# best spot to nail down your combat roll



## sunnyjb

So, i'm sorry to say that although i've been paddling a couple years- my combat roll is pretty shaky in whitewater. I've paddled class IV and cleaned it- but only because i didn't flip. My issue is time. I do fisheries work in the field all season and find myself only paddling a few days here and there. I get back to CO in may and have a week before i have to start work- so...

Where is the best place to hang out by myself for a few days and nail-down my combat roll? October Hole? Steamboat? Salida? Any suggestions on how to get over this hump in the learning curve is appreciated.


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## caspermike

in the river.


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## teleboater5.13

SUNNY

Long time no see...how have you been, is the Yampa going well?

You know the best things about rafts...when they flip over you dont even have to roll them back up...you can just hop on top. 

But in all seriousness for some reason I have decided to try and get back into a hard boat and would love to go out and practice some combat rolls. Depending on the flows in the Poudre we could do some training up there...Filter Plant/Bridges laps and flip over all the time (probably not going to be an issue for me :wink

Let me know when you are in Foco and we can meet up and swap some stories :grin:


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## KimW

Where do you live? A great place is Do-it-again rapid on the Upper Colorado (the last rapid before state bridge). It doesn't have a ton of current, but there is a huge eddy on the left that you can easily and very safely swim into and then paddle back up and enter again and again. You probably would have to flip on purpose there, but it does give you the push of some current and is a very safe and easy place to go and you can spend all the time you need there.


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## sunnyjb

hey buddy! Yeah, that is one reason why i love rafting too (and the beer-drinking aspect). But i'll be back May 15th- just in time for H4tH at the Mish!!!!!! Glad to hear you want to get back into kayaking and i would love to paddle with you. I really think a just need several days on the river making myself tip over in whitewater. Can't wait to see ya! I missed everyone this winter.


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## sunnyjb

caspermike said:


> in the river.


 hey thanks great advice. the point was I don't want to do class III river runs by myself so I was looking for a play hole or something of that nature.


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## lmaciag

I think great practice for combat rolls is to practice stern squirting (or any other type of playboating). You are going to flip a ton, but you won't be anticipating it. I spent a lot of time at Golden doing this a few years ago and it helped a lot.


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## [email protected]

Although I hate saying it go to a play park and playboat, there is always people at them to help you grab your stuff if you swim and you will flip a lot forcing you to roll.
-Tom


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## sunnyjb

thanks for the ideas folks. can't wait to get back to the mainland for some paddling!


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## GAgirlgoneCO

Hey Sunny!

I got my first on Filter Plant, I ran it enough times where I was getting cocky, and then Mike told me to follow him and took me into this "hole" and I flipped right over. Got my first CR there, and the confidence exploded from that point on.

The good thing about FP and Bridges is that they are both in the backyard and you can easily make it up for a quickie on evening even. I would say a play park, but for some reason, I still can't seem to get the balls to get into a hole even though I have my roll. 

Good luck though. See you next month.


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## jballen1

play park, play park, play park. There's nothing thats a more comfortable setting. If you can roll up in a hole, you should be solid anywhere. Let me know when you're in town and I can go to the lyons play park with you, if you'd like. You'll get it! Just keep pluggin!

-Jeremy


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## milo

*...best place VS best training....*

...a better way to look at your situation is...."why do i miss my roll"?...most people miss rolls because they do not roll with the current....they high-float because the current has already TRIED to help them up..they just refuse and they tend to go right-side...then another right-side attempt...do you only turn right when you ski? thought so... do you only turn left when you ski?...thought so... do yourself a FAVOR and learn to roll with the current....go into a river left eddy, let it flip you and then try a left side roll(current will help you)...then go out of the river left eddy and let the current flip you..then bang out another left side roll....that easy...go into a river right eddy and let the eddy flip you ....then try a right sided roll...go out into the current, let it flip you then try a right sided roll....get the picture???? soon you will realize(young grasshopper) that if your right shoulder is touching the water first(on a tip over) that you should try a left handed roll...even if you roll sucks the current will do it's best to assist you....and soon whenever your left shoulder is going to touch water first...you must try a right handed roll first....and as you know...if you miss one side you are already set up for the other side...the time it takes to reset for the same side roll is plenty of time to try 2 other rolls...always left then right or right then left...do you use left strokes and right strokes on the water?...thought so....why change that program just because you are upside down?....pull left...pull right...etc....i was showed this by a young gun 12 years ago...he was already a heady duty little mofo....then one can try squirting on the eddy lines....same thing applies....if you go out into the current(river left eddy) and apply a left handed "pry"..one can the use the "pullover stroke" (right handed) to speed the flip up..and then use a left handed roll next thing you know you are pulling off "screw-ups"....and the boys will be knocking down your door...this is a very easy method of learning how to use the current to roll up...it was flipping you in the first place right?...thought so....if it is enough to flip you ...it must be enough to flip you back up...just try the rolls....and always remember...think up/be up......do good, try hard....."one must think... before he moves".....JUNIORranger420CB....


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## Canada

*Bomber roll*

I always find going into a play park when it is crankin gets me going. Particularly with the hand roll. generally you exit upside down every time and then are forced to hand roll utilizing the current. This skill lhas come in handy on a couple occaisions when a paddle has broken or been ripped from my hands.

Good luck


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## striker

Try stern squirting in an eddy line first. This helped me alot because you flip but dont allways see it coming. It allows helps you learn to roll in current outside of a rapid. It also helps to count to three before making your first roll attempt. When learning this is important because you will make sure you are all the way upside down before trying to roll. Last thing, if you dont make the first roll, try again.


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## milo

*....waiting....*

...i have to disagree with striker...why wait....it's like waiting to put in a crucial forward stroke or something...the more you wait the further off line you become..not a problem in most places but a bad habit to get into..the paddle strokes should never stop....waitng just means you're high-floating...which a master will roll up off a low brace if high-floating....it takes one second to roll...3 seconds means 3 attempts could be made...make sense?....thought so....if you want to practice holding your breath do that in an eddy...or better yet try to bang out as many rolls on one breath...then your confidence will grow knowing you busted out X number of rolls on one breath so in a time of need you know what you can endure... used to make my students bust out 10 rolls on a breath....their confidence soared once on the river....sorry stiker i get your point but waiting just leads to trouble...one does not need to time it with high-low points in a wave train either....pull right then left and you'll be up if you don't lift your head............milo


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## bobbuilds

I like what milo had to say, and It made sense. I am trying both sides this year, every other, wtf do I have to loose, I swam every rapid in the state last year.....


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## UserName

There's this great hill in my back yard. You can get in your boat and roll all the way down it. Any hill will do really. It's good to have someone do shuttle for you aas I find myself a bit disheveled after a quick little session


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## whip

Eddies garage north of Dotsero on the CO. You can park there all day!


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## KimW

*pull right, pull left?*

Milo--do you just mean if you try on one side and it doesn't work try the other?


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## basil

Also, a good place to is in a big hole at a play park. You are disoriented, but it's safe. 

The eddies at Union Creek on the South Platte are tough when it's running. 

I actually found confluence on the South Platte to be a good place because the pools are so small. You have to roll quick or you are going down the next drop. It's also a bit of a squirly place.


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## milo

*.....KIMW.....*

...YES, that's what i mean....if you try a right hand forward roll and you miss it, chances are you are going against the current...so as you are headed back upside down , use the momentum....and try a left handed roll....chances are the current/momentum will help flip you back up....it is a waste of paddle motion to try to back to another same-side roll....and usually it will take 3 same-side attempts to come up because after 3 attempts your boat has spun(most likely) a 360...so moral of the story....try a righty...then a lefty and then a righty......


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## JulieAlbrecht

*Glenwood Springs*

another good play spot with most of the time guaranteed other boaters around. Currently has an easy play wave/hole, and what looks to me like a really challenging one, some squirrely water, great recovery eddys (which will pretty much disappear if we have massively more water comin' down the Colorado like last year). In Glenwood Springs right off the West Glenwood exit from I-70


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