# Needle Creek on the Animas ...



## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

... FINALLY got done-did .. by a couple east coasters (of course). Gordon Dalton & crew reports that it was quite good. I believe the quote of the day is "the drops were tight and quality, like a prep school girl at her first frat party"

It's a first d as far as I know. The last quasi-attempt I know of was also a motivated east coast crew, including Bo, Daniel D., Joey M., L.D., Tommy, Al G & BJ. That was back in '99. It didn't get run though, & that's a story in itself.


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## sward (Dec 14, 2003)

Pics of the gooods, logistics, tr? Thanks.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

logistics: paddle the A to the confluence of needle & then hike upstream. i don't have the rest of that stuff. still waiting for more info from G.


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## Mut (Dec 2, 2004)

Is Needle creek the creek that starts at needelton and heads up into chicago basin? If that is the same creek a few of the drops have already been run, solo no less. 

If it is not, where is needle creek?


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## Cutch (Nov 4, 2003)

Finally...


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## yetigonecrazy (May 23, 2005)

i wonder how far up they put in, its granite bedrock all the way until almost chicago basin, thats gotta be at least 7 or 8 mi...bitchin tho, props to those guys. ive been curious to see when it would go....


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## mania (Oct 21, 2003)

i am pretty sure some parts have been done - keel?

good stuff tho


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## keel (Apr 30, 2004)

*Yep parts have been done*

 Way to go!!!! That is the goods...... and yep parts have been done but many have not because of wood over the years!!!! Some guys talked about it clearing out after last years super high water!!!! Kevin Padden and another guy ran some of it a while back..... they were also the first to run Canyon Creek further down stream......Love to see some pics it is a nice place to be!!!!!!!!! Good job!!!!


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## GDalton (Nov 4, 2003)

*Needle*

Thanks for the props. Mut - Needle joins the Animas a little ways below the bridge at Needleton. It goes up to Chicago Basin. There were some nice granite drops. Not quite Cali style, but nice enough. I was surprised at how quality it was really - I expected worse and there wasn't too much wood IMO. We had some fun tight drops. A good little slide, some longisg boulder gardens, a boof-to-slot ("Eye of the Needle") and one manky jumbled-up mess ("Pins and Needles"). I'll try to get some pics up later today maybe.

Gordon Dalton
Eskimo Kayaks USA


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## CGM (Jun 18, 2004)

Nice work. Sounds like it was a schweet trip...sorry I missed you guys while you were out here. Lookin forward to the pics. 
Chris


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## steven (Apr 2, 2004)

How far above the confluence did you put in?


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## Unordinary (Jun 20, 2006)

Still waiting to hear how far up Needle Creek? If you think the wood was not that bad, you must be a Lumber Jack. Anyway hope you ran it for fun and not to be the first, otherwise I believe you will be dissapointed. I think there is to much emphasis on first descends. I understand the allure, but if the river or creek is new to you and you are by yourselves, is the adventure not the same?


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

^^^ "You're so wise. You're like a miniature Buddha .. covered with hair."


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## lotsawater (Nov 18, 2003)

What we do on the buzz echos. . . whiney bullshit.

Of course there is some allure to cleaning up a first D. I don't know what gets your panties wet, but some undiscovered boof that I haven't cleaned up yet makes my loins quiver.


Like a boner in sweat pants, I'M OUT BIATCHES!


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## Unordinary (Jun 20, 2006)

*who whining?*

What was the date of said trip? More facts less filler. Time to make silly comments but not to answer forum questions??
My point is that not every one who has made a descent feels the need to tell everyone about it. Some of them probably do not even have computors. In this day an age a more humble (realistic) statement would be "one of the first". Put the run in your log book and let historians tell the story.


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## Cutch (Nov 4, 2003)

Unordinary, catch a clue. The people that posted about it being run weren't the ones that were on the trip. They simply were stoked that someone finally ran the section, since it appears that no one else has run it top to bottom over the years. Maybe we are wrong, and your crew has fired it up multiple times... props. It should be obvious that Gordon doesn't care if it was a first D because he never claimed that it was, he simply said thanks for acknowleding that they ran it, and described some of the drops as beta on the run. 

Further more, if it doesn't matter, than why are you so intent on knowing how much of it was run? Or better yet, the date? Your bitching about how first D's don't matter, and then probing to see if it really was a first D. If you ran it first, then give us some beta, tell us how it went, and we'll let people know that you ran it but don't have a computer to post details. 



> In this day an age a more humble (realistic) statement would be "one of the first". Put the run in your log book and let historians tell the story.


Exactly what Gordon did. People that weren't there said it was a first D, because as far is anyone here knows, it was. Don't you know that TG is the decider? 

On that note, way to go Gordon! That guy fires up so much shit that most Colorado locals never run.


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## sward (Dec 14, 2003)

Troll? troll w/o spellcheck in this day & age of computors?


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## steven (Apr 2, 2004)

anyone know how far up from the confluence was run?


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## yetigonecrazy (May 23, 2005)

Cutch said:


> On that note, way to go Gordon! That guy fires up so much shit that most Colorado locals never run.


oh man these guys are on. Anyone that can clean the Cinnamon Gorge on the Lake Fork deserves mad props, because his balls are surely bigger than most people's heads.


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## the swimminest (Jun 21, 2006)

Gordon, nice job. (This is Rob Scott, the W&L law student who paddled with you a bit a few years back when I was in Lexington). Put up some pictures so I have something to look at while at work. Have you been paddling with Josh while in Co.? Not sure if you're still out this way, but I will be in the aspen area around July 1-4 and would love to paddle with you guys and catch up if you are in the area and feel like taking a rest day to paddle something easy.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

Hey Anonymous New Member guy --

First, sorry I didn't provide you with the info you're looking for in a more timely manner. But I didn't run Needle Cr., so I don't have it. I was simply posting the news that the creek finally got run. Gordon, who led that trip, lives in VA & is a rare visitor on Mtbuzz, so you'll just have to wait patiently until he decides to come back to mtbuzz & share his findings. 

Next, I never claimed it was *definitely* a 1D. Go back & read my post & it sez "As far as I know". Leaves it open for discussion. You have better info? stop being defensive & cryptic, & just come out with it. You seem to be waiting impatiently for more info so you can refute the claim .. all dressed in this self-righteous posturing about humility & how everyone should share your opinion on the value of 1D's (unintended irony much?)

In one breath you're telling paddlers to quietly log a descent in a personal journal & that "not every one (sic) who has made a dscent feels the need to tell everyone about it" .. & in the next breath you are demanding more info & talking about historians??!! please reconcile this for me. Oh, I get it, YOU are the holier-than-thou quiet journal writer who may or may not have a run on Needle & you want to know how far up they hiked/ran so you can set the record straight? 

&, just for your own edification, Gordon is among the humblest & most motivated paddlers I've ever had the pleasure of knowing (going back to the mid 90s). He's been coming out to the rockies & QUIETLY running the shit & getting 1D's for many years & having fun doing it. I'm the no-fun non-humble guy who posted the news on his behalf -- It's what I do, I'm a blogger.

So anyway, what's your issue again?


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## yetigonecrazy (May 23, 2005)

ah yes, but a hell of a blogger you are mr g. i cant speek for anyone else, but i always enjoy looking at TRL! super good stuff there, that is.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

I don't really have the time to be effin' around with this, but i searched my email & found that i got my first email from G on June 14, which said: 

"Just got back from a blitzkrieg trip to CO. We spent a couple days in the Animas and fired up Needle Creek. I was surprised how good it was, the wood was manageable/minimal and the drops were tight and quality, like a prep school girl at her first frat party.

I keep checking off runs from my Explore list, but somehow I add two more for every one I run. So much to see,

Talk soon,
GD"

*****
Do the mathletics & you can suss out about when they were in there.
*****

Next email from G:

"_____ said he thought it was a new one. Who knows? So many creeks out there that don't get run and all they need is some hiking to access. Wish I had more time out there. 

It is definitely not shitty. I was surprised at how fairly quality it was. Micro creeky for sure, like VA creeks. I had to use my film camera so I'm still waiting on the prints. The higher up you go the more granite bedrock there is. There is a 20'+ falls, a nice easy slide or two, lots of longish boulder gardens and a couple boof-to-boulder-garden-to-tight twisty-slot sequences.

I'll get some pix up soon."

*****
*****

Those are the only emails i have to go from. so now you know as much as i do, & you can stop publicly kooking out on the forum.

edit: PS: thanks YGC!


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## yetigonecrazy (May 23, 2005)

gdalton could be equated to a modern day zorro, really.


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## Unordinary (Jun 20, 2006)

If forum members are going to be so sensitive every time someone ask a question or throws out some opinions, this is going to be more fun than I thought!
Sorry if I ruffled anyones feathers...
Todd to reconcile- I am just throwing some thoughts out there for discussion not to form any conclusions. Thats probably why some ideas seem contridict each other. 
Here's some more, with so many changes in rapids of these small creeks and high mountain rivers might not there be more first descents due to changes creating a different run. What about first descents at different water levels. We all know what a difference that can make. How many portages is someone allowed and it still counts as a first.
Cutch- The point I am trying to make is that "as far as we all know" on this forum makes for a small set and leads to questionable conclusions on any 1st D. I have spent hundreds of days by needle creek since 1981 and in that time I have talked with half a dozen groups of kayakers who have claimed to run all or part of needle creek. One was back before disposable water proof cameras. They claimed a group of backpackers were resting by the waterfall and took there pictures as they dropped. But I never thought to record their names and none lived in Durango.
I have been reading this forum for a couple of years and just now decided (why??) to respond. There might be others who never will.
But this forum is a great way to get info that you might otherwise never hear.
Along those lines I was curious as to the date, to gauge the approximate level the creek was run at. I was up there on May 31st and again on June 15th (not kayaking). I was curious how far up and to hear logistics because, if the group ran the upper, and all of needle in two days, I was going to be mightily impressed. 
Really not that demanding, Ron.


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## GDalton (Nov 4, 2003)

*Needle*

Wow, this is what happens when I leave you guys alone for a week or two? I guess I should have sat by my computer instead of going to boat in WV for a few weeks (by the way things have been STOMPING over here in WV/VA). 

I won't stoop to the dorky concerns of some of the folks who chimed in to this thread, but here are the pics:

http://www.americanwhitewater.org/photos/?photoid=15147
http://www.americanwhitewater.org/photos/?photoid=15142
http://www.americanwhitewater.org/photos/?photoid=15144

Etc... (there are 9 pics I think)

Not great shots, but it gives you an idea about the creek. We hiked up the trail from the Animas around 2 or 2.5 miles I think. There might be more goods up stream. Maybe "Unordinary" will fire them up for us? 

We did the whole trip as a 2-day. Floated the Upper Animas down to Needle, partied that night, then fired up Needle the next day and paddled out through the Rock__ Box. No sweat. I was lucky to have a good tight crew, my buds Harris and Josh who are all-world creekers.

I hope that answers all of your grave concerns and questions. Thanks for the interest and insightful commentary.

Yeti - I cannot vouch for the size of my balls versus other folks heads and we should probably leave that alone, 

If I am Zorro, do I get to hook up with Catherine Zeta Jones?

Thanks and have a good season,
Gordon Dalton


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## yetigonecrazy (May 23, 2005)

hey gd-

you should think about posting a write up on eddyflower.com, or deferring it to someone else with some pictures, that run definitely needs to go up.

and as for catherine zeta jones, you never know, she may be all about crazy boaters. and youll never know unless you try!


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