# Soul Waterman 303



## PaddleTim (Aug 20, 2017)

Has anyone seen the new boat Soul is thinking about building, the 303. 10' long, super fast, slicy ends. Looks like a blast but I have heard horrible things about their outfitting and plastic quality. None of the other designs look like a better take on what is already out there by larger manufacturers but this looks like it could be the long slicy thing I have been looking for. Yes I could find an old Outburst or savage scorpion but they all have displacement hulls. They are trying to get 50 preorders before they commit to making the mold. What do you guys think of the design and soul kayaks in general?

https://www.soulwaterman.com/products/303

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6R6Hj9Uedr4


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## Electric-Mayhem (Jan 19, 2004)

I've been seeing buzz about it a bunch lately. That looks like a really neat concept and I'd love to try one out. I think that might be the ideal Grand Canyon boat.

I just picked up a Riot Hammer, which is about the closest boat you are gonna find to this one. Its still a foot shorter and not as slicy, but is still a long fast boat with a planing hull. It remains to be seen whether the 303 is a huge hit, but I guess we'll see.

I bought a used Jackson Monstar last year (I'm a big dude) when I got back into kayaking again and I'm just not clicking with it as much as I imagined and I definitely missed some of my old boats I had. I agree that the little spud boats are great for an ideal playspot, but for just surfing and playing down the river they aren't all that fun. I'm not surprised there is a resurgance of longer slicier boats.

The 303 seems to be the most extreme version of that idea and its a truly new design that hasn't been done before. I don't think there has ever been a 10' planning hulled whitewater kayak and I'm intrigued. I guess we'll see if other companies come out with anything similar.


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## BrianK (Feb 3, 2005)

I got a soul waterman terrible two to paddle my kid around. I pre-ordered the boat online just based on the concept. It's the lowest quality boat I've ever seen. It has thin plastic with very sharp edges that scratch you when you enter and exit the boat. It has the worst outfitting in a modern kayak by a large margin. For example, the back band adjusts with a generic cam strap riveted to the boat. It seems like this cam strap was just thrown in, because the angles are all wrong. This causes the strap to bind and fold whenever you try to adjust the backband. The seat is cheap plastic that I wouldn't trust to withstand any stress. Also, the ergonomics seem like an afterthought, and it is not natural to sit in like most other current boats. All and all it feels cheap and rushed. 

This isn't that big of a deal for the terrible two because it's a specialty boat for easy flatwater water/class II paddling with the kid. There's no other boat like it and it has and will continue to get use for family paddling. At the same time, I'm pretty disappointed in the quality overall. 

Based on my experience with the terrible two, I would not even consider a soul waterman for any solo kayak. Especially if you want a boat to run harder water or where performance is important. 

Full disclosure - I don't know if they use the same outfitting style on all their boats or if the outfitting has changed. The terrible two was one of their first designs. However, with the terrible two, it seems clear that they were focused on hitting shipping deadlines more than they were focused on delivering a quality product.


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## BrianP (Nov 13, 2011)

Corran designs boats that are fun for him to paddle. I had a dragorossi mafia that was fun in class III but instantly kicked the shit out of you in anything remotely IV/V. At 150lbs I was pushing it and it only came in one size. I'm always a person that says it's the paddler not the boat but that kayak was my exception to the rule.

Sent from my XT1565 using Mountain Buzz mobile app


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## PaddleTim (Aug 20, 2017)

BrianP said:


> Corran designs boats that are fun for him to paddle. I had a dragorossi mafia that was fun in class III but instantly kicked the shit out of you in anything remotely IV/V. At 150lbs I was pushing it and it only came in one size. I'm always a person that says it's the paddler not the boat but that kayak was my exception to the rule.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Mountain Buzz mobile app


That dragorossi mafia does look like a crappy boat. I think a lot of his designs are the kayak equivalent to a "concept car". They have some good ideas but pushed to the extreme so that they are not practical. 

In my opinion the 303 does not look quirky like many of his other boats though. I like how slicy the tail is. I ended up squashing the tail of my Large Jackson Antix because I thought it had too much volume in the back and the results were an amazing improvement. That looks even more thin and longer.


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## Electric-Mayhem (Jan 19, 2004)

BrianP said:


> Corran designs boats that are fun for him to paddle. I had a dragorossi mafia that was fun in class III but instantly kicked the shit out of you in anything remotely IV/V. At 150lbs I was pushing it and it only came in one size. I'm always a person that says it's the paddler not the boat but that kayak was my exception to the rule.
> 
> Sent from my XT1565 using Mountain Buzz mobile app


Thats interesting how different we percieved that boat. I'm at least 100lbs. heavier then you (definitely am now...can't remember how much I weighed back then) and I had a Mafia and I didn't feel like it was a handful in harder whitewater. I did eventually upgrade to the Critical Mass (and its still hanging in my garage) but I did fine in the Mafia in stuff up to V-. I ran all the usual "easy class V" stuff like Narrows in Clear Creek, Bailey, and the like. I think the hardest thing I ran in it was either the Embudo or Big Sandy...both of which were at the edge of my abilities...










You are right, however, in that most of Corran's boats are designed for him first and anyone else second. For some reason they always clicked with me though and I've been a fan. I'll be honest, none of the other Soul Waterman lineup seems all that interesting to me. Perhaps the Funky Monkey or the F Bomb, which are very similar design to the 303 just a few inches shorter and with a bit more volume and intended to compete with stuff like the LL Braapp!, Jackson Antix, and Dagger Axiom boats.

I'm intrigued by the extra length and I agree that playing every feature on the river sounds like fun. I think this will be a great big water playboat for runs like the Grand Canyon where there aren't many traditional play spots but lots of waves to catch on the fly.

Like you, I think I'd save myself a few bucks and get the "Hooptie" version and just make a custom minicell foam seat. Corran has always tried to innovate with his outfitting, but he has never really been successful with making a nice, well built, simple but comfortable outfitting setup. I still think my favorite one was what came in my Glide (also still hanging in my garage). It had a large plastic piece with a wide trough that had a seat module that fit inside held down by straps. It made it super simple to adjust the seat on the fly and you could even raise the seat by putting foam under the module. Plenty comfortable and supported the hull well. Can't find any pictures.

I'm reluctant to join what is essentially a crowd funding effort to make this boat, but if people seem to enjoy it I might jump on it later next year.


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## PaddleTim (Aug 20, 2017)

I decided to go for it. Just preordered. You just click COD in the payment option then they only collect if/when they get enough preorders. I feel better about that than handing over the money and hoping to get a refund later. I would not have done it if that was the case.


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## Electric-Mayhem (Jan 19, 2004)

PaddleTim said:


> That dragorossi mafia does look like a crappy boat. I think a lot of his designs are the kayak equivalent to a "concept car". They have some good ideas but pushed to the extreme so that they are not practical.


I hate to fall on the "Corran" bandwagon since he's very fond of pointing out how innovative he is and how all the other boat designers are stealing his ideas...but if you look at a lot of the designs for creekers that have come out, they incorporate a lot of the same features like front rocker starting behind the knees, a deck designed to push you through stuff rather then stall, the stern hull tappered straight to the end starting right behind the cockpit and it had some cool safety features like the snorkle thing. Corran started some of this with the Riot Big Gun and carried it through to Dragorossi.

When the Mafia came out, most of the other creek designs were designed to provide a nice controlled landing and would actually stall so that you had time to think about the next drop. A bunch of the new boats like the Waka Tuna/Gangsta, Pyranha 9r, and others are designed to push you through rapids and get you away from the landing zone quickly. This is why they do so well in extreme racing. The one big difference is most of these new boats are much higher volume and a bit longer then the Mafia, but a lot of the design styles are similar. I guess the Critical Mass is closer to a lot of them since it actually has that length and volume.

Mafia









Critical Mass









Pretty Decent size difference between the Mafia and CM









Waka Tuna









Pyranha 9r









Compare that to something like the Dagger Nomad or Liquid Logic Jefe and the differences were pretty stark...

Dagger Nomad









LL Jefe









I'm not saying that one design is better or worse, just that the Mafia and Critical Mass were designs more similar to what is popular today then then they were to boats that came out at the same time. 

I disagree that it was a crappy boat...it just didn't paddle like anything else in its time. I know I had to stay on my toes because you could really tell the difference in how much speed you carried through hard water. If you weren't used to it, you'd find yourself going over the next drop before you were ready for it.

Sorry for the essay...I got bored and thought it would be cool to point out some similarities between the Drago stuff and modern creekers. So, I begrudgingly admit, Corran seems to have been ahead of his time yet again.


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## PaddleTim (Aug 20, 2017)

I was thinking about how the mafia rocker profile looks like the 9r but the "crappy" part is more about how ocward many of his boats look. Good concepts but coward scale or execution. I am not trying to come off as a pro here. Just a paddler making observations.


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## Electric-Mayhem (Jan 19, 2004)

Yeah....it is certainly an awkward looking boat. Corran gets an idea in his head and runs with it and it can come up with some pretty monstrous looking designs. Pretty much everything from his Savage Design years and about half of his designs from Riot and Dragorossi. I still think the Glide is one of the sleeker and cooler looking kayaks ever designed. No idea if the cross hatches on the bottom actually do anything, but it does make a cool noise when you go over rocks. This 303 almost looks like a much longer version of the Glide...almost.


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## NateW (Sep 27, 2016)

@Electric - great post!


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## jmacn (Nov 20, 2010)

That video makes moving to Montreal seem like a good life choice. Corren is most definitely a true waterman. I think that 303 looks badass!!


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## Corran (Jul 17, 2006)

It's interesting the take people have on some products. In that thread was a paddler who felt that the Terrible Two was the worst quality or cheapest boat he'd ever seen. Interestingly, another paddler (for those that know Will Mattos) who got a TT (and used to paddle professionally in the past for two competing companies at one point during his career) said the TT was the best thought out, and superbly executed boat he'd ever seen - from concept to finish and quality. He was heaping praises on the boat. Beauty is clearly in the eye of the beholder.

I can actually address some of the "cheap" concerns that were brought up with some real numbers.

The CNC machined, anodized dress washers we use on the boat cost $1 each. A steel fender washer that almost all the companies use cost about $0.05 a boat. The philips pan head screws most companies use cost about $0.10 a boat. Our machine dress screws are about $0.50 a boat. On the Terrible Two, we have a total of 20 of these. Thats $30 of pure cost in JUST these aesthetic touches compared to what would cost $3 if we used the screws and washers everyone else uses.

The "cheap" cam buckles he referred to for the backband are top end stainless and cost $2.50 each. A snowboard ratchet buckle and strap costs about $1. The plastic jam cleats used by some companies cost about $0.5 each. Our "cheap" system is more than 2x the cost of the ones compared to. Would you tie your boat down with a snowboard ratchet strap and then do 70 mph on the highway and trust it? I sure trust the cam buckles I use to tie my boats down - it's a much stronger and more infinitely adjustable system. 

The plastic that most of the US manufacturers use costs between $1.5/lbs to $1.90/lbs. Ours costs almost $3/lbs. It's almost two times the price! It's also stiffer and stronger than the other plastics on the market. You get what you pay for.

The dual density, heat formed foam seat also costs just under 2x the price of a formed plastic seat. We did this to have a warm, comfortable, shock absorbing seat that can adjust in seconds.

I KNOW exactly what these things cost - we costed all this out, and I made the decision that I wanted the BEST quality boats out on the market. It saddens me that some think all this "looks" cheap, but I can assure you it's not - it's the exact opposite. I could halve my production cost by switching to the materials and fittings everyone else uses. Literally half...

To address another point, the thickness of the Terrible Two - it IS as was pointed out, for taking 4yr olds down class 2 rivers. It's not for dropping 30' waterfalls into rocks, and if you're doing that with this boat you have some serious mental issues that need addressing. 

The yellow TT is made as light as is physically possible so that a single mother can carry the boat to the river, with paddles, snacks, jackets and all while herding a 4yr old that's tantamount to herding a cat. For many people, this key light weight is the difference between going paddling at all with a small child. In fact the weight issue is such a big one that despite the low weight of the TT for a tandem, we still sell a fair number of carbon versions of this, as particularly women need something even lighter.

There is simply no point making the boat 7mm thick like a creek boat (that is something we do on our creek boat). The TT varies from 3-4mm thick depending on the area in question and this is ample for the task and needs of a boat that will be doing little more than scraping over rocks lazily on a class 1-2 outing. The Orange boat is slightly heavier and stronger for clubs or people who are just abusive of their equipment, but even it remains essentially a light boat - build the boat for the task.

Our other boats are outfitted using the same high end materials as the TT, but weights are specific to the boats needs. For example the 303 and Funky Monkey are similar is overall size, but they are not intended to be used in the same sorts of environments, and so the FM is heavier than the 303 - it needs to be able to take a pounding. The 303 does not. Similarly, the yellow ones we make lighter for people who will be using the boat on rivers that are more water than rock, and the orange ones for people who paddle rocky rivers - pick the correct boat for where and how you paddle. The Chaos Monkey is in turn even thicker (and thus heavier) than the Funky Monkey as its an all out creek boat. But even this we offer in two weights - one for the person who's pounding their way down everything they can find and the other, as one customer said to me "is something I can actually carry in my old age without putting out my back" - to this person a lighter boat for creeking is more important than an ultra strong one - once more get the right tool for the job you need.

I hope this sheds some light on how we build our boats, and the decisions we made for each kind of boat and their intended end use.

And now for some 303 eye candy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6zAOxaamhY

Have a great season folks.

Corran


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## PaddleTim (Aug 20, 2017)

Corran, thanks for the long reply. I have now had my 303 for a couple weeks now and I think it is the best quality plastic of any kayak that I own. This is the only Soul boat that I own so I can't speak to previous models and I don't know if things have changed. All I know is that this plastic is great.


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## NateW (Sep 27, 2016)

I saw a terrible two in action, and it looked like an amazingly well designed boat. I was watching a dad surf a wave with his young kid, and he was easily able to correct the boat and say on the wave. From what I've seen of the Duo, once you're on edge there is no stopping the thing from turning downstream. 

Is the mold to the TT still lost?


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## Electric-Mayhem (Jan 19, 2004)

I saw some pictures of a fleet of 303's and Funky Monkey's getting ready to go down the Grand Canyon. Supposedly Corran is on the trip too. I believe its happening right now. Should be some pretty epic videos and pictures from that trip. Kinda jealous. Might have to see if he's coming through Colorado so I can try one.

He had a limited run of Blue 303's and I was sorely tempted to put my name on one.

Nate... I think the Mini-Me was the one that had the mold break. I know he was trying to get enough pre-orders together to make a new mold for it.

The Terrible Two is on their website, so I think there are some still available. Its a very different boat from the Duo, as the front cockpit is designed for a small child and the Duo is designed for two adults and the design needs to be different because of that. Not saying the Duo couldn't be designed better, but design restrictions are different for the two craft.


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## Paull (Jan 29, 2021)

Just bought my first Soul Waterman kayak, been paddling a fair few years now and had kayaks from every main manufacturer. Totally disagree with the comments about quality, this is by far the best quality kayak I've had, and I've had a fair few. From the plastic to the fittings to the outfitting it oozes quality.


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## sporkfromork (Dec 16, 2020)

Where the F do you get a Soul boat


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## Electric-Mayhem (Jan 19, 2004)

As far as I know...just from their website or direct sales with Corran himself.... or the used market. No distributors or sales in shops as far as I know.


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