# Are paddlers here excited about the Jackson Fun Runner?



## idahofloater

Looks like eric's second shot at the "godzilla" 

Whats up with all the retro boats coming back? I guess you really can polish a turd. 

Sorry No more polished turds for me please. I got rid of that sh!t in the 90's.


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## jmack

Finally some competition for the Wavesport Z!


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## thecraw

We expect the crowd that fell in love with the original fun series, (which by the way was a lot of people), will really enjoy this design. The Fun series was always meant to be our River/Play series. The fact is, the Fun series got more and more play oriented through the design cycles,and is exactly why we are taking the Fun Runner design back a bit towards true river running.
This boat is actually pretty damn cool... well if you aren't such the freestyle stud that Josh is anyway! Ha...
There are a LOT of people that want a kayak that is super fun to just paddle down river. Not something big/bulky, but something nimble, super fast, and rather fun to surf with. I may be the worlds worst full-on freestyle paddler, but I am the king of the front surf, flat spin type playboating. For that reason I will be paddling the heck out of this boat. Well, once my shoulder gets back to shape after surgery!!! 
It surfs damn near a ripple, it's loaded up with our new 2012 outfitting, and it's REALLY LIGHT. This design is very much for the crowd that paddled and loved the earlier fun series (04 and 07 especially), but were also really more into the river running as opposed to the freestyle side of things. The stability is crazy solid, the edge carving is stellar and bottom line, it rolls like a Jackson... EASY as it gets.
The Fun Runner is not a core design for the likes of those competing for instance, this is for those that want to become way more confident with down river paddling, improving their surfing skills, attaining eddies, cartwheeling. AND, to do it in a modern design with a modern day planing hull with chine that is designed to not get hung up, with outfitting that is super light and easy to fit perfectly with minor adjustments.
Is this the right boat for you Josh? Hard to say, but it also might be the perfect boat for someone that mostly creek boats, but wants something a bit more playful when running the numbers, or even gore for that matter!


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## jmack

You got me all wrong Marty! I like longer boats like the Wavesport Z. I just think it is funny that people on Mountainbuzz dismiss those older longer designs as useless (like when anyone asks about buying a used one) and then Jackson comes out with a boat that looks alot like what I was paddling 10 years ago. 

It probably wouldn't hurt for newbies to paddle a boat with some hull speed; and I'll be more than happy to run your demo into some rocks some time.


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## Dave Frank

I'm thinking Grand Canyon boat!


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## deepsouthpaddler

Its good to see Jackson filling the river runner niche.

Seems like many of the "river runner" boats are either closer to a creekboat or a playboat. I can see why some folks would like a good river runner. 

Perhaps kayak designs come full circle back to fundamental designs of the past, but new advancements in outfitting, hull design, edges, and decks will likely make new boats superior to the similar looking boats of yesterday.


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## KSC

I was listening to one of the last "In Between Swims" podcasts where they had people from a few different kayak manufacturers talking about the future of boat designs. EJ walked in late after much of the discussion had already taken place. 

Woody from LL at some point tried to summarize his thoughts and says something like, "So basically, all the designs and materials have really already been thought of and we're just kind of making small tweaks here and there to what already exists." EJ seemed shocked by this statement and his reaction was something like, "no way, there are so many new ideas to try we're only limited by time." Disclaimer: I'm strongly paraphrasing here based on my memory. Point is, there was a major difference in attitude. I'm not trying to bash Woody - in fact I've owned more LL boats than Jackson boats, but definitely appreciated EJ's attitude.

Seems to me that boats like this are part of trying out new ideas that allow more people to find their ideal boat. 

To answer the original question (aka CKS commercial) though, my first boat was an X. It was a good first boat, but I'm not excited about buying another one. Then again, I've never run the Grand Canyon.


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## idahofloater

There is no amount of hype that Jackson can through down that would lead me to believe that the Fun Runner is a new idea, a new design, or more fun to kayak than any other existing kayaking product on the market. Jackson creates some wicked boats and crazy hype. In the world of "show boating" jackson rules. LL is close behind!


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## thecraw

Idaho... this isn't a "new idea" and not sure anyone is claiming that. To be quite honest, it's far from a new idea in my opinion. What we feel it does do, is provides a modern solution to a huge part of the market that frankly... we have grown away from in our last several years designs. This design in concept is low volume river runner that is focused on big time fun. That said, what is "New" is a boat of this type, that has Jackson Kayak's 2012 outfitting and our touches to things like, super stable, incredibly easy to roll design, drop chines that don't get hung up, not to mention SUPER light and packages it for people that want the best in a modern day river runner... 
I appreciate the nod for hype and cool boats. I assure you this one may change your mind as well. Give it a try sometime, you might be surprised. I certainly was!


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## Alphacyber

It seems to me like this boat is to replace the old pure river runners that are still good boats but are old enough to be falling apart, like the RPM. That plastic doesn't last forever unless you never use the boat. Adding modern outfitting and a few new ideas to an older concept is a welcome addition to the market. Also, I'd love to get newbies into a boat like this because they wouldn't have to deal with features designed for the specialized extremes of creeking or freestyle. They have enough to worry about just making eddy turns and staying upright. If I weren't a starving student, this boat would likely make its way into my little collection soon.


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## idahofloater

thecraw said:


> That said, what is "New" is a boat of this type, that has Jackson Kayak's 2012 outfitting and our touches to things like, super stable, incredibly easy to roll design, drop chines that don't get hung up, not to mention SUPER light and packages it for people that want the best in a modern day river runner...
> !


That is edzackery what jackson says about every boat they ever made every year. Name one boat jackson has made that is NOT super stable. Name one jackson that does NOT roll easy, Name one Jackson boat that has drop chine hang up issues, Name one heavy Jackson boat. Name one Jackson boat that is not the best modern day kayak. And as far as outfitting goes, I'll take my closed cell, contact glue, and beach ball over any over priced system made by any kayak manufacturer. Its all just Hype baby. Hype ya up to think your getting something your not.


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## idahofloater

Alphacyber said:


> If I weren't a starving student, this boat would likely make its way into my little collection soon.


There are no staving students with an extra grand in their pockets to buy a boat. Jackson Knows this. Think about it??? If I were a "*starving student*" (like you) I would think poorly of any manufacture who would market to such a group with a high ticket item. Students buy used boats 95% of the time. This boat is nothing more than pure HYPE. I get the "idea" behind it. There are a number of recient wonderful used boat designs that would be equal to or better than this "idea" for the student. This boat is directed at the market that wants to buy a boat but doesn't know what they want. That old 45 year old guy who thinks that is want a kayak should look like and he wants to be a kayaker. He drops a grand (cuz he has a *JOB*)and another 500 for gear. The boat gets use twice and sits in his garage. Thats what this boat is about. and thats ok.


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## maribo

*I wonder how it compares ...*

Hi, Idahofloater. So, are you saying that there is no place for anything between a play boat and a creek boat?

It seems to me that this boat competes in the sporty river-runner market with boats like the Pyranha Z.One, Wavesport Diesel, Dagger Axiom, Riot Thunder. I wonder how the Fun-Runner compares to them?

... David


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## bvwp1

CKS now has then 2012 available in demo for you to try. They look great and will be the go to boat for many paddlers this spring.


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## thecraw

Maribo... Yes, I work for JK and I guess that means that I am part of the above described proverbial hype machine. Our dealers are getting Fun Runners delivered now and have been for a couple weeks. Reviews up to this point have been primarily from industry folk... instructional leaders, ACA, etc... That said, the design has been reviewed as spot on, as far as how it is marketed. 
This is the type of design that fits as a one boat quiver for those looking to run rivers, but also to have a balanced dose of play (surfing/squirting/non aerial type maneuvers.)
This will be my river/play boat of choice (the 70 size) going forward. The 4fun was my non creekboat of choice prior. Let me know if you have any other questions!

Adios!!!


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## idahofloater

maribo said:


> Hi, Idahofloater. So, are you saying that there is no place for anything between a play boat and a creek boat?
> 
> It seems to me that this boat competes in the sporty river-runner market with boats like the Pyranha Z.One, Wavesport Diesel, Dagger Axiom, Riot Thunder. I wonder how the Fun-Runner compares to them?
> 
> ... David


There is someone who will always part with thier dollars. If I were in the market for a old school boat I would NOT dig a grand out of my wallet. I'd just go buy a used Godzilla for $200.. just saying.


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## maribo

*Boat Design wrt Jackson Fun-Runner*

Idahofloater: I looked up the Wavesport Godzilla - It looks like a cool boat. In the same vein as the Necky Jive, it looks like. I would say that the boats I mentioned earlier and the Fun-Runner are an updating of these. So, for $1K you get at least new plastic and more ergonomic outfitting. I do not know if newer hull and deck designs achieve the playability/maneuverability/stability compromises any better. I an curious about it.

I wouldn't call this type of boat old-school, though. I think of old-school as Mirage/Dancer/ Pirouette/Outburst: much longer and full displacement hull.

For me, boats come in at least four categories. I have an AllStar for play boating, a composite Lettmann Bullet for sporty-river-running, an Eskimo Diablo for big-water I-just-want-to-make-it runs, and a Galasport Toro slalom boat for fast stuff. The Fun-Runner could substitute for the Bullet because it will probably be easier to roll. Maybe even the Diablo sometimes, if it is super-stable.

Cheers.


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## idahofloater

maribo said:


> Idahofloater: I looked up the Wavesport Godzilla - It looks like a cool boat. In the same vein as the Necky Jive, it looks like. I would say that the boats I mentioned earlier and the Fun-Runner are an updating of these. So, for $1K you get at least new plastic and more ergonomic outfitting. I do not know if newer hull and deck designs achieve the playability/maneuverability/stability compromises any better. I an curious about it.
> 
> I wouldn't call this type of boat old-school, though. I think of old-school as Mirage/Dancer/ Pirouette/Outburst: much longer and full displacement hull.
> 
> For me, boats come in at least four categories. I have an AllStar for play boating, a composite Lettmann Bullet for sporty-river-running, an Eskimo Diablo for big-water I-just-want-to-make-it runs, and a Galasport Toro slalom boat for fast stuff. The Fun-Runner could substitute for the Bullet because it will probably be easier to roll. Maybe even the Diablo sometimes, if it is super-stable.
> 
> Cheers.


WOW how many alts do you have???? Mario did you really create a profile just to have a conversaion with me about how great the "funrunner" is?? You got 2 posts. 

PS. I have owned a godzilla and a jive. not the same boat at all and they are both old school just like the remax and funruuner. the Dancer is ancient.. not even worh roll practice..

Whats soo wrong will being old school. Get a backbone and have some pride... The funrunner is just NOT for me!


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## maribo

I am not Mario. I just interested in boat design. Thinking about the Fun-Runner.
Best,
... David


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