# Scouting/Reading Holes



## COUNT (Jul 5, 2005)

Boil line-the dividing line between the water moving downstream and the water recirculating back into the hole. If this line is more than say 5' from the hole, you're going to have to paddle like hell to get past the recirculating water even if you make it through the hole.


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## GoodTimes (Mar 9, 2006)

Oh man....that's such a tough one to answer. When I'm scouting from shore, it's easy.....volume of water, gradient/fall, boil line. But read and run??? Pretty tough to answer. 

Big water pool drop.....usually a "calm before the storm"....and seeing a big glassy build-up (imminent huge ledge....ex. LAVA) at the top of a drop is a clear indication I'm probably going around it. Big water, middle of the rapid, I'm looking more for boil areas than ledges as they can be harder to see in the middle of a rapid. In other words, it's easier to see turbulence created by a ledge in the middle of a rapid rather than spotting the actual source. Does that make sense???

Lower flow, greater gradient. It's usually easier to see, read and run. The higher flow/tongue is easier to spot (for me). Example....Numbers...#1....no big deal in a kayak, but rowing that little rapid is KICK ASS. Probably one of the funnest on numbers on the oars. Higher flow, I'm talkin' about 2k+. The ledges that a few of those rocks form is VERY obvious throughout the rapid....avoid. 

Read and run (on a new stretch)....I do my damndest to see the WHOLE rapid as best I can before dropping in. Keeping with the main flow is always my goal....kayak or raft. If I'm feeling saucy and want to punch something....I'll scout it usually.


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## DanOrion (Jun 8, 2004)

A few additional thoughts
From a class IV read and run perspective: glassy dome = sticky hole, boof or skirt
When scouting: rock in hole backwash (sometimes evidenced by uneven boil line, spashiness in backwash) = don't want to be there


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## UserName (Sep 7, 2007)

I look for other kayakers getting absolutely trashed in it, then run left (right...).


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## dvanhouten (Dec 29, 2003)

I like to take several probes along. If they have problems, I take a different line. My attempts in the role of a probe generally encourages my fellow boaters to portage.


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## Chip (Apr 7, 2007)

This is my boat-scouting routine. The larger the difference in surface elevation between a hole and the surrounding downstream water, the more suction/power there is. So if I can actually _see_ the water inside a hole from upstream, I might run it head-on. 

If I can't see the bottom and the tailwave is really steep and haystacky- looking, with visible surges (building and breaking upstream) then I try to go around. Unless it's too late. 

O shit!


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## Roy (Oct 30, 2003)

The lead-in: Is there a nice clean boof, or maybe a spout or a flake or something to get me up and over? Or is it a big, sloping ramp driving straight into the meat? :shock:


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## SSOWDEN (Apr 29, 2004)

I like the probe technique user-hout employ. Makes for good stories at the takeout and something to include in your home made river songs. 

I remember not checking the flow in upper blue with a newbie. Came around the bend above boulder creek and my newbie had the deer in headlights look. My probing adventure was interesting in the least but he made it.

Seriously though, as a kayaker I feel anything I can punch/slice through then I will run. As long as I am stroking hard(everyone loves a good hard stroke) should not be sucked back in, which can happen to rubber. Steepness is the key for me unless I am really safe in a smiling free trundler.


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## craven_morhead (Feb 20, 2007)

Chip's advice is pretty solid; if I can see the wash-out from upstream and there isn't a noticeable difference in height between the boil and the rest of the river, it's probably punch-able. For ledges, I often look for the strongest downstream current below the ledge and just boof into that.


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## skyegod (Apr 23, 2009)

dvanhouten said:


> I like to take several probes along. If they have problems, I take a different line. My attempts in the role of a probe generally encourages my fellow boaters to portage.



What do you mean Probe? Is it a 12 foot long probe that you might use in Avi rescue, or something else?

Thanks


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## Riparian (Feb 7, 2009)

I'm pretty sure by "probes" he meant sacrificial lambs...


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## skyegod (Apr 23, 2009)

So a brightly colored floating thing that you chuck in upstream and sea what happens downstream?


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## [email protected] (Apr 26, 2006)

probe= someone testing out the line/hole

if I'm trying to boof it I just look for the the best boof lip.
if I'm trying to go under it then I focus more on the out flowing of water.

I also look at safety options, most holes you should be able to swim out of but if the back wash is really strong I want someone with a rope. Also need to consider what is around the hole (if it feeds under an undercut ect.).


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## SSOWDEN (Apr 29, 2004)

Thanks for opening this up, newbie??????
Watch out Skyegood's gonna make you make you wait two hours at the putin, take your whistle and throw t-legs at ya when you are scouting #5 for the boil lines. He will be too drunk on schlitz to run the rest.
If you are really a newbie have fun figurin it out.


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## skyegod (Apr 23, 2009)

SSOWDEN said:


> Thanks for opening this up, newbie??????
> Watch out Skyegood's gonna make you make you wait two hours at the putin, take your whistle and throw t-legs at ya when you are scouting #5 for the boil lines. He will be too drunk on schlitz to run the rest.
> If you are really a newbie have fun figurin it out.


HUH!!~~~???


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## paddlebizzle (Oct 15, 2003)

Huh?


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## paddlebizzle (Oct 15, 2003)

teleboater5.13 said:


> Obviously shape (frowning vs smiling) play major roles in the way a hole will act


I've never heard of a frowning/smiling hole. What's the story? I found this via Google:
http://www.soak.com/topic/outdoorliving/article/tshow/88609/a+smile+or+a+frown

I don't understand what part of the hole is smiling/frowning. Is it the boil/wash downstream? Is it the shape of the crease on the upstream side of the whole (where the obstacle/rock is)?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

paddle as you are reading the river if its frowning as you look at its no good if its smiling its good... frowning is bad because the center of the hole(your position while getting spanked) is downstream of where the water is exiting the hole; its harder to work out of the edge and more than likely it will severely beat you down and push you back to the furtest downstream place in the hole which is the meat(top of frown)...... if its smiling it means the water is exiting at an angle where you most likely will either wash out automatically or can paddle out... frowning bad, smiling good.


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## SSOWDEN (Apr 29, 2004)

sky,
Welcome to the buzz. find the grif posts, funny reads dude.


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## El Flaco (Nov 5, 2003)

Riparian said:


> I'm pretty sure by "probes" he meant sacrificial lambs...


Gary E likes to call this "The Sharp End". Tries to talk you into "letting your hair down" i.e. Vallecito at 2.8'.


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## Ture (Apr 12, 2004)

paddlebizzle said:


> I've never heard of a frowning/smiling hole. What's the story? I found this via Google:
> A SMILE OR A FROWN - Outdoor Living - SOAK
> 
> I don't understand what part of the hole is smiling/frowning. Is it the boil/wash downstream? Is it the shape of the crease on the upstream side of the whole (where the obstacle/rock is)?


It is the shape of the crease. I never liked the frowning versus smiling analogy because I could not remember if it was supposed to be frowning or smiling looking upstream or downstream.

Mike Mathers (the swiftwater rescue guy) said something to me that finally made sense to me and now I can remember it: if the current of the river is flowing into the edges of the hole then that's the bad one.

In a smiling hole (bird's eye view from upstream), the upturned ends of the smile are facing downstream, so you just make your way to the edge and grab a piece of current and the current will pull you out of the hole.

In a frowning hole (bird's eye view from upstream), the downturned ends of the smile are facing upstream and if you work your way to the edge of the hole then the current will push you back into the hole.


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## Airborne2504 (Jul 11, 2008)

*Kinda like this right?*



caspermike said:


> paddle as you are reading the river if its frowning as you look at its no good if its smiling its good... frowning is bad because the center of the hole(your position while getting spanked) is downstream of where the water is exiting the hole; its harder to work out of the edge and more than likely it will severely beat you down and push you back to the furtest downstream place in the hole which is the meat(top of frown)...... if its smiling it means the water is exiting at an angle where you most likely will either wash out automatically or can paddle out... frowning bad, smiling good.


Thought it might help for him to have a visual. Casper, let me know if I got this right...Here's a picture that I took of Sunshine Hole in the Royal Gorge. It makes a Smiley face for the most part, but is kinda unique b/c it has that tongue on the right side of it. OR, am I getting it backwards??

First pic is the regular pic. The 2nd pic is one I used MS Paint on to draw the Smiley Face...I added the eyes for better clarification HAHA.


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## El Flaco (Nov 5, 2003)

Airborne2504 said:


> First pic is the regular pic. The 2nd pic is one I used MS Paint on to draw the Smiley Face...I added the eyes for better clarification HAHA.



Fixed:


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

thats a pour over, hydraulic. bad hole but say if there was current instead of that rock than it probably would look more frowny.. this one is deceiving i was talking more in the big river sense of things.


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## tellutwurp (Jul 8, 2005)

I have always been just as concerned with what is immediately downstream. Pins, sieve, entrapment potential, long ass swim. What are the chances of me making the move, what happens if I don't.

Most of the stuff I boat has plenty of beta so there really aren't many surprises. that said, usually start at the bottom of a scout and work backwards.


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## islandertek (Apr 4, 2008)

El Flaco said:


> Fixed:


 This is actually a good hole because it exits out the sides. If it were the opposite shape like this " ) " then it is bad because there is no exit from the side it circulates you back into the hole when this shape " ( " would spit you out of the sides. This is looking from upstream down towards the hole downstream. Check out Ken Whitings "Whitewater Kayaking The Ultimate Guide". It explains it very well and has some pictures!!

Cheers!

-Nick


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## islandertek (Apr 4, 2008)

Airborne2504 said:


> Thought it might help for him to have a visual. Casper, let me know if I got this right...Here's a picture that I took of Sunshine Hole in the Royal Gorge. It makes a Smiley face for the most part, but is kinda unique b/c it has that tongue on the right side of it. OR, am I getting it backwards??
> 
> First pic is the regular pic. The 2nd pic is one I used MS Paint on to draw the Smiley Face...I added the eyes for better clarification HAHA.


 
You're right Alex!! This would be considered a good hole if it weren't for the side rocks and rocks at the exit causing a strong hydrolic pulling back to the hole. But you got the smiley orientation right!! If it were opposite of this picture, it would be considered "bad".

-Nick


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## paddlebizzle (Oct 15, 2003)

Ture - Mather's analogy makes sense: basically if the hole creates so much negative pressure that the river flows into the frown, that's a nasty situation to be in. Otherwise, a smiley face is a safer hole because you can grab current from the sides and get out of it.


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## freexbiker (Jul 18, 2005)

*Random Comadeered photos from gallary To show happy Frowning*

Happy








Frowning


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## river_junkie (Jan 23, 2008)

Airborne2504 said:


> Thought it might help for him to have a visual. Casper, let me know if I got this right...Here's a picture that I took of Sunshine Hole in the Royal Gorge. It makes a Smiley face for the most part, but is kinda unique b/c it has that tongue on the right side of it. OR, am I getting it backwards??
> 
> First pic is the regular pic. The 2nd pic is one I used MS Paint on to draw the Smiley Face...I added the eyes for better clarification HAHA.


A little off topic but when was this picture of sunshine taken? Thx!


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