# What would you do to this old Hyside?



## 2kanzam (Aug 1, 2012)

Hey guys, long time lurker-first time poster from the east coast here. Great site, much better than any of the sites I have found that cater to east coast rafters!! You guys have already answered a ton of questions for me here!...and I'll try to keep this brief. I have been paddling/ rafting for years with friends/family who guide the New and Gauley here in WV (so mostly riding along on the big stuff). My expertise and passion lies mainly in fishing and only light whitewater (if I'm rowing). Until recently I owned only a duckie and a bucket raft but.....

My uncle GAVE me early 1980's 14ft hyside self bailer he hasn't used in forever. I don't really plan on doing big whitewater...as I am framing this to fish with in class II-IIIs (the calm parts of the new etc) and maybe hit a IV or two on occaission also camp here and there. We have taken the boat out several times for these uses.

Cosmetically it isn't too bad, main tubes are faded, some wear from frames etc....there are some small spots with frays but should easily be taken care of with paint or the flash of a heat gun, no checking/cracking/peeling at all and only one small patch I can think of. *The main tubes hold air for as long as I leave 'em.*

The two* thwarts* are in slightly worse condition and* lose air very slowly* (like get a little soft after 24hrs) , but nothing that won't be easily sealed with flex seal or might use paint.

The* floor* has itself is in *good condition structurally but has a leaky leafield A6 PRV*. The valve itslef seeps and the around the valve seeps a little. Still nothing too bad just top off once in awhile. This *should* be an easy fix.

Here is the kicker. I fill up from one military valve and the whole thing inflates...obviously the same for deflate, so I guess *ALL of the baffles are bad*?? I don't know how that is even possible but considering the light use I described above, the age/condition of the boat, and yet I want a sturdy and safe boat, what would you do to this raft?

I could keep it as is, free and just not run anything really bad in it EVER. Just row and fish basically.

OR, would you fix all the baffles, which in what I've read here might cost up to $700 maybe more?....not money I'm dying to spend considering I've bought the frame n' oars n' all that already, but at least then my guide friends and family could take us on the big water we are famous for here in WV.

OR is it possible to just get two baffles fixed just for a little added safety and keep her on still pretty "calm" stuff?

I really want to run this boat for awhile before I upgrade to something newer.

The expertise on this site is exactly what I need! Thanks and I look forward to being part of the community here!

-Tom


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## montana_field (Mar 28, 2011)

Tom,
It sounds like it was over inflated on several occasions and left in the sun. Also, I would bet there is still one baffle left intact and you have three failing. Your real issue that it's not worth fixing the baffles for lots of $ as the boat is too old.


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## BCJ (Mar 3, 2008)

If I understand correctly, there are no longer ANY baffles in this boat. Second, the main tubes are faded and the thwarts both leak. 

Seems like the only way to rehab this boat would be to have it done professionally, which I suspect would run into a lot of labor hours. If you can do any repairs yourself, that's one thing, but opening up the main tubes to get at the baffles is a big job. And, if the thwarts leak at the sames, that would be good to know, because, again, fixing a pinhole leak or bad valve seal is different from opening up and reglueing a seam.

I'd take it to a shop and get an estimate. By all means I wouldn't go into anyplace remote in a single-chamber raft. One leak can sink it, etc. 

Sounds like the boat was left in the sun pretty often. That's usually how glue around baffles goes bad, i.e., heats up and loosens. 

By all means


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## 2kanzam (Aug 1, 2012)

Monatana...yes that is the issue, "how much money should I spend on an ancient raft, if any?". I'm fine with spending some $$ on the gear as I do plan on someday upgrading.

BCJ I believe they are pinholes in the thwarts although I have not yet tried locating them. I have some experience in repair, but I'm not doing the baffles. I do have a guy that does that here, I plan on talking to him about it this winter, but I wanted expert opinions on what a break point might. For better or worse we don't really have anything I'd really call "remote" here like y'all do out west, so thats a plus *kinda*....it does bother me having a one chamber boat none the less.

sun-that makes sense!


So lemme re-word my question...since I've heard these early 80's hysides are "bomber", how much money would y'all consider sinking into it?? I think I'm hearing "Not much".

Thanks alot guys!


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## montana_field (Mar 28, 2011)

Not much or none. Spend $ on good gear and save for Maravia boat.


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## kengore (May 29, 2008)

I would be wary of floating in a single chamber boat, all it would take is one good size gash and you would be underwater in a matter of seconds. Your chances of swimming to safety are better in class II water, but people can drown in slow water too. 

Forgetting for a moment the risk to life and safety, have you considered the value of the fishing gear that you would likely loose in such an event. I figure with two full sets of rod, reel and flies I have something like $3000 worth of gear on the boat. It's not worth the risk, even if I know I could make the swim.

Looking at the swap page you could probaly purchase a servicable used raft for somewhere around $2500. So spending $700 seems unjustified.

Sounds like a great 'project' boat for someone that wants to learn how to do serious raft repair! The baffle repair isn't rocket science, it's just hard to get at and therefore time consuming. You would need to slice open the tubes to gain access, repair the baffles, then patch the cut in the tubes. If you are a handy kind of guy and have some free time you could learn to do the repair yourself.


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## 2kanzam (Aug 1, 2012)

Kengore, the single chamber does bother me, hence the question, but so does throwing the boat away! For the meantime I take as little gear with me as possible for this reason, I am very aware of the dangers of water, I have been a river rat my whole life and I have lost friends to drowning. I do tend to take on projects though, and that's why my uncle gave me this boat. I just know that the baffles would be time consuming.

I'm ok with the minimizing risk for the meantime until I can justifiably afford one, but $2500 is out of the question at the moment. At least our rocks around here are smooth and not the sharp ones you have out west, so my risk of gashing is minimal, although possible (there is a rapid named "metal chunk" in the new).

It just seems to otherwise be too good of a raft to give up on.

Would y'all really just completely scrap it and hafta wait 2-3 years to get back on the water?

Thanks again!


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## Wadeinthewater (Mar 22, 2009)

*Minority opinion*

If you are willing to accept the minimal risk of losing the boat and other gear in the event of catastrphic failure, then I would row it as is. The boat is not worth putting too much money into. Maybe fix the pressure relief valve if it becomes too much of a PITA.


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## kengore (May 29, 2008)

It's not the rocks I'm afraid of, it's things like broken bottles, barbed wire, sharp tree branches and chunks of re-bar.

If it were me I would try the baffle repair. Like you I would find it hard to walk away from a free boat. You could probaly get all the tools and materials needed for under $50. Offer to take the 'local guy' out to lunch in exchange for a detailed 'how to' discussion. Even if you had to bail on the baffle repair you could fix the access cuts and be right back where you started.

I've also heard of folks filling old boats with expanding urethane foam converting them into 'semi-rigid' boats. The foam is sold for filling the floatation chambers on pontoon style boats.


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## 2kanzam (Aug 1, 2012)

kengore said:


> It's not the rocks I'm afraid of, it's things like broken bottles, barbed wire, sharp tree branches and chunks of re-bar.
> 
> If it were me I would try the baffle repair. Like you I would find it hard to walk away from a free boat. You could probaly get all the tools and materials needed for under $50. Offer to take the 'local guy' out to lunch in exchange for a detailed 'how to' discussion. Even if you had to bail on the baffle repair you could fix the access cuts and be right back where you started.
> 
> I've also heard of folks filling old boats with expanding urethane foam converting them into 'semi-rigid' boats. The foam is sold for filling the floatation chambers on pontoon style boats.


 
WHOA! the foam is a great idea! Although the fold-up is one of my main reasons for liking inflatables so much....taking ole boy out to lunch ain't such a bad idea either, there's an awful good restaraunt nearby him.

I've been pushing rubber (ok well PVC too) for years now and I have yet to tear a "gash" in anything but I am pretty careful......come to think of it I prolly outta knock on wood right about now...


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## mcfarrel (Apr 1, 2006)

let it ride... A friend of mine bought a bucket boat for twenty bucks at a gear swap. The boat info said it was "a sea worthy craft" we have had a ton of fun in the boat. Just don't bring anything you can't afford to lose when she sinks


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## BCJ (Mar 3, 2008)

WVa, Hysides are good boats, but with all the running around and $$$ you can spend trying to rehab something with that many problems you might find something that doesn't need all the work. Really hard to say without seeing it. Does not sound like a self-bailer, either, so it has limited resale value. Hard to even give away a bucket boat these days, though I have friends that still row them and have no particular problem with them myself. I've rowed Avons since the late 70's so I may be sorta biased on brands and don't usually comment to much about that. Except to say, yes, Hyside boats are strong and durable, but nothing lasts forever (except Avon - grin) or holds up if abused too harshly (except Avon - - grin again). Have fun!


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## salmonjammer (Dec 14, 2011)

*Fix it yourself*

Shoot we tore a hole in a old campways type boat on the middle fork big enough to easily fix a baffle through, had to fix it on the bank. Put a patch on the inside, then another on the outside, right there on the rocks. Used the boat for another 5 or 6 years, then sold it. Patch was holding fine. Should be easy to either heat seam and open boat or simply cut a hole in side, fix baffle, then patch. Worst case is you open it up, and it is too much, then you have a whole lot of patch material!! I have a 1998 Hysides self bailer, still going strong. Just put in new valves last winter. Just got off 7 days on lower salmon, work great, again.


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## 2kanzam (Aug 1, 2012)

Yeah I think I may have undersold the condition of the rest of the boat....I have friends with nastier looking ones for sure!

Anyways prolly not worth putting a ton of money into it, but enough to do it myself.

It's definitely a self-bailer.....LOL!!

Thanks again guys and I'll let you know how it goes!


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## Richard at Hyside (Aug 1, 2012)

*FACELIFT TO A WEATHERED HYSIDE*

I would soap the boat down and findout exactly where all the issues are. Use a table spoon of dish soap in a windex bottle, fill with H20 and go to town on it. Make a permanent fix where you can with patches. (don't flexseal) The boat needs a little TLC after years in the sun (neglect). The fading is the pigment breaking down, not the Hypalon. If you don't have a fabric leak (wicking) this boat is good for many more years. 

Keep in mind that pressure release valves can go bad for many reasons so don't assume they are always working.
The baffles may only need to be reattached depending on the cause of the failure. Severe overpressure could have torn them, worst case. 
Shop around after you findout all the issues...the fall is the best time to visit (on line) repair centers (not busy..best prices) You can ship the boat UPS just about anywhere in the country for probably $65. Take the thwarts out if they don't need repair (less weight)


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## bluebtr (May 27, 2011)

If the floor is in good shape, find a bucketboat that is in good shape and retro the floor to it, it is easy to do and buckets can be had for next to nothing, WAY easier than trying to fix the baffles, just be sure you replace the check valve on the floor, that is the weak link in the older hyside floors.


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## Richard at Hyside (Aug 1, 2012)

Unfortunately most people think because they have a pressure release valve it is working. Thankl goodness there is a check light on the dash of cars to tell you you are low on oil. The manufacturers that make pressure release valve only warranty them for one year. Knowing this you may wish to learn how to tell if it is working or not. The statement ..."the check valve is the waek line on an old Hyside" is only half true...a bad check valve is a weak link on any floor.


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## matt cook (Dec 15, 2009)

Install a urethane bladder from Aire. $250+one patch=2 chambers and peace of mind


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## bluebtr (May 27, 2011)

Richard at Hyside said:


> Unfortunately most people think because they have a pressure release valve it is working. Thankl goodness there is a check light on the dash of cars to tell you you are low on oil. The manufacturers that make pressure release valve only warranty them for one year. Knowing this you may wish to learn how to tell if it is working or not. The statement ..."the check valve is the waek line on an old Hyside" is only half true...a bad check valve is a weak link on any floor.


 EEEXXXCCCUUUSSSEEE ME! I am just trying to help the guy , unbunch you're pantys Dick!


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## Skyman (Jun 26, 2006)

bluebtr said:


> EEEXXXCCCUUUSSSEEE ME! I am just trying to help the guy , unbunch you're pantys Dick!


Sounds like your panties are in a bunch. I saw nothing wrong with Richard's post? Geez.


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