# If you had to repair this, what would you do!?



## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

Ok so a bought a used boat for a great price and this is the only flaw it has. I have never repaired an inflatable so any advice would be great! It seems like it has been patched before. I do not know how it ripped. Thanks for the help in advance ! Pic will be below.


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## FlyingDutchman (Mar 25, 2014)

That’s a good one. May need a few small patch pieces glued inside for tear strength and a big patch outside. Start by cleaning it gently with a nylon abrasive wheel on a drill or dremel type tool. See harbor freight link below. Take your time. 

Someone else on here can certainly give you some good tips.

https://m.harborfreight.com/4-in-80-grit-nylon-abrasive-wheel-with-14-in-shank-60325.html


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## noahfecks (Jun 14, 2008)

I would cross stitch it closed with some nylon string before cleaning the whole area and throwing a single large strip patch. Be sure to rough up the surface of both the floor and the patch with sand paper so the adhesive has something to stick to, and follow the instructions on the adhesive meticulously.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

FlyingDutchman said:


> That’s a good one. May need a few small patch pieces glued inside for tear strength and a big patch outside. Start by cleaning it gently with a nylon abrasive wheel on a drill or dremel type tool. See harbor freight link below. Take your time.
> 
> Someone else on here can certainly give you some good tips.
> 
> https://m.harborfreight.com/4-in-80-grit-nylon-abrasive-wheel-with-14-in-shank-60325.html




Should I remove the old patch ??


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

Anton8100 said:


> Should I remove the old patch ??




What adhesive do I need to buy?


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## matt man (Dec 23, 2011)

Stabond will work for both Hypalon and PVC. You will need a cleaner before you glue, if it’s PVC that you ar working with, then the correct cleaner is going to be MEK. If it’s a Hypalon boat, then you want Toululene. Kinda looks like pvc in the picture, but I am not certain, what brand of raft is it?

Also, go take a look at the tutorials on the NRS web site, those guys have som great info on doing glue work for either type of material. 

Everything involved with gluing is very toxic, where a respirator, chemical resistant gloves, and have Lots of fresh air.

That looks like kind of a tough project, for a first glue job, where ya located at? If you were in Colorado, I would say talk to Zach over at raftfix.com 
I’m sure you can pull it off, but might be good for a pro to do, especially the way that floor has kept tearing open after the first patch.

How is your pressure relief valve situation? Almost looks like that floor could be doing that cause of over inflation, weird looking problem, should probably have a good inside patch going past the rip, so it doesn’t keep getting longer.

Good luck man!


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

matt man said:


> Stabond will work for both Hypalon and PVC. You will need a cleaner before you glue, if it’s PVC that you ar working with, then the correct cleaner is going to be MEK. If it’s a Hypalon boat, then you want Toululene. Kinda looks like pvc in the picture, but I am not certain, what brand of raft is it?
> 
> Also, go take a look at the tutorials on the NRS web site, those guys have som great info on doing glue work for either type of material.
> 
> ...




It’s a star starlike brand. I think the material is 1000d pvc. 
Funny thing you mention Zach. I actually called him and wanting to know if he could give me some tips over the phone and he responds by telling me he doesn’t do tech support. So I said thank you and hung up. Didn’t seem he wanted to help me. Not upset, he is a private business owner and he is allowed to do as pleased. So i am going to use NRS and they will have my business. They are super friendly and informative! They also have a good bit of products online that I can buy.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

If you call a car mechanic on the phone, they aren't going to tell you how to fix your car either, just sayin.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

He didn’t have to give me any info at all. I’m all for private companies do what you gotta do. We live in capitalism ! Thank god! I can go next door and find service I’m looking for


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## PoppyOscar (Jul 8, 2012)

Anton8100 said:


> It’s a star starlike brand. I think the material is 1000d pvc.
> Funny thing you mention Zach. I actually called him and wanting to know if he could give me some tips over the phone and he responds by telling me he doesn’t do tech support. So I said thank you and hung up. Didn’t seem he wanted to help me. Not upset, he is a private business owner and he is allowed to do as pleased. So i am going to use NRS and they will have my business. They are super friendly and informative! They also have a good bit of products online that I can buy.


Found the guy who doesn't run his own business.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

PoppyOscar said:


> Found the guy who doesn't run his own business.




Found help....


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

shappattack said:


> If you call a car mechanic on the phone, they aren't going to tell you how to fix your car either, just sayin.




Get a new mechanic


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

Pretty sure I didn't talk to you. When did you call? Ive been gone for 3 weeks. I've never told anyone "I don't do tech support". I do typically try and keep the free advice fairly short but have never said that. You may have talked to Zach at IT.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

zbaird said:


> Pretty sure I didn't talk to you. When did you call? Ive been gone for 3 weeks. I've never told anyone "I don't do tech support". I do typically try and keep the free advice fairly short but have never said that. You may have talked to Zach at IT. This is a super busy season for repairs.




Yesterday. I completely understand. Would love to fix this tear ! I could easily shit rig this like Prevoius owner but instead I rather Consult with experts before I do.


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

wasn't me dude. I was mostly out of service and answered zero calls yesterday.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

720-309-62** number I called. I don’t want give full number away. It’s not my place.


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

Not me sir. My number is on my site and in my signature.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

What would you advise me to do ? Take old patch off?


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

I guess first I would advise apologizing for posting false info about me before asking for help, but thats just me. Then, I'd advise taking off the old patch, do a full length inside and then outside patch. Before you do your outside patch make sure the inside patch is mostly if not fully holding air. In the shop I would do the outside patch inflated. Good luck.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

Absolutely! I do apologize! Your def not the same Zach in Colorado that I spoke to yesterday. That was a mere coincidence. Thanks for advice.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

zbaird said:


> I guess first I would advise apologizing for posting false info about me before asking for help, but thats just me


I second this motion.


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## [email protected] (Jun 1, 2010)

zbaird said:


> I guess first I would advise apologizing for posting false info about me before asking for help, but thats just me. Then, I'd advise taking off the old patch, do a full length inside and then outside patch. Before you do your outside patch make sure the inside patch is mostly if not fully holding air. In the shop I would do the outside patch inflated. Good luck.


I would ask him nicely do the repair, that's a bad rip.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

I would love to send this to a pro. But shipping boats isn’t cheap. I don’t think I have anyone in my local area.


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## Andy H. (Oct 13, 2003)

Anton8100 said:


> I would love to send this to a pro. But shipping boats isn’t cheap. I don’t think I have anyone in my local area.


Anton,

Maybe you saved enough on the boat to have enough $$ left over to ship the boat to ZB and have it done professionally. Then you'll be able to come to CO and have a fun boating vacation on the Arkansas River which runs right behind ZB's shop... 

If you have it done professionally, you'll have the peace of mind knowing that your home-made patch isn't going to blow out in the middle of the next rapid. Typing from experience, with a patch that size there's lots of potential for your first-time home patch job to go wrong. Then you're removing the patch, having to remove ALL the old glue before you prep the surface again, and repatching again (and again, and again until you get it right). If you do the job yourself, your maiden voyage should be after letting the glue cure completely, leak testing, and letting the inflated boat sit overnight to slow-leak-test further. Then do a roadside run so you're not stuck in the middle of nowhere with a flat boat and a patch job that's too big for riverside repair. 

Not trying to be harsh but there's a good reason you got such a great deal on the boat. If the patch was so easy, the owner would've done it and held onto the boat.

Note - if you fill in your location info on your profile, folks may be able to suggest repair shops that are local to you, but as it is, we have no idea where you are. Don't reply back and tell us, just go into the User CP and add it.

-AH


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## John the welder (May 2, 2009)

If you think paying a professional is expensive try having an amateur do.


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## missiongravity (Jun 10, 2007)

John the welder said:


> If you think paying a professional is expensive try having an amateur do.


If you pay with peanuts you're gonna get monkeys.


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## matt man (Dec 23, 2011)

missiongravity said:


> If you pay with peanuts you're gonna get monkeys.



I may have to steal that one, for the next time somebody try’s to nickel and dime me for repairing their home, and straightening out the last guys mess.


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## matt man (Dec 23, 2011)

Just wanted it to be known, that I was NOT recommending Zach from Raftfix.com, as a source for free advice, but as a boat repair professional, to take said raft to, for what looks like a challenging repair.

He has been pretty darn cool though, to offer up repair advice on this site. Possibly sharing more hard learned knowledge, then I am willing to offer up in my line of work....


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## raymo (Aug 10, 2008)

There is totally nothing wrong with saying I fucked up and thank you for the great advice and the solution to repairing my boat. Plus you will likely receive more great advice when needed for other boating questions.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

Two leaks total.


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## Elvez (Mar 29, 2005)

Where is the OP located? 

Also, wow. One simple misunderstanding and a whole lot of folks just can't wait to jump someone's shit. Good ol' internet.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

Elvez said:


> Where is the OP located?
> 
> 
> 
> Also, wow. One simple misunderstanding and a whole lot of folks just can't wait to jump someone's shit. Good ol' internet.




Yes sadly , I got more shit then advice. Buts it’s all good. I’m thankful for what I can get. Thanks again for all the advice. I ordered glue and patch material.


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## Electric-Mayhem (Jan 19, 2004)

zbaird said:


> You may have talked to Zach at IT.


That number appears to be his...but that hasn't been my experience with him at all. I just had him do a warranty repair on my Aire and he was very friendly. He's pretty busy this time of year though, so who knows.

Doesn't sound like the OP gave him much of a chance though. 

Personally...that looks like a hard fix that has already failed once and I'd have it done by an experienced professional. I've heard nothing but good things about Zach Baird at Raftfix, and Zach Sack at Inflatable Technologies/Whitewater Inflatable Repairs has done stellar work for me in the past. Not sure where you are based, but there is likely a place within a reasonable distance from you to do the repair. Aire has a bunch of a Service Centers that do repairs for them and list them on their website here... https://www.aire.com/service-centers. If they can repair Aire Rafts they can probably help you out on yours.

If you don't want professional help...the advice here will probably suffice.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Electric-Mayhem said:


> I've heard nothing but good things about Zach Baird at Raftfix, and Zach Sack at Inflatable Technologies/Whitewater Inflatable Repairs has done stellar work for me in the past.



I second this, they both do absolutely outstanding work, they have both done work for me with a superior outcome to anything I did myself. Given the time of year, I'm betting they both have stacks of boats waiting for their attention. 



I'd check with SAIA LTL carriers, I used to be able to ship boats for around 150.00 to most anywhere in the continental US, but that was quite a few years ago. 



That particular repair is one you really don't want to waste the time on trying yourself, you're going to end up shipping it to a repair shop eventually, so why not just save the materials you bought for your repair kit and get it done right the first time.... 



It'll probably be less expensive than if they have to clean up the mess you made from trying.


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

After posting up the second pic, you have bigger issues. It looks like the long "rip" is probably a cut made on purpose to repair a leak in the interior seam tape that holds the air in between the two layers of floor. When you have air leaking out of a bailing hole it means it is getting out of the floor between the layers. Sometimes if the weakness/ failure is big enough you can see it as a bulge in the side of the floor when it is inflated. If you can't, when you get inside, you'll need to find where the inside seam tape is loose, kinked or whatever the weakness is thats allowing it to escape. It may not be right there. Inside seam tape problems can be a real bitch to find. Sometimes you can't do it reasonably. The other option you have if the leak out of the bailing hole is real slow is to patch the cut and then use an interior sealant that will fill the weakness from the inside. Its not my preferred option but it can work. No amount of outside patching over the bailing holes, etc will stop that leak.


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## kengore (May 29, 2008)

I agree with Zach's assessment. (And Zach, thank you for your pro advise to the community, I have learned a lot from you over the years) 

The rip looks to well centered on the tube to be an accident. Looks to me like it was cut on purpose for a seam repair.

I have not tried it on a raft, but I have had luck fixing seam leaks on dry bags using Aqua Seal, thinned with acetone. 

I mix the Aqua Seal with acetone to the consistency of water, use the corner of a ziplock bag for easy mess free mixing. I then transfer to a glue syringe (hardware store) and apply the adhesive to the interior fold of the seam. The thinned fluid lets capillary action help it to seep into the nooks and crannies. Use something to hold the surfaces you don't want glued apart, Aqua Seal will take 24 hours to cure. Perhaps a well placed balloon would work. Place the glued seam down so gravity will help distribute stuff where you want it.


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## noahfecks (Jun 14, 2008)

Elvez said:


> Where is the OP located?
> 
> Also, wow. One simple misunderstanding and a whole lot of folks just can't wait to jump someone's shit. Good ol' internet.





Anton8100 said:


> Yes sadly , I got more shit then advice. Buts it’s all good. I’m thankful for what I can get. Thanks again for all the advice. I ordered glue and patch material.



You committed Libel against the man and still haven't made a formal retraction or apology. It was clearly your intention to cast him in a poor light and even after he twice informed you that you had the wrong guy you persisted. In the end Zack was still the bigger person and has given you free advise and you continue to act like a self righteous entitled shit. Stay classy


I hope not to ever need the services of Zack but he has earned my business for his VERY generous contribution here :thumbsup:



libel
1) n. to publish in print (including pictures), writing or broadcast through radio, television or film, an untruth about another which will do harm to that person or his/her reputation, by tending to bring the target into ridicule, hatred, scorn or contempt of others. Libel is the written or broadcast form of defamation, distinguished from slander, which is oral defamation. It is a tort (civil wrong) making the person or entity (like a newspaper, magazine or political organization) open to a lawsuit for damages by the person who can prove the statement about him/her was a lie. Publication need only be to one person, but it must be a statement which claims to be fact and is not clearly identified as an opinion. While it is sometimes said that the person making the libelous statement must have been intentional and malicious, actually it need only be obvious that the statement would do harm and is untrue.


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## Anton8100 (Nov 14, 2018)

noahfecks said:


> You committed Libel against the man and still haven't made a formal retraction or apology. It was clearly your intention to cast him in a poor light and even after he twice informed you that you had the wrong guy you persisted. In the end Zack was still the bigger person and has given you free advise and you continue to act like a self righteous entitled shit. Stay classy
> 
> 
> I hope not to ever need the services of Zack but he has earned my business for his VERY generous contribution here :thumbsup:
> ...




Great info .. since we are giving life lessons here, how about you read in content. Always read in content ! The Zach that Is giving me advice isn’t the Zach I talked to over the phone. I’m thankful to Zach that we were able to Clarify that. That’s all there was to it... Also I will not scoop down to your level and insult you personally since I have no personal knowledge of you. Can’t wait to hit the waters! Trip planned on the 29th and 30th of this month.


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## JBar (Jul 4, 2009)

I don’t have a need to know, but Im curious.How do you apply an interior patch?


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

When the hole is big enough to require one it becomes available for you to work the piece inside through said hole. Usually you roll the glued up patch and finagle it in. Then you unroll it and set it from the topside. There is a bit of magic involved as well!


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## cupido76 (May 22, 2009)

zbaird said:


> When the hole is big enough to require one it becomes available for you to work the piece inside through said hole. Usually you roll the glued up patch and finagle it in. Then you unroll it and set it from the topside. There is a bit of magic involved as well!


How do you apply the glue to the inside in a way that even close to matches your patch? And how do you avoid gluing your tube to the other side?


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

Now you're asking for trade secrets! 

You can lay out the patch on the outside and mark approximate dimensions if you're worried about glue inside the boat. You can put a stay of some sort inside the boat for the gluing process to keep the layers from touching. Try not to get much glue on the bottom side of the inside.  Like I said, there is a little bit of magic involved. If its your first inside patch I'd recommend a dry run first to wrap your head around it. There are definitely good reasons a lot of people choose to send that sort of stuff to the shop. Botched inside patches are one of the shittier things to try and clean up to get a good surface to bond to. Its all blind work done by feel and takes time. Often times twice the cost it would have been if it was a fresh rip.


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## cupido76 (May 22, 2009)

^^^ haha... I guess I am.

I'd love to have a service like what you do near me, unfortunately rafting doesn't have the popularity up here in Canada that it does in the US... So there's nobody I know of locally who does this kind of work, and cross boarder freight would be prohibitively expensive and a logistical nightmare with customs.

I always thought that if i had a big rip I'd stitch it closed first and put a large patch on after. Do you think this would be a better repair method for a non pro to attempt? And would it hold?


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

A good stitch job and well applied patch with a few inches of overlay would get you home for sure.


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## MT4Runner (Apr 6, 2012)

Anton, please reread what you've written




Anton8100 said:


> Funny thing you mention Zach. I actually called him and wanting to know if he could give me some tips over the phone and he responds by telling me he doesn’t do tech support. So I said thank you and hung up. Didn’t seem he wanted to help me. Not upset, he is a private business owner and he is allowed to do as pleased. So i am going to use NRS and they will have my business. They are super friendly and informative! They also have a good bit of products online that I can buy.





Anton8100 said:


> He didn’t have to give me any info at all. I’m all for private companies do what you gotta do. We live in capitalism ! Thank god! I can go next door and find service I’m looking for





Anton8100 said:


> Absolutely! I do apologize! Your def not the same Zach in Colorado that I spoke to yesterday. That was a mere coincidence. Thanks for advice.





Anton8100 said:


> Yes sadly , I got more shit then advice. Buts it’s all good. I’m thankful for what I can get. Thanks again for all the advice. I ordered glue and patch material.





Anton8100 said:


> Great info .. since we are giving life lessons here, how about you read in content. Always read in content ! The Zach that Is giving me advice isn’t the Zach I talked to over the phone. I’m thankful to Zach that we were able to Clarify that. That’s all there was to it... Also I will not scoop down to your level and insult you personally since I have no personal knowledge of you. Can’t wait to hit the waters! Trip planned on the 29th and 30th of this month.


You come off a bit brash, and having done so, the apology doesn't seem entirely sincere. More humility could go a LOOONNNG WAY. (Saying this as a person who has myself put my own foot in my mouth more than once).


Cheers!


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## TLaf (Sep 22, 2016)

Don’t think anyone’s mentioned that only shipping the floor is considerable less expensive. I am about ready to ship my floor in for repair and I was surprised how light and small the package is going to be. Since I believed he said he was a first time raft owner he might not realize this point?


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## johng (Apr 25, 2005)

I'm not even a rafter, but I gotta' say, having dealt with many other sorts of repairs, if it was my boat I'd send it to Zach. This seems like a case where the learning could be both tedious and expensive, and I'd want a pro who's developed the 'touch and feel' that will be required. I really liked the idea to ship it out, then follow it up with a Colorado vacation on the Ark!


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## FlyingDutchman (Mar 25, 2014)

TLaf, if you look at the OP’s photos, the floor is glued into the boat, not laced for easy separation.


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## peernisse (Jun 1, 2011)

In short, ship the boat to the manufacturer and have them fix it. If you had to patch that yourself, which you do not, it would be a meticulous inside and outside patch job that I would only attempt if I had to because I was on a trip. This would add a day to your trip. That said, they will fix it right up and it will be a great boat. Provided you do not slide it off the same trailer that I suspect slashed that thing twice in the same location.


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