# Death at Union Street wave in Denver



## ski_kayak365 (Dec 7, 2003)

Not that there has been any real high water there, any change a new crack or part of concrete has shifted and created a foot entrapment. Would like to know whats in the spot now though, in for furture notice.

My thoughts and prayers to the family.


----------



## wrob (Aug 18, 2004)

As hard as all of the things mentioned above may be to believe, there it is. Yes, a little river sense goes a long way, but dont be so quick to judge. Rather, be aware, best defense. What this event points out is that events like this happen. And we dont get to know all the details.


----------



## kkeane7 (Aug 18, 2004)

I Paddle down there quite a bit (its close to home) and there is no shift in concrete that I can tell, the eddy on the beach side has become very Powerfull (this year I have had to pull 2 young people out with my boat) I think the build up of sediment has made this eddy a bit stronger. For a swimmer without a PFD you would need to swim towards the current to get flushed out, and even if you are a strong swimmer if you are tired this could get you if you dont understand the water. I did read the article in the paper and it quoted a sheridan police officer who said "helmets and Lifejackets are recommended" I thought Lifejackets were required by state law?? No matter what the flows people need to respect the water and where a pfd. I see so many Kids that seem to think it is water world.....Its not. Prayers and thoughts with the family


----------



## cayo (Mar 20, 2005)

It's hard to imagine someone drowning there at 250,the theory about panic in the squirrely eddyline seems most plausable,even thenif you just let it feed you back into the current and wash down a short ways you can swim to the side where the eddy is weaker.Yet another case of the media being clueless about rivers ,they portrayed it as high water.Another baffling aspect is how it took so long to find him,just follow the current the eddies on river right on the two drops below Hollywood are catch all type eddies ,thats where he was.Another possibility ,he hit his head on something?
I can personally atest to the fact that strange and powerful forces exist on that drop at higher flows.Once about 10 years ago I was playing there at 1300,so were some pro teams ,Riot in thier little yellow school bus and I think Wave Sport.I got on Holywood in a ducky and got worked,, pros were cheering for me as i did a good job hanging on briefly,then the boat got completely vertical and I dump trucked out the back,right into the sweet spot it was like a siphon ,it sucked me down and violently bodyslammed me into the riverbed then dragged me on the bottom all the way to about 10 feet above the next drop.I was under long enough people started getting concerned,one dude launched into rescue mode,when I surfaced my boat was right there and I still somehow had my paddle,I jumped back in and made the eddy below the drop.2nd scariest call in 12 years boating,freekin' embarrassing to drown at Union,if your'e a boater.


----------



## retroracer (May 30, 2004)

*Go ahead and wade, good luck with that.*

<And this happened at 6pm, 2 hours before sunset. Even if emergency rescue or people passing by had only 1 hour of sunset left when they started looking, they couldn't find the body 75 yards from where he fell in? The bushes overhand the water a bit, but you can *just wade through the water*. >


Easier said than done. The crews initially on scene and the following trained dive team members did an amazing job of searching the top three drops and the both sides of the shore line all the way down to past the drop after the last drop. There is embedded barb wire in the eddy of the top drop--deeply silted in? that could have held a body for a period of time. The water was diverted for some time prior to the night time break (at approx 12:45a.m.) and then returned to normal, hoping to change whatever was not allowing the victim to surface. He was found first thing in the morning (when the recovery operation resumed at approx 5:30 a.m.) on the sandbar in the eddy of the 2nd drop and then a "wading" rescue was performed. Divers that evening though, with 100 lbs of additional weight on their bodies were barely able to maintain any semblance of an organized underwater search pattern due to the force of the top eddy. Tough call, tough circumstances, great work by the Fire guys and gals. Just goes to show how far some good education and the appropriate gear for your environment can go. Take a SWR class this fall or in the spring. You never know when your experience combined with your education can make the difference for yourself or mates.


----------



## cstork (Oct 13, 2003)

Wow. Thanks for the additional info, retroracer. That sounds like quite a recovery effort. 

I guess there must be a pin spot in the muck of the pool.


----------



## cayo (Mar 20, 2005)

While he may have been pinned on something and then dislodged with a change in flow,I'm skeptical. You mentioned barb wire but said it was in the pool ABOVE where he is known to have swum.Is it possible he washed into the catch all eddyand was floating below and concealed by the flotsam eg small logs,froth,sticks ,trash,skanky foam ,etc.,common to that eddy,add to that it was getting dark,with change in flow he moved to where he was found.
I generally respect the professionalism of the fire and rescue teams on most things,but from reading numerous accounts of river rescues and first hand experience,feel that their understanding of river dynamics is poor compared to most experienced boaters.That is understandable,we are very familiar with these forces,encountering them regularly,hell playin' in em',versus you took a 3 day course two years ago. Maybe they should employ a safety kayaker of some sort in these situations instead of jumping to the most complicated solution,LISTEN to people who understand whats going on exhaust the simpler methods first.just my 2 cents


----------



## Don (Oct 16, 2003)

*2 cents*

Cayo, thanks for your 2 cents- but this is no time to be pointing fingers. The search and rescue protical is much larger than a simple body recovery. They also need to make sure they are not put into harms way. For them it's like running into a burning building.

Everyone is doing what they can to get the word out and inform the public on the real life dangers of moving water. Remember folks- we all have years of training here. Playing with moving water is second nature for an experienced kayaker, but for the average person on the street it's as foreign as reading Arabic.

Yesterday I was on the phone about six times with the folks from the Post. It finally took drawing a diagram, faxing it over, and step by step reviewing every aspect to get the art and text layout right. http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_4227785

When I started as lifeguard on the ocean I knew what a riptide was from stories, buy it took time for me to spot one. It took even longer to feel one starting once I was in the water. Rivers work the same way. People know they are dangerous, but they don't always see the danger. Let alone do they know how to react to it. Remember life doesn't always give you a do-over.


----------



## gh (Oct 13, 2003)

Don, I am pretty sure that link is in Arabic but your point is well taken.


----------



## Hartje (Oct 16, 2003)

Horrible stuff, this. 

That spot is still weird at 250. I used to paddle and instruct there a lot at low flows. My concern with a swimmer w/o a lifejacket at 250 cfs is getting hung up on the riff-raff that is underneath Hollywood, after getting taken down while trying to swim the eddy fence. 

I was surfing Hollywood in 98 or 99 @ like 800cfs, got worked in the hole, swam and then it still took me for a couple of unexpected and nasty body surfs -- i.e. coughing up chunks of foam coolers and other SP flotsam. I do remember an unfriendly river-bottom from that experience.


----------



## cstork (Oct 13, 2003)

If the body was just floating on the surface, even in that large debris filled eddy, I'm pretty sure the rescue team would have found it. They aren't idiots--that was probably the first place they looked. 

I like cayo's point about having water rescue teams use a kayaker, but I bet it is awful work and lousy pay--get called any time and stay on the river until 12:45am? I guess you do it to help, but after a few incidents, it would really start to drag. Perhaps CWWA can see if hooking up some expert kayakers with Golden/Denver water rescue has possibilities.


----------



## psu96 (May 9, 2006)

these boys will grow up with the trauma and guilt of watching their dad die saving their lives and you guys are talking about what????


----------



## Caspian (Oct 14, 2003)

Wow, a paper printed something sensible and educational about how moving water works and creates hazards. It might be a first. Well done, Don.


----------



## cayo (Mar 20, 2005)

Guess I'm just a stubborn dickhead.I still maintain that it SHOULD NOT take9 firetrucks ,14 ambulances,10 cop cars,3 news helicopters*,and a dive team , 2 days to find someone at UNION AT 250. There must be some flukey circumstance.Not pointing fingers ,they did not cause the incident.



*being hyperbolic


----------



## gh (Oct 13, 2003)

Thats odd, when I brought up the link yesterday it was some unreadable text but now it brings up the article.


----------



## ski_kayak365 (Dec 7, 2003)

9 firetrucks / 14 ambulances?? What they hell do you need that many for a 1 person rescue???


----------



## mvhyde (Feb 3, 2004)

*Englewood needs to clean it up.....*

I went down to Union and walked it and boated it last weekend. Some of the things I noticed are:

A) The vegetation has grown in nicely in the last 8 years

B) There is a lot of debris, natural and man-made

C) Excessive amounts of sediment

The problem with the man-made structures are that they are magnets for debris of any sort and for catching sedimentary deposits that wash downstream and come in from the storm drains.

The City of Englewood needs to get their act together with the US Army Corps of Engineers and any other decision makers involved in managing the South Platte on that section and perform a clean-up of the debris areas and remove the sediments build-up. I know that some environmental types and Trout Unlimited might cringe at that, but seeing as they are man-made structures, we've already mucked up the environment.

Mixing man-made structures with natural vegetation is nice as it reduces the ugliness of the structures, but it does bring on new hazards to swimmers and boaters alike. Man-made structures, unless they are anchored deeply into the earth have a tendancy to wash out at the base from river hydraulic action. Combine that with the replanting of native and non-native plant species, such as the varieties of willow or cottonwood varieties, you start creating root strainers. 

I'm not sure where that guy was found after he drowned, but I am sure that along with not having any floatation, that the current state of the river greatly attributed to his death. Maybe I am wrong......but I still think that area along with several others from C-470 & Santa Fe all the way to Confluence need some serious clean-up and dredging (both above and below all the man-made structures).


----------



## rasdoggy (Jan 31, 2005)

From my experience anytime you have a water rescue/recovery you tend to have all available fire/rescue & ambulance crews show up as part of their ongoing training.

You also need multiple med type people onscene just in case, we had 1 med crew per 2 diver/tenders anytime we were doing a search/recovery.


----------



## psu96 (May 9, 2006)

you guys need a tissue....why don't you join up or is it fun to put up posts and complain about things out of your control...don't PM me with your justifications about learning something... your just part of a bigger problem


----------



## cstork (Oct 13, 2003)

Sorry to offend. 

By the way, if I die on the river, you are welcome to analyze and make judgements of what I did, good or bad. Call it like it is. I don't need any violins. And feel free to make jokes about it. I like the Hunter S. Thompsen approach. 

I guess it would be different if a friend died, especially if I failed in the rescue. I'd prefer no jokes and less judgement, but you are still welcome to analyze what I did, good or bad. It may be painful, but life is hard.


----------



## mvhyde (Feb 3, 2004)

*well.... 2 more cents worth*

Basic things one really needs....

1. Helmets
2. PFD's
3. Whistles
4. A basic course in swiftwater survival and rescue
5. The commonsense to not let your freaking kids play in river hydraulics without proper equipment and supervision

I really have no sympathy for the guy that drowned, not one freaking iota for him or his family. I'm glad he saved his kids, but the bottomline is that he was a complete idiot for being there, for letting his kids in there in the first place.

I have a 5-1/2 yr old who is a paddler. He never gets on the water without his equipment and it being in working order. I make him do a couple rolls and a couple wet exits before we even go down the river. When we get to a nice rapid, I usually will make him jump in a couple times and toss the throwbag to him and work on river safety and rescue. But first and foremost, I never take my eyes off him or let him do stupid acts of ignorance.


----------



## J (Nov 6, 2003)

That is pretty harsh mvhyde. 

You understand the power of the river. 

Unfortunately, this guy did not. If he did, he probably wouldn't have let his kids play there. 

Give him and his family a break as he paid the ultimate price for his mistake.


----------



## psu96 (May 9, 2006)

mvhyde...no one asked for your sympathy but thanks for giving us a glimpse of your character...and nice role modeling for that kid you never lose sight of...or let him do stupid acts of ignorance must be nice to be in such control all the time...


----------



## mvhyde (Feb 3, 2004)

*pfffffffffffffffffft*

you know nothing of my character...and like I implied, controlling the situation to the point you can will limit the damage, you don't like it...stfu


----------



## mvhyde (Feb 3, 2004)

*pfffffffffffffffffft*

you know nothing of my character...and like I implied, controlling the situation to the point you can will limit the damage, you don't like it...stfu


----------



## psu96 (May 9, 2006)

oh but I do....

I really have no sympathy for the guy that drowned, not one freaking iota for him or his family. you dont like it stfu...sound fimiliar again nice role modeling


----------

