# Deciding on a tarp/canopy



## OMGitsCasey (Mar 31, 2016)

I'm looking for some insight and opinions on shade/shelter tarps. Right now, I'm debating between the Kelty Noah's Tarp 16, The Kelty Big Shady Canopy, or the Timber Ridge Tarp offered at Costco. Do you Buzzards out there have experience with any of these, or have better ideas? The most expensive of these three is $150, so I'm not really considering something like the NRS River Wing. The main reason for needing one is for an April 30 Smith River trip with a group of 8, for which I'm planning on having some rain and/or snow, but I will also use it in the future for sun shade. I'd love some feedback, and bonus points for photos!
Cheers!


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## Wallrat (Jan 19, 2021)

I have the Kelty Noah 16. I can recommend it without any reservations. For the price, I was amazed at how well designed and solid it is.
We used it on a Middle/Main trip. It might be a bit small for 8 people in the desert, or you’ll all be crowded under there for the shade. For us it was great.


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## Willie 1.5 (Jul 9, 2013)

Noah tarps are solid choices, not familiar with the other two. They require more work to anchor securely and are nearly impossible to remove all the flapping in wind. (Which is annoying, and when a tarp flaps, it's working on getting away from you) 

If your more than a casual camper, I'd recommend sucking it up and buying the nrs wing or a dragon fly tarp. Easier to pitch and keep up, and better coverage. Also highly recommend using 20'-30' loop straps for anchor lines. Nrs wing + loop straps = cost of Dragon fly (roughly. In the past they came with straps, don't see it mentioned on website currently)


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## Susswein (Aug 24, 2020)

Another thumbs up for the noah tarp.


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## protechie (Jun 16, 2005)

I spent a lot of time going back and forth between different tarps to buy. Right now I have a Kelty Noah (I think the 12 but it might even be the smaller one) and a Nemo Shadowcaster 165. I definitely prefer the quaternary cut of the Shadowcaster, it creates a lot more usable space. So even if the dimensions are smaller, the usable space ends up being larger. That Costco tarp has a similar cut and looks like a good price but is pretty small. I use the Shadowcaster for a small kitchen setup and wouldn't want to go any smaller, and its definitely bigger than that Costco tarp. Take a look at the Batwing tarp. I haven't seen one in person, but there was a thread on here a while back about those with some decent reviews. The main question I had without being able to see it in person was material quality, but if I remember correctly it was about the same quality as the Kelty tarps. Had I not gotten a crazy deal on the Shadowcaster, I probably would have gone with the Batwing. My Kelty Noah now sits under a hatch in my vehicle as a backup. Personally I would look for something in the right price range with the better cut to increase the usable space.


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## gwheyduke (Jul 3, 2008)

You could sew your own: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0...p_Instructions_-_revA.pdf?2687007158395941466

But when I priced materials it was ~ $170 for the fabric to sew one 18ft by 25ft, and you'd still need loop straps and hardware. But the dragonfly version is +$500. Maybe someday I'll sew one and let you know how it goes. If you do sew one, this series of videos seemed really helpful. 



 and included tips on sewing slippery fabrics on a regular machine.


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

If you can handle the expense the dragonfly is the the one to buy. Killer workmanship, materials, hardware, it’s the one to get. Here’s another reason, service. I left mine up in my yard for a couple of weeks because we we’re having a rehearsal dinner and were trying to be COVID safe outside. Some wild turkeys kind of partied down on it one night and put some huge rips in one of the panels. Sent it back to Matt and he replaced the whole damaged panel for a hundred bucks. I don’t believe that would happen with any other manufacturer. You get what you pay for. Thanks Matt. You are the man.


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## paor (Apr 21, 2008)

A bit off topic, but how do you all secure your tarps along the river? I have the Noah 12, and I have not been successful in getting it set up in breezy weather. It’s hard enough when it is calm out when there are not any trees to really secure it to.


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

On your ridge lines, if it’s sandy, you can make a “dead man”. Dig a ditch perpendicular to your ridge line on the upwind side about where you would pound in a stake. The deeper the better. Put a sand stake/piece of wood/nice rock...... in the ditch with your ridge line tied to it. Bury it in sand. You may have to do all your upwind stakes if conditions warrant. Pretty frickin bomber but a bunch of work.


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## cnalder (Jul 7, 2016)

I've had a Noah 16 for years now. Did end up buying a Big Agnes Deep Creek several years ago. They are all a pain to put up if there's wind and to stay up. I actually like the Noah better, its more compact, has a larger coverage area, and if it rips I'm not out alot. I do recommend replacing all lines with 550 p-cord and getting real sand stakes. Even the sand stakes don't do well on the deep, loose sandy beaches. I always take one or both and mostly use them for shade, and the occasional storm. I highly recommend keeping an eye on your oars if that is what you are using for poles in thunderstorms. I did go on a trip where we also had a riverwing. While the riverwind is definitely beefier, the group opted to put up the Noah for shade in the afternoons and on a rainy night, mostly because it was easier to put up and covered a larger area. 18 of us were able to sit under staying dry while having beverages and playing games.


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## Willie 1.5 (Jul 9, 2013)

From personal experience p-cord is insufficient for holding a 16 Noah's tarp. A thunderstorm broke the p-cord holding the ridge line, the tarp then flipped two +/-15lb rocks tied at the mid points over the kitchen. After that we stopped using rocks...


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

I guess I'm spoiled by owning a Moss Outfitter Wing and a NRS River Wing such that I truly believe you get what you pay for. I also own a Noah but I have difficulties getting it to pitch taut enough to stand up to a wind that the wings would have no problem with.

I only use the NRS wing when expecting rain such as going north to Idaho. It is very waterproof such that you can almost shake it dry(the fabric does not absorb water).

The Moss wing is taffeta and is no longer water repellent but makes a bomber desert shade tarp. It does function to keep rain off your head but drips a bit. It saturates with water then takes forever to dry. I got good advice concerning painting it with waterproofing but have not done so yet.

The Noah is used to pitch over my tent. I must admit on rainy days my tent site looks like a hobo camp with clothing hanging all around under the Noah and around the tent. The Noah over the tent ends up moving the drip line well away from our tent allowing us to pitch and put away a dry tent and an area to sit under for personal space away from the group wing when desired.

So, the Noah works but the wings work much better I think. As has already been said, buy once, cry once(or something like that). In other words, it hurts when you pull out your credit card but from then on you'll use it a long time and really enjoy owning a true wing. A good wing can help you get invited on trips!


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

paor said:


> A bit off topic, but how do you all secure your tarps along the river? I have the Noah 12, and I have not been successful in getting it set up in breezy weather. It’s hard enough when it is calm out when there are not any trees to really secure it to.


I have found these spiral anchor pins(commonly used as dog lease anchors) to be amazingly effective in sand and dirt. Just keep spinning until you achieve the desired secureness. Much cheaper then a commercial sand stake.

In some places it is hard to find a BFR or log to use as a anchor or dead man. In such situations I've found filling rice bags or compactor bags with sand or smaller rocks works well. Once you have enough mass you can twist up the top of the sack fold it over and loop a cord around it to secure it closed. Besure to try to restore any disturbances you make to a natural state when you leave.


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

Sight unseen, I would recommend the Big Shady or Timber Ridge over the Noah. They just look like you can get a tauter pitch.

I looked at the Noah on line. It looks better reinforced then my 15 year old version.

It sure would be nice to compare the three side by side to access the quality of materials and construction.


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## Ripper (Aug 29, 2012)

I’m looking for a tarp/wing setup as well for a Deso trip this season... I can’t swing the cost of the dragonfly, and I am not really a fan of NRS (other than straps) having come from a kayaking background...

I did find these, and was curious if anyone had any feedback...









All Weather Tarp Shelter - Whitewater Worthy


If you are looking for a Tarp set up that is solid and won't break the bank, This one is made For You! Available in multiple sizes to accommodate your group. This item is Made To Order




www.whitewaterworthy.com


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

I'm surprised that there are that many that like the Noah's tarp. We had one along on a Grand trip, was a royal pain to set up, 3 people on the erecting crew helped, but that thing couldn't handle any wind. It eventually shredded itself, they are almost impossible to get taught, even after hours of fiddling with it. After that trip, I bought the Big Agnes Deep Creek and never looked back. It's a bomber tarp, easy to erect, easy to get taught in the wind.. They are $199.99 at EMS (Eastern Mountain Sports) . the one mod I did was to tie hoopie to the 2 grommets where the poles go, which fit over the handle of an oar, so no poles to mess with. It gives you about 150 square feet of shade and rain protection, and is only about 4 pounds without the poles. I DO use sand stakes with this, 1.250 aluminum angle 18 inches long, as it came with the same worthless tent stakes they all do.

While I haven't tried it, they make a screen room that is shaped the same as the tarp, looks to be the hot ticket for a late June / July Deso trip.. They were about $150.00 when I looked at them.


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## carvedog (May 11, 2005)

Dragonfly for the win for me. I can set it up solo. It's super stable in wind and it makes me happy at how good it looks on the river. I paid full price not a shill, but I love these shelters and Matt is awesome on the customer service.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

They are damn sure nice, and Even with electric mayhems mantra of buy once cry once, 600 bucks for a tarp? I say that having just bought a Johnny partner toilet system... Almost $2,000 for boxes to shit in... But they sure are nice


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

Dude, your priorities are messed up. Your complaining about a trip saving shelter for a bunch of people for 600 and you paid 2k for a place to take a crap. ( I had no idea they were that pricey)


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

And you are right. They are really nice. Is 2k for two of them. You said boxes to shit in, plural.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

jamesthomas said:


> And you are right. They are really nice. Is 2k for two of them. You said boxes to shit in, plural.


I did, plural.. not complaining, but, fabric? How wonderful can it be?


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

You only have to use or set up a dragonfly once to appreciate how nice they are. Seems that there is never any wrinkles or flapping and the wind is not a factor if you have good anchors. Yep they are spendy but having a DRY place to cook, eat and hang out is a trip saver especially on the shoulder seasons. I split the cost with my river bro and have never been sorry. Best 300 I ever spent on gear hands down.


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## Easy Tiger (Jun 22, 2016)

Ripper said:


> I’m looking for a tarp/wing setup as well for a Deso trip this season... I can’t swing the cost of the dragonfly, and I am not really a fan of NRS (other than straps) having come from a kayaking background...


Take a look at the Big Agness Deep Creek tarp; looks very similar to the NRS. I have the large size and really like it for both sun and rain protection.


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## Willie 1.5 (Jul 9, 2013)

jamesthomas said:


> Your complaining about a trip saving shelter for a bunch of people...
> 
> 
> > This
> > My tarp goes on every single trip, regardless of weather. Hard to prioritize equipment, but a good tarp is near the top of that list. Its the difference between hanging out in your tent alone or with the rest of your crew. They can absolutely make or break a trip.


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## Kenr (Jul 10, 2018)

Just wanted to say +1 for the Big Agnes Deep Creek . We also have the Big Agnes Bug House which will fit in underneath and clip into the tarp. Big, Its big. Ordered some military stakes, 12"s long, hoping they hold some of the time. Ya right!


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

Kenr said:


> Just wanted to say +1 for the Big Agnes Deep Creek . We also have the Big Agnes Bug House which will fit in underneath and clip into the tarp. Big, Its big. Ordered some military stakes, 12"s long, hoping they hold some of the time. Ya right!


How adaptable do you think the bug house on the Big Agnes is? I have a REI screen house but it is like trying to squeeze people in a phone booth and it is terrible in the wind.


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## Kenr (Jul 10, 2018)

GeoRon said:


> How adaptable do you think the bug house on the Big Agnes is? I have a REI screen house but it is like trying to squeeze people in a phone booth and it is terrible in the wind.


Hey Ron- I not sure what you mean by adaptable. It can be erected freestanding without the tarp, it would need poles or oars.I have the large Bug House to fit under the large tarp. So the Bug House is approximately 15 x 15, the tarp is about 16x 16. The bug house clips into/under the tarp. It is huge. Tents or tables with people enclosed and no bugs! It is not phone booth size. Hope that helps.


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

Kenr said:


> Hey Ron- I not sure what you mean by adaptable. It can be erected freestanding without the tarp, it would need poles or oars.I have the large Bug House to fit under the large tarp. So the Bug House is approximately 15 x 15, the tarp is about 16x 16. The bug house clips into/under the tarp. It is huge. Tents or tables with people enclosed and no bugs! It is not phone booth size. Hope that helps.


Thank you for getting back to me. What I was wondering is if would be adaptable to any wing such as my Moss or NRS. I went and looked at a video on the Big Agnes website and as you say it can be erected without any tarp and only with poles hence very adaptable.

The REI screen house is bigger than a phone booth actually. It maxes out at about four people in their chairs. It would be nice to have a screen house that would fit like 8 people.


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

Go with the dragon fly. Not only are they extremely well made. They also are easy to set up solo, use your oars(no packing flimsy poles) and the most important think is it is made in the USA by a fellow boater. Support local small businesses!


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)




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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

Matt, keep up the great work.


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

Here’s a few more


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)




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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)




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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)




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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

I bought a 2x2 aluminum bar stock and made sand stakes for each attachment point. Was about $50 bucks to make 6.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Solid bar stock? I've always used structural aluminum angle, but you ain't going to get six of them for 50 bucks these days with the price of aluminum. It's going through the ceiling. Five years ago a 4x8 sheet of aluminum .125 in diamond plate was about 150 bucks, it's well north of 300 now


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

Yes angled. Fingers had a brain fart.


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

Don’t know where you live but a 12‘ stick of 2x2 angled 3/16 is $52.80 today ( I just call and asked.)


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## Kenr (Jul 10, 2018)

GeoRon said:


> Thank you for getting back to me. What I was wondering is if would be adaptable to any wing such as my Moss or NRS. I went and looked at a video on the Big Agnes website and as you say it can be erected without any tarp and only with poles hence very adaptable.
> 
> The REI screen house is bigger than a phone booth actually. It maxes out at about four people in their chairs. It would be nice to have a screen house that would fit like 8 people.


Ron-Big Agnes has two sizes of Bug Houses. I went with the large. The medium will fit the large tarp also. I believe they are very adaptable.


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

That Dragonfly sure is a nice looking wing.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Bobthegreat said:


> Don’t know where you live but a 12‘ stick of 2x2 angled 3/16 is $52.80 today ( I just call and asked.)


My aluminum supplier ALRECO is in Denver, I haven't purchased any structural angle in a while, but I did just buy some diamond plate, sheet aluminum, and bar stock, wasn't none of it cheap


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

they are amazing. It’s been out in every type of weather. The sand stakes,work great. We also use dead man bags in the really soft stuff(salmon) when the wind starts to really rip.
and again I can’t stress this enough. Made here in the states by a fellow boater.


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

You should shop around!


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

Here are the sand stakes


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

I use the army tent stakes for harder rockier ground.


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

Kenr said:


> Ron-Big Agnes has two sizes of Bug Houses. I went with the large. The medium will fit the large tarp also. I believe they are very adaptable.


I shopped around and they seem to have been discontinued by Big Agnes. There was a medium at EMS but supply was limited. I was looking to consider a large.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Is the only place in Colorado, that one can buy small qualities of aluminum. Bend over Bob is the affectionate nickname of the owner, and he bends you over.

I'm jealous of you that live in cities that have access to things like a dollar a foot 2x2x3/16. I thought Denver was a pretty good city, but there's one place... And you pay his prices, or you pay the prices of river outfitters which have 100% tacked on to them.. nothing cheap about this sport, a boat is a hole in the water that you threw money into


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Sorry My math is bad and my fingers are worse... Still, 50 bucks and freight from wherever the hell you are to me would be cheaper than I can buy it in Denver
Spend the extra couple bucks and get some 2-in by 1/4-in strap, and weld it over the ends of your angle for the hammer to hit. I've got one sand steak that's 30 years old, the strapping is beat to shit but...


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## nm13 (Apr 20, 2014)

I'd check out Tundra tarps from Cooke's Custom Sewing. They are incredibly well made and versatile for set up. Used them in Alaska out on the Tundra with great results.


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## OMGitsCasey (Mar 31, 2016)

Update: I talked myself out of the three original candidates I first proposed. I stumbled upon an NRS Riverwing today on Moosejaw.com with a site-wide 20% discount. The discount wouldn’t work so I called them and after calling their customer service line, I was able to get the 20% discount to work. It was more than I wanted to spend, but it’s tough to turn down saving $86 on a Wing, and I don’t think they’re on sale often. It’s worth passing on that they have lots of NRS gear (including frames and components) on their site that the discount should apply to, if it doesn’t work, call them and they should honor it. Thanks for the input y’all!


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## Willie 1.5 (Jul 9, 2013)

You won't regret it. 

Do yourself a favor and cut the silly cord in the bags off, and add loop straps.


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## DarrylH (Mar 10, 2015)

Casey - You'll be glad you pulled the trigger on a RiverWing - I'm like GeoRon and use my wing for camp and a second tarp over my tent entrance. A few additions; 1- the aluminum stakes are an absolute necessity for wind, 2- Willie is spot on about the cords, or you'll be forever tripping/snagging/running into them (too skinny to see), 3- pick up four extra aluminum extension poles. Use them on the 'short' wing ends - it lets you raise the sides of the wing up and gives you a ton of extra room (like pictures Bob posted). My set are adjustable like the wing poles, so you can adjust how high each corner is - it will allow you to pitch your wing to shed water and adapt for sloping sites (whoever gets a perfectly flat spot).
I am not a fan of using oars (all due respect guys - I don't want to unrig a boat, they're prone to getting knocked over, and I really don't want to ding one). 
Darryl


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

I just use people’s spare oar. Every one should carry one and it had better be easy to get to. If you use more than three poles things get weird water shedding wise.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

For me, oars are the only way to go..


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

I went ahead and bought extra poles. I ended up being able to get a good deal on some NRS pole sets so bit the bullet and got 2 extra pairs for a total of 6. I been present when people have been beaned with counter balanced oars and it did not go well. Don't want to happen again. 

I'm hesitant to go full round with loop straps since the cord fits nicely in the stow pockets on the tarp. I should look around for 9/16th loop straps but doubt they exist.


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

Just have Jan make some up for you.


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

I couldn't find a 9/16th buckle but did find 3/4" cam buckle. I can sew my own I guess but would rather spend my stimulus check with someone like Jan. Perhaps I'll give her a call tomorrow.

Perhaps the solution is to cut a 1" loop strap in half length wise since I can get them pretty affordably.


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

You would have to melt the whole edge to keep it from unraveling. Total PIA.


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

And it’s still probably going to unravel.


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## GeoRon (Jun 24, 2015)

I was more worried about searing the buckle. Hadn't figured that out yet.


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

OK MNichols, I have to know, what possible reason do you have, to have 2 Jonny Partner thrones? Are you an outfitter, are your women ( or men ) super fussy??? I have to know, this has been bugging me for weeks.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

28-day Grand canyon trips for 16 people


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

jamesthomas said:


> OK MNichols, I have to know, what possible reason do you have, to have 2 Jonny Partner thrones? Are you an outfitter, are your women ( or men ) super fussy??? I have to know, this has been bugging me for weeks.


And no, I'm just a private guy that enjoys going as much as I possibly can. When I was a young man I was a hair boater, now that I'm older I enjoy big water, long trips equals a lot of groover capacity lol when you figure what you pay the commercial outfitters, that adds value to my trip


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

That explains it.


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

gwheyduke said:


> You could sew your own: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0...p_Instructions_-_revA.pdf?2687007158395941466
> 
> But when I priced materials it was ~ $170 for the fabric to sew one 18ft by 25ft, and you'd still need loop straps and hardware. But the dragonfly version is +$500. Maybe someday I'll sew one and let you know how it goes. If you do sew one, this series of videos seemed really helpful.
> 
> ...


Holy heck I think I just found next winter's sewing project! Thanks! Curious, what/where did you get $170 in pricing info? That sounds awfully steep. Pro-tip, if you can sew a tarp, you can sew your straps and save even more $$$.


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## Bobthegreat (Mar 3, 2019)

And if you can dodge a wrench! You can dodge a ball!


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## gwheyduke (Jul 3, 2008)

lhowemt said:


> Holy heck I think I just found next winter's sewing project! Thanks! Curious, what/where did you get $170 in pricing info? That sounds awfully steep. Pro-tip, if you can sew a tarp, you can sew your straps and save even more $$$.












Green is this fabric (6 yards) @ $6.75/yd - 2.2 oz HEX70 XL
Purple is this fabric (19 yards) @ $6.50/yrd - 1.9 oz PU coated Ripstop Nylon

I was trying to not have seams on the corners, hence the need for wider fabric in the middle. Plus that assumes you use the cutoffs from one side for the other side. Total is $164.00

If you come up with a different layout, or find a different supplier/fabric to use let me know. Or if I did my math wrong, let me know that too!


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

Are you reinforcing the corners with cordera or something similar? How about the perimeter. Double stitched 1/2 inch HD strapping wrapped top and bottom with 2 rows of stitching? Quality materials and workmanship are EVERYTHING!!! If you have the skills and the time my hat is duffed to you and I want your number so you can build one for me for substantially less than Matt charges.


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

jamesthomas said:


> Are you reinforcing the corners with cordera or something similar? How about the perimeter. Double stitched 1/2 inch HD strapping wrapped top and bottom with 2 rows of stitching? Quality materials and workmanship are EVERYTHING!!! If you have the skills and the time my hat is duffed to you and I want your number so you can build one for me for substantially less than Matt charges.





gwheyduke said:


> Green is this fabric (6 yards) @ $6.75/yd - 2.2 oz HEX70 XL
> Purple is this fabric (19 yards) @ $6.50/yrd - 1.9 oz PU coated Ripstop Nylon
> 
> I was trying to not have seams on the corners, hence the need for wider fabric in the middle. Plus that assumes you use the cutoffs from one side for the other side. Total is $164.00
> ...


I'm going to come back to this thread next fall, and I'll let you know what I figure out. Those ripstop prices are amazing! Only 60% as much as Seattle Fabrics. 74" width is an extra bonus. Thanks for the info!


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

You go Ihomemt.


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## gwheyduke (Jul 3, 2008)

Just to be clear, I haven't made one of these yet. The cost scared me off. I have made several dropbags and an everything bag, but the cost for those were cheap because I was able to get scrap fabric from a truck tarp place here in Commerce City. But to answer your question, yes the corners would be reinforced. Here is the pattern I'm working from: 


https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0261/6507/files/HEX12_Tarp_Instructions_-_revA.pdf?2687007158395941466



The edges would likely be a rolled hem, rather than 1/2 inch webbing, and the workmanship would be of a good enough quality.. not perfect but not that bad either. I've never seen Matt's in person, but I imagine they are a work of art. I just like to project, even if I can't make something quite as nice as what you can buy.


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

My hat is duffed to you. Build one for yourself and hit then hit me up. AND look at a Dragonfly in person if and when you get the opportunity. Friggin bomber.


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## 2tomcat2 (May 27, 2012)

jamesthomas said:


> OK MNichols, I have to know, what possible reason do you have, to have 2 Jonny Partner thrones? Are you an outfitter, are your women ( or men ) super fussy??? I have to know, this has been bugging me for weeks.


Doesn't everybody?


MNichols said:


> And no, I'm just a private guy that enjoys going as much as I possibly can. When I was a young man I was a hair boater, now that I'm older I enjoy big water, long trips equals a lot of groover capacity lol when you figure what you pay the commercial outfitters, that adds value to my trip


Value = you're high up on everyone's invite list


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## Whitewater Worthy Equip (Dec 11, 2013)

I have had a lot of success using medium duty poly tarps and reinforcing the corners with PVC and adding a D ring. I have found that this is a great compromise of weigh/bulk, durability and cost. The best part, is as long as you leave your dumbass friends behind, you can pull a well controlled fire pan under the edge when it's raining and it doesn't immediately cause a CVA...stroke due to the cost of the tarp. 

It's a great solution if you don't have a giant indoor prep area or layout table. 

It's really nice to have gear that you can actually use without having to baby it as if you cant afford to fix or replace it. 

For bonus points, when the tarp comes to the end of it's serviceable life, cut the corners off and sew them to the new tarp. 



https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0010Z4208/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1



Yes I've heard all the arguments about colors for tarps but this is still my go to. I like the 12x16' as its a bit easier to get it set tight and correctly.

See Whitewater River Rafting Information - Whitewater Worthy LLC and scroll down to the "Tarp set up diagram"

Stay safe and boat more!!!!


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## MT4Runner (Apr 6, 2012)

lhowemt said:


> I'm going to come back to this thread next fall, and I'll let you know what I figure out. Those ripstop prices are amazing! Only 60% as much as Seattle Fabrics. 74" width is an extra bonus. Thanks for the info!











Ottertex® 70D (1.9oz) PU Nylon Ripstop


Ottertex® 70D PU Nylon Ripstop fabric is a durable & lightweight fabric that is waterproof & tear-resistant. Shop this fabric online by the yard or roll today!




www.fabricwholesaledirect.com





And if you build next winter, they usually have great pricing during their Black Friday sale.


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

MT4Runner said:


> Ottertex® 70D (1.9oz) PU Nylon Ripstop
> 
> 
> Ottertex® 70D PU Nylon Ripstop fabric is a durable & lightweight fabric that is waterproof & tear-resistant. Shop this fabric online by the yard or roll today!
> ...


Oooh! I am putting that on my calendar so I don't forget. Thanks!


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## MT4Runner (Apr 6, 2012)

I have 20yd of fabric to make a couple more pyramid tents, but after seeing that pic, I'm sorta inspired to make a big canopy!! (too bad I didn't order 24yd!)

Definitely get the PU coated Ottertex. I made one tent with the DWR Ottertex and it was water resistant but not water-repellent/waterproof. Had a kid literally as mad as a wet cat after camping in it at the Ghetto last June in a downpour. Oops! ....so now have one tent I need to fully coat. haha


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## A-Will (Apr 8, 2020)

For folks running Dragonfly tarps, which one do you like? The Pendragon (18' x 25') or Apalala (18' x 20')? The Pendragon has my eye, but I wonder if it might be too big? Or is there such a thing? I've got some cash burning a hole in my pocket and I'm planning on treating myself and upgrading to a new wing for a GC trip this summer.


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

Depends on where and how you camp. The big one is huge and many campsites don’t have a large enough clear area to make it work. I opted for the smaller one for that reason.


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