindle any thread drift about suckiness of product.


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## carvedog (May 11, 2005)

I think I am going to cut the tubing off the bent kinked shaft I have and put it on the cracked covering shaft I have. Drip a little glue or Ptex and it will be good for a spare. 
A buddy has one of his wrapped in duct tape for a spare too. 

Just please don't go down the river with cracked pieces falling off.


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## hand8272 (May 24, 2011)

I haven't done anything to try and fix them. So far they have only cracked horizontally to the length of the shaft so the plastic is not coming off. I'm not really concerned with it now. I think they are structurally fine so I'm just going to run them.


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