# December Deso



## Bill Bones (Nov 26, 2020)

Hi All, first-time poster here. I have a launch on Deso for this Friday, December 4th. Brr. Planning to go down in two 16' boats with a crew of four. I've rowed Desolation a few times at flows between 2,500 cfs and 20,000 cfs. We're looking at flows of 1,500-1,800 cfs for the trip, which doesn't have me horribly concerned.

What _is_ keeping me up at night, though, is the prospect of freezing in. The NWS is calling for temperatures ranging from 18-50 degrees in the bottom of the canyon. We're prepared for the cold (dry suits, overalls, muck boots, 0 degree bags, firewood, etc.) but after reading an old post about someone getting frozen in and helicoptered out, I've been looking for more information on what might constitute a trigger point to call off the trip. I've called the river rangers, talked to guide friends, called up Red Tail Aviation, and everyone seems to be as unsure as me. 

Does anyone out there in the worldly webs have any advice or any idea of how long it takes flat water to freeze over in those temps at those flows? I'd strongly prefer to carry on with this trip, but I'd even _more _strongly prefer not to pile my frozen-ass gear in the bushes for the season and hike back to Sand Wash...


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## B4otter (Apr 20, 2009)

Highly doubt you'll have any issues w/ice. Just hasn't been cold enough for long enough... Sub-freezing for several weeks w/lows in single digits or low teens usually required...


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## MSC (Dec 1, 2020)

Someone posted a pic to the Utah Rafters FB group today that showed the Green River at Split Mountain starting to ice over. So even if Deso itself doesn't freeze over, you might have to deal with ice chunks floating down the river with you.
I don't have experience with Deso itself during the winter, but I have spent some time in the winter on the daily section at the end of the run. It seems like a solid week of sub-20 at night temperatures and not much above 35 during the day would change the river there from being perfectly fine to having 5-15 ft of ice lining the banks.


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## Sparks1000 (Jul 5, 2018)

I did Lodore early November and the sides of the river were iced over. Deso is a little more wide open and gets more sun. But we do have a fairly good cold front pushing through. So I guess I will offer no help. I would probably call it but that’s just me...


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## raymo (Aug 10, 2008)

Bill Bones said:


> Hi All, first-time poster here. I have a launch on Deso for this Friday, December 4th. Brr. Planning to go down in two 16' boats with a crew of four. I've rowed Desolation a few times at flows between 2,500 cfs and 20,000 cfs. We're looking at flows of 1,500-1,800 cfs for the trip, which doesn't have me horribly concerned.
> 
> What _is_ keeping me up at night, though, is the prospect of freezing in. The NWS is calling for temperatures ranging from 18-50 degrees in the bottom of the canyon. We're prepared for the cold (dry suits, overalls, muck boots, 0 degree bags, firewood, etc.) but after reading an old post about someone getting frozen in and helicoptered out, I've been looking for more information on what might constitute a trigger point to call off the trip. I've called the river rangers, talked to guide friends, called up Red Tail Aviation, and everyone seems to be as unsure as me.
> 
> Does anyone out there in the worldly webs have any advice or any idea of how long it takes flat water to freeze over in those temps at those flows? I'd strongly prefer to carry on with this trip, but I'd even _more _strongly prefer not to pile my frozen-ass gear in the bushes for the season and hike back to Sand Wash...


Welcome Bill, I would go. Looking at the big picture, weather radar(satellite), starting on the 4th through the 14th of December, clear skies, no serious weather concerns, that I can see. Day time temperatures 45° to 50°, night time temperatures 25° to 30°. Because of the clear skies the temperatures will drop pretty quick, once the sun starts to goes down in the afternoon, because the lack of clouds to hold the heat in from the daytime sun. Probably some ice along the banks in the morning, in shaded canyon areas. But no big cold front to blanket the area to hold daytime temperatures in the 20° to 30° for days to freeze the river. Looks like a pretty stable air mass holding over the area for those 10 days starting on the 4th of Dec. Through the 14th of Dec. In fact I did not see any big weather system past the 14th for a few more days. Those daytime temps of 45° to 50° will keep the river running pretty well. Have fun, dress warm and have a couple shots of JD for me.


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## Bill Bones (Nov 26, 2020)

Thanks folks. Still not decided but I'll let you know how it goes either way. Raymo, don't worry--if we go down there will be plenty of shots taken on your behalf!


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## JamMasterJame (Mar 22, 2013)

Bring dynamite.


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## Bill Bones (Nov 26, 2020)

Dynamite is right. Talked to Deso ranger Cory and it sounds like at least one party has already had a misadventure with ice down there. Trip is off, thanks all for chiming in. On to the next big idea... what does everybody think about December on the lower San Juan? In a 10' boat this time.


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## sethlor (Apr 29, 2009)

Hi Bill, 
I think you'll have a great time. My family (me, wife and 6 yr old) just got off 5 days on Ruby-Horsethief over Thankgiving. It had similar temperatures that you're looking at and the only ice we saw was the puddles along Black Rocks. Otherwise, bring lots of firewood and down because it's cold at night and night starts real early! Enjoy the outdoors for it's going to be a long winter.
Cheers,
Seth


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## trevko (Jul 7, 2008)

This was from just upstream at Ouray NWR on 12/6


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## tommy2stp (Jan 15, 2021)

Hey man...I'm a newcomer here. I wondering how your Deso trip went, if you made it out? I ran it the week before you, I took out on December 1 and there was occasional shore ice and some in the backwater, but no threat of any 'locking up' yet. The river was nearly vacant, I spent 9 days on the river and saw one other raft, and a duo of kayakers. The weather was cold but manageable for me, the canyon was mostly shady this time of year. How was it for you? Were you hunting? 
Cheers


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## Bill Bones (Nov 26, 2020)

Hey Tommy, we did not end up going down. I talked to the ranger a couple of days before our launch and he told me someone was frozen in at Flat Canyon, so I pulled the plug. I understand that a party that launched a day before us froze in not far downstream from Sand Wash and ended up having to cache their entire kit and walk out. Sounds like your trip was great, was it a hunt? We were aiming to hunt, but I was _not_ aiming to leave $20,000 of kit under some bushes...


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## tommy2stp (Jan 15, 2021)

Hey BillBones, that is crazy. I had heard that it iced over the first week of December but I almost didn't believe it because we saw so little ice. Glad you didn't venture out, and I'm with ya....it'd be tough to leave my gear stashed in the wilderness until spring. Yes, we hunted and took one bison out with us.


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## Johnzstz (Jun 3, 2019)

tommy2stp said:


> Hey BillBones, that is crazy. I had heard that it iced over the first week of December but I almost didn't believe it because we saw so little ice. Glad you didn't venture out, and I'm with ya....it'd be tough to leave my gear stashed in the wilderness until spring. Yes, we hunted and took one bison out with us.


 I would love to see photos of the Buffalo and the raft! How many boats and coolers were required for the meat?


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