# Rafting with infants?



## climbdenali

What do y'all out there think is a reasonable minimum age for being in a raft on the water? Easy, class 1 plus to 2 minus. 30 lbs seems like a good guideline to me, especially since the CG rating on many "infant" PFDs is 30-50 lbs. Anyway, what do all you parents out there think?


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## formerflatlander

Have 4 kids. If there was an adult specifically looking out for the child and at those levels, seems fine.


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## VandyIn541

formerflatlander said:


> Have 4 kids. If there was an adult specifically looking out for the child and at those levels, seems fine.


I agree. Everyone has there own comfort level with their family members. I have two kids, they did there first day trips around 2 1/2 years of age and first multi-day trips a year later (they had to be out of diapers, didn't want to deal with that on the river). There's always an adult up front holding on to them when we encounter rapids, and we walk them around rapids when it doubt. Good luck whatever you decide, have fun, be safe.


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## blutzski

We started doing multi-day flatwater float trips around 22 months with several families having kids the same age. For us the key was having a River Sombrero. Kids would take naps in the shade as we floated along. I think raft size also makes a difference. We have a 16 footer. The tubes were up to their chest. I don't think I would have brought them on a 14 footer at that age. The biggest danger in my mind was shallow sections where they could fall out and get crushed under the weight of a fully rigged raft.


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## solboater

Like others have said I based my decisions on the run, my abilities, the abilities of those around us in other boats, weather, a good pfd, and having mama to hold our child in the riffles/rapids. We started our son well under 30 lbs. on day trips and a few overnighters(with good roadside access). He sure spent a lot of time nursing early on and was definately in diapers. He was wearing a pfd similar to this one MTI Infant PFD - Under 30 Pounds at REI.com


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## Rustie

Our kids were both rafting in utero, and were never allowed to stop, really. I think the answer for each family should take into account your experience level, your partner's experience level, and what kinds of boating friends you have. We definitely put the lid rapids at class ii, and walk around iii's right now, but our kids are 1 and 2.5. They've got a lot of river days this summer and last, and a lot of overnights, seem to really enjoy themselves out there. Our toddler goes bonkers about the raft every time she walks through the garage, tells me all about rafting.


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## DES

My wife and I took our 6 month old daughter down the Upper San Juan last spring. Someone would always be on "high alert" while on the boat, even though she was in her PFD and car seat almost entirely. The chance of flipping the raft on that stretch of river is such a low probability (although not impossible), that it was worth the risk (my mind weighs these things in terms of probability and possibility). It was an amazing experience, seeing her react to things she has never seen before. Playing in the sand and all. Sure, its a lot of work bringing your kids, but it sure beats staying at home.


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## LSB

Our first kid went on the Moab daily at 6 mos. We strapped his car seat to the front dance floor and set him in unbelted with his PFD on. He slept almost the whole time.


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## El Flaco

LSB said:


> Our first kid went on the Moab daily at 6 mos. We strapped his car seat to the front dance floor and set him in unbelted with his PFD on. He slept almost the whole time.


Yeah, but with your genetics he was probably the size of a five year old already. And shaving.


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## chrispy

What does the government say? Just kidding. Have fun


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## UserName

Kids under 5 seem to be a toss up as to weather they just start crying or not, and it seems to be more an issue of getting a surprise splash in the face than the motion of the raft. Dont think there is rhyme or reason as to which kids freak out and start crying but they can and do go on for hours. The next question is how to overcome the reaction if it occurs, can it be trained away... and if so is that just cruel? This is your test I think before any extended trips.


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## Learch

My son took his first raft trip at 3 and my daughter started at 2.5 years this April/ May. Jacob is now 5 and Emma is just about ready to turn 3. We started with some pretty easy class II stuff that I know really well, and finished the summer off with 2 trips on the Upper Mckenzie river on Labor Day. 
Emma falls asleep in the middle of the day, around 1-3 pm she would sleep in Momma's arms. I make sure they are comfortable (sunscreen, water temp, air temp, food, toys) They both have enjoyed it very much. Emma talks about the raft every time she sees it sitting on the trailer in the garage. 
So they both got to go on some late season class III ww this year, and it went smoothly. They didn't get scared and we didn't have any problems. We are going to take our boy on the day trip of the Deschutes next summer, and we might try an overnight trip as well.


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## swiftwater15

*Kids on trips*

If the child is old get something out of it, it has to be the parent's call. There are certainly rivers that are safer than driving to the grocery store. In some cases though, I question whether bringing an infant actually enriches the infant's life, or is just more convenient for the parents. Years ago, I put in next to a young couple at the Grave Creek put in on the Rogue. They were well equipped, and you could tell they were competent outdoors people. However, they had an infant in a car seat on the raft. They had never been down the Rogue before, and it was a one-boat trip. That struck me as arrogant, self centered and reckless. I minded my own business then. I'm not sure I would now.


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## LSB

El Flaco said:


> Yeah, but with your genetics he was probably the size of a five year old already. And shaving.


Glad to know youre always lurking in the shadows Flaco. 
Bring your brood out here. 
Fodge and I are planning a 40/50 Birthday trip on the Salmon next spring. 
Yall need to apply with us.


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## LSB

I've heard tales of Jack (Jacks Plastic) strapping a playpen into the back of his 20' cat on the SanJuan back in the day.


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## TakemetotheRiver

My son's first day trip (Lower Animas including Smelter rapid at 1400 cfs) was at 18 mos old. Since then we've put a map up in his bedroom so he could tack all the runs he's done. He just turned 9 and did Westwater for his first time last fall. Some friends of mine took their 6 week old daughter down the San Juan and she got a sunburn; another friend of mine, a class V boater, is not ready to take his 12 year old daughter down Westy. It is entirely up to you and your perception of your ability, the child's abilities, the level of difficulty of the water, and your acceptable risk level. Don't let anyone shame you one way or the other- it's like every other parenting move you will ever make- some people will disapprove, but some won't.


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## Learch

TakemetotheRiver said:


> My son's first day trip (Lower Animas including Smelter rapid at 1400 cfs) was at 18 mos old. Since then we've put a map up in his bedroom so he could tack all the runs he's done. He just turned 9 and did Westwater for his first time last fall. Some friends of mine took their 6 week old daughter down the San Juan and she got a sunburn; another friend of mine, a class V boater, is not ready to take his 12 year old daughter down Westy. It is entirely up to you and your perception of your ability, the child's abilities, the level of difficulty of the water, and your acceptable risk level. Don't let anyone shame you one way or the other- it's like every other parenting move you will ever make- some people will disapprove, but some won't.


Well said, it's entirely up to you. We all do this for fun, so make sure it is.


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## bth

*Kids on rivers*

I'm so glad to see all the positive replies to this thread. While there is obviously a greater level of supervision when taking young kids on rivers than there is with older kids and adults, the perceived risk is something that prohibits the activity for so many families - and doesn't need to. Like many others, my wife and I started taking our kids on multi-days when they were strapped in their car seats on the raft frame. These days, they're 4 and 6 - and are at a level of comfort on desert rivers that certainly wouldn't exist if they hadn't been started so young. 
Both of my girls know the power of moving river, and have a healthy respect for it. They know not to go near it when we're in camp unless they're with an adult.  That having been said, they love riding on the front of our SUPs or in an IK; they spend time "helping" me row. In camp, the groover is a fun change from the ordinary for them, and they prefer sleeping under the stars to setting up a tent. It hasn't always been easy - there were a number of sleepless nights for us when they were younger campers, just as there were of course at home - but now at just age 4 and 6 they're surprisingly great river campers. Thus, my advice - don't wait!!


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## bth

*GOALS*

One more thing - not to simply hijack this thread, but since there are so many parents advocating for taking their kids on river trips, I want to be sure you're aware of a charity I'm the founder of called GOALS ("Get Outside And Learn Something") whose mission is to inspire exploration in youth through multi-day wilderness river trips. 
We take kids between 4th grade and college on multi-day river trips in Colorado, Utah, Oregon, Idaho, and California - using the river to teach them more about themselves and the world around them than any classroom ever could. Check out the website here, and shoot me an email with any questions you might have by using the contact button on our site!


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## NorthernAZ

Had my two year old in the San Juan last weekend for his birthday. He had a blast and it was definitely worth the work.


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## glax

*kids*

Same as many others in that I have 2 kids and started them @ 18mos. We did several Ruby/ Horsethief trips with a pack 'n play when the kids were at that age. Under 3 and the ripples seem to put them to sleep. It's all about the comfort level of the parents, but the more comfortable you make the kids the more enjoyable for the adults. Tons of shade, snacks, sand toys etc... all worked well for us. My oldest is is 8.5 now, with a Apr b-day. Since her 5th b-day, when we ask her what she wants for her birthday, she has said "I want to do an overnight raft trip". Have fun and be safe!!

FYI:
infant PFD= less than 30lbs
child PFD= 30- 50 lbs
youth PFD = 50-90lbs


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## Luce

yep, started them in car seats and now tell them that if they can swim it they can run it in a boat. There pretty good swimmers.. still just 6 and 7 years old. i guess we will see what there appetite is now that they have stopped eating mud cakes, and have a sense of what rapids are. They have always loved playing and camping on river trips. its always fun to have some uptight parents along and talk about relative risks, like driving to the river.. crossing the street, texting wile walking.. that sort of thing..


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## Capt. Nacho

We just floated the Lower San Juan for 5 days with our 6 month old and learned some good things for next time. I agree this all about comfort level on the river and how flexible your little one is. We were not worried about the difficulty of the water and our little guy is pretty easy going. Actually he loves to be outside. We walked the one rapid over a class II and always had at least one adult next to him when we were floating. We rigged his car seat up in the front and had a big patio shade umbrella as well. Oh yeah we also had a little hand held umbrella too. I think the best part of our trip was all the friends who helped us out. Our little guy had so much attention and so many new play partners he loved it. Often I would see someone holding him while they were both laughing. This was key, it would have been a very different story with out so much support. Having the support of our community was a very beautiful part of the trip. That being said it wasn't all fun and games. He definitely was pushed by being out of his element. This meant more crying than we are use to and making sure he was getting lots of love. Being prepared for more cold and heat than we had was great and lots of oils/salve for his skin was nice. We gave him bottles of water with a splash of coconut water in addition to milk though the day. We also brought a little bouncy lay back chair deal for him in camp. All in all the trip was a lot of work, it was not as rejuvenating as I am use to and we definitely felt exposed at times. That being said now that we are home, I am so glad we went out with him. Sharing this part of our lives with our child is one of the reasons we are rafters and the teaching that comes from the river is too important to miss for us and for him.


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## Capt. Nacho

LSB said:


> I've heard tales of Jack (Jacks Plastic) strapping a playpen into the back of his 20' cat on the SanJuan back in the day.


Well that was when you could get a 20' raft down the San Juan. Ole Powell Res. is doing a number on it these days.


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## wildh2onriver

Capt. Nacho said:


> Well that was when you could get a 20' raft down the San Juan. Ole Powell Res. is doing a number on it these days.



You still can. If I could get my 18'x8' cat down at 375, 1k should be a dream flow super highway.


Sent from my iPhone using Mountain Buzz


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## Mountainsandrivers

We took my youngest son on a Moab Daily trip when he was 6 weeks old and he wasn't the youngest! The moms pretty much held the babies, kept them in shade. We were on guard for sure, but it was a mellow time of year. Both my boys had 5 or so river trips before 1yr old, including some Ruby Horsethiefs. My oldest first did Westwater when he was 7. He was pretty nervous, but we had a great group of boaters around us, we talked through the "what ifs", and all was good. He even paddled his Jackson Fun 1 until Little D. Seeing his big smile after we passed the rapids, the tension went away and he was eager to do an overnight next time, made it all worth it. Now the next question is when is a good age for the Grand? I am thinking around 12, but I see it more as a comfort level swimming rapids, situational awareness around camp, willingness to help out and wanting to truly camp for the 21 days. We did a 4 day Rogue trip in October, both boys, currently 7 and 10, were great helpers in camp, helped with meals, rigging, firewood gathering and maintained great attitudes on a 50 degree constant rain day. I did have them hike Blossom Bar, because it looked sketchy at low water, but all was smooth. Man I love boating with my kids!


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