# Poudre river report on April 25th, 2008



## Geezer (Oct 14, 2003)

That's fookin' depressing. :-(


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

it's coming up....


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## LiquidGuy87 (Aug 22, 2006)

Everybody needs to stop bitching and start scraping down it!

It's good to go... and it is coming up.


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## the_dude (May 31, 2006)

LiquidGuy87 said:


> Everybody needs to stop bitching


haven't really seen a lot of people bitching about it. it's about right on schedule, maybe a week or so behind, but here's to hoping that we're still boating in late august.


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## LiquidGuy87 (Aug 22, 2006)

Geezer said:


> That's fookin' depressing. :-(


I expect to see you complainers on Upper Narrows on Sunday. Should be a good time. Scott you in?


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

LiquidGuy87 said:


> I expect to see you complainers on Upper Narrows on Sunday. Should be a good time. Scott you in?


If my back feels better I am.


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## rideon (May 2, 2005)

*Sunday*

What time is anyone heading up today? Would be stoked to scrape down.


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## jeffy (Sep 17, 2004)

Mike,

I'm going to try and make it... what time? or are you already up there???

Send some pics from Friday my way.

J


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## mankster (Jul 6, 2005)

You guys are already running Uppers? Post some pics! What is the class of that right now, 4 or 5? Is it comparable to pineview at lower water? I have done Pineview at around 1.5 on the rock and got a new creeker this year and would love to work on my boof before it gets to high.


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## LiquidGuy87 (Aug 22, 2006)

*Sweeeet*

Good to see some people gettin' interested 

I would bring the playboat... it might be a little too low for a full on creeker. I would say the Super Collider is more technical than Pineview... and it does have a sieve/nasty pin spot. The line isn't hard... but if you totally botch it you'll be pretty uncomfortable. Setting strong safety to avoid any issue is EXTREMELY easy. 

The middle is scrapey (but today we should have more water than when Scott and I were up at the beginning of last week).

The lead in to Whiteline is easy... but getting the timing down on the boof is a little difficult. No high consequences... but you do want to lean left to avoid flipping into the wall. 

How about meeting around 2:45-3:00 at the takeout to Upper? 

See ya guys!

Mike 
240-638-6667


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## LiquidGuy87 (Aug 22, 2006)

*Change*

Make that 3:15-3:30...

Shitty school projects...


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

mankster said:


> You guys are already running Uppers? Post some pics! What is the class of that right now, 4 or 5? Is it comparable to pineview at lower water? I have done Pineview at around 1.5 on the rock and got a new creeker this year and would love to work on my boof before it gets to high.




















That was all from last weekend. Level is about the same. It is a lot different than pineview at 1.5ft. 

Scott


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## rideon (May 2, 2005)

*car pool?*

Anyone up for a car pool to meet at the aforementioned time?

Scott
691-0295


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## paulk (Apr 24, 2006)

I feel like i have rafted it that low


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

Today we had some good action. Levels went up again this week (still fucking low) but, we were able to paddle the entire section. Was it bad? Yup. We had a swimmer in the lower narrows and some of us had bad lines at Supercollider. Good news, I get some free ice-cream in the near future.

I do not recommend middle or lower until that damn river comes up another few inches.


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## jballen1 (Oct 27, 2006)

if only someone had some video of the botched lines....


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## mankster (Jul 6, 2005)

wow. I am glad I went mountainbiking instead.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

mankster said:


> wow. I am glad I went mountainbiking instead.


Awe, it was fun. Now all we need is Jeremy to post the video titled...

"The good, the bad, and the ugly".

Supercollider messed with 2/3 boaters that ran it yesterday. It's an intersting level for that move.


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## lotsawater (Nov 18, 2003)

The latest Chode Report:
It looks like the chodes were out in full force this weekend, runing the Gnarrows on supper high flows. 

Can you save this off topic shit for the eddy. That is not kayking nor picutre worthy. Where are the admins now, this is clearly not kayaking related!


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

lotsawater said:


> The latest Chode Report:
> It looks like the chodes were out in full force this weekend, runing the Gnarrows on supper high flows.
> 
> Can you save this off topic shit for the eddy. That is not kayking nor picutre worthy. Where are the admins now, this is clearly not kayaking related!


I think this is the worst attempt to flame a boating thread in a long time. Don't hold it against me that I look sexy in those shots. I'm quite sure I remember you running this shit over the last two years at this level.

If you come out this week, I'll help you perfect that rusty boof of yours as well. I could even put up a "how to boof" thread on here with pictures, videos, and interviews to make these runs legit. 

Didn't you swim out of your old Jefe at this level?

:mrgreen:


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## jballen1 (Oct 27, 2006)

here it is... what you've all been waiting for...



ACIDplanet.com Media Player


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## jballen1 (Oct 27, 2006)

Here's a better version then that previous link



YouTube - The good, the bad, and the ugly


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## South_Lander (Mar 15, 2006)

GA - those are the pics are a sorry excuse for kayaking. in fact i wouldn't really call that kayaking at all. its really just sliding over wet rocks. at this rate you'll proabbly wear through the hull on your boats faster than pete can jerk off to life's mom but don't worry PRK is re-opening and you'll probably be able to go over there and "borrow" a boat to use for the season.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

South_Lander said:


> GA - those are the pics are a sorry excuse for kayaking. in fact i wouldn't really call that kayaking at all. its really just sliding over wet rocks. at this rate you'll proabbly wear through the hull on your boats faster than pete can jerk off to life's mom but don't worry PRK is re-opening and you'll probably be able to go over there and "borrow" a boat to use for the season.


You girly men need to get that sand out of your panties and run the stuff! A low water day through the upper narrows is better than a day doing yard work. Upper Narrows is actually fun right now.. I'm quite sure I was smiling the entire way down. It was like being on Big South for the first time this year. I was stoked to be on the water "throwing boofs that splashed fish out of the water and onto the banks," as Pete so put it. Finish it off with a few beers and same well deserved ice-cream and you have a fine afternoon!

I'm not worried about my hull.. If it gets messed up it gets messed up. I'll get PRK to donate a boat to me since I'm one of the only guys on the river these days.. Maybe they want to sponsor my low water antics? Hmm....


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## South_Lander (Mar 15, 2006)

no one's saying you didn't have fun but calling it kayaking is a big stretch. i could jack off with a bottle of jergens but thats not really having sex. is it?


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## South_Lander (Mar 15, 2006)

oh and good luck with PRK. just be sure to ask this time.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

South_Lander said:


> no one's saying you didn't have fun but calling it kayaking is a big stretch. i could jack off with a bottle of jergens but thats not really having sex. is it?


Well... I would call it kayaking more than a lot of things that get run on the Poudre. I would rank the moves there, if done correctly, to be solid class 4 "creeking" moves. Hell, I've seen 6 people run both drops (15 runs through both super and whiteline) and I haven't seen any of them run it like they should. It's not as easy as it looks to be squeaky clean through them. Whiteline is getting easier, but it's still not "easy" for people just getting into creeking.

I'd rather have new creekers fumble around on the narrows at 2 inches then swim out of it at 2' b/c they can't get their timing right.

Practice is good.. Come up tomorrow night and I'll give you a beer. We'll be there ~5:30


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

GA TO CSU good job, you are looking for more water and bigger drops drive north 3.5 hours to this city called casper and give me a call i can get tomarrow off before the storm hits and we can run the shit. alot of drops. and there shouldn't be a mandatory portage in the upper half so get up here.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> GA TO CSU good job, you are looking for more water and bigger drops drive north 3.5 hours to this city called casper and give me a call i can get tomarrow off before the storm hits and we can run the shit. alot of drops. and there shouldn't be a mandatory portage in the upper half so get up here.


3.5 hours + working till 4pm sucks. Maybe when the water gets up and you have something worth driving 3.5 hours for, I'll come on up! Too bad Laramie isn't Casper.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

dude you are blind boxelder is running good i guess thats nothing compared to the poudre. by the way its real V+ creeking i guess i shouldve known that its not worth driving for a class 4 boater who would more than likely walk all the drops.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> dude you are blind boxelder is running good i guess thats nothing compared to the poudre. by the way its real V+ creeking i guess i shouldve known that its not worth driving for a class 4 boater who would more than likely walk all the drops.


I guess you're right.. You're too uber for me and, if I came up, I would only bring your possie down with my class 4 skills. I wouldn't know what to do if I got on a real class V+ (aka the Gnar Gnar) run. They don't have those where I come from.. Just shallow class 4 that makes me feel like an uber boater. 

Maybe I'll step it up this year and run something worth talking about. I hear Joe Wright is seriously gnarly. Would you agree?

I guess you missed the part about me having to work tomorrow. I leave Thursday AM to fly to Georgia and I don't get back till Monday. Maybe we can get together after that and have a penis measuring contest. I'll bring the ruler?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

As long as you bring your creek boat....


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> As long as you bring your creek boat....


I have a creek boat? Didn't we just cover the fact that I'm a class 4 boater that walks everything? Why own a creekboat when you can play the stuff between the "real class V+?" It's the safe way to see all the big drops. I even get to brag about how good I am based on the rivers that I play, while portaging all the rapids that are scary. 

Class V+ is crazy! Only the pros do that kind of stuff.

PS. This is entertaining. Keep posting so I have something to do at work. Better yet, teach me your uber technique so I can start becoming a better boater.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

hey bored at work as well huh...... same im just giving you shit cause well i have nothing better to do... and work sucks...... when you work for oil well parts distribution company..... seroisly was that shit only running 2 inchs?


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

That's ok.. I can handle it. I haven't had this much fun on mtn buzz since I got into an arguement about whether the Raven's Fork was better than the Big South. If you're bored.. feel free to read it...

http://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/f11/one-new-one-and-the-ravens-fork-10996.html

It was me and Southlander (aka fort collins stalker) getting into it that day.


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## prozoned (Jun 17, 2005)

I can't tell if you guys are friends and just joking around or if there are some real doushe bags on this forum. I hope lotsawater is just kidding, cuz if not he could not sound like a bigger tool


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

prozoned said:


> I can't tell if you guys are friends and just joking around or if there are some real doushe bags on this forum. I hope lotsawater is just kidding, cuz if not he could not sound like a bigger tool


i wish i could get on the ravenfork, but boxelder takes the cake in my book for best run, easliy all the none stop action and the bigger drops can get kinda scary. last weekend we decided to go on saturday with 4 fresh inchs on the ground. it was pretty cold but doable only portaged 2 on due to wood and the other due to needing 20cfs more and it would have been doable. but electric slide was 1st dand it was good my friend put a huge dent in his blissstick as he mid piton in it it was some good funny shit. great run overall and i think everyrun from now until kayaking boxelder is forgotten will have some sort of carnage of eather somebody denting boats or nearly smashing there faces and all the good stuff i love kayaking........ and watch out for all the seives and undercuts....


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

Casper,

You really should venture down south. Get there when it rains and do the Road Prong, Upper West Prong, and Ravens in a weekend. Easily the most fun that sober people can have. All are well over 500ft/mile (some approach 700ft/mile) and it's 95% runnable. Road and UWP are all runnable with Ravens requiring a portage or three.

Scott


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

That sounds fun..... especially if it were free. someday i will get out there this year im concentrating on all the wyoming runs i can before i move to montana next year. closer to bc surfing and big nasty creeks


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)

Montana, eh? You gonna be ready to run Big T with me? I'll give you verbals.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

skibuminwyo said:


> Montana, eh? You gonna be ready to run Big T with me? I'll give you verbals.


ahah you on big timber? yeah it will be some great snowboarding. im going to quit this shit job for the good stuff snowboarding all winter and boating all summer.


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)

Huh wha? Big T, as in Big T creek? No snowboarding, homeslice, at least when the snowboarding is rolling, so is the creeking.


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

Casper, enough about box elder. I have a reliable source saying that it's easy class 5. 

Not too mention he said he paddled the drops with a 14" crack in his boat and sharp ended the entire day. Also I heard your stud crew self destructed and did some walking when there wasn't a probe for for you folks.

Don't go calling people "class 4 paddlers" when you're bragging about a soft 5 run. What the hell is a 5++++ creek cause it ain't box elder and if you think it is; I promise you don't want the upper west prong, yet alone road and ravens. Cause those runs are the real shit.

So enough about box elder. Props for getting it done, but stop the madness. 

Gary

ps-TG you happy now? Coming your way this weekend


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)

Thank you Gary.


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## mankster (Jul 6, 2005)

casper,
I was wondering the same thing, what class V+ are you comparing this rating you gave it (boxelder)? Have you done a lot of V+? It seems like most class V+ I have seen pictures of, would have been real bad if they were probed blind. And is most of the run III-IV?
I am not trying to deny your first d. Keep killin it, that stuff is sweet.  
Just trying to get a feel how people rate rapids when it gets to that level. 


but back to the post at hand. When will the Poudre have water?


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

mankster said:


> but back to the post at hand. When will the Poudre have water?


I'm guessing 2 weeks. But, it's still fun. Come up to the Narrows tomorrow for a boofin' good time. I'll bring some beer.

As for rating rapids, no one uses this class 5+ bullshit. When I'm creeking, I prefer to use a decimal system. Class 5 is AW class 5 and then you get class 5.1, 5.2, 5.3 etc. Each step is a lot harder/stupider/more dangerous than the previous step. From what I could see in the pictures, I would go with a 5.1 rating for the big drop that some guy swam out of. The main reason behind this is that it's shallow, narrow, and tall enough to hurt you if you messed up.

Class 5: Supercollider @ 2 feet
Class 5.1: Fantasy Flight, Slideways, etc
Class 5.2: Meltdown, Cool world, Double Trouble, Big Boy, etc
Class 5.3: Doesn't exist on Big South at a sane level. But, out east I would give 40' 40' on the Toxaway, Mangler on Ravens Fork, etc

Class 5.2 is hard shit for sure. I wouldn't run Mangler or 40' 40' when I was on those runs.


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## yetigonecrazy (May 23, 2005)

hey, good stuff! you gotta boat what ya can, man! if 70-some cfs is all youve got, make the most of it!


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## LiquidGuy87 (Aug 22, 2006)

The most intelligent thing I've ever heard you TYPE. Keep it up Kit.



How's that new IK doing? Heard it boofs real easy.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

Class 5:










Class 5.1:











Class 5.2:










Class 5.3:

Can't find a picture of either drops. Basically any of the really big, really stupid, type shit.

Thanks to The Colorado Kayak Chronicle, www.coloradokayaking.com and Evan for the pictures.


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## RiverWrangler (Oct 14, 2003)

Just to keep up with the hate train and squash all the positive vibe on the last couple posts cause I'm up changing diapers with a crying baby... to agree with Gary, this whole Box Elder thing has gotten way way out of hand V+ blah blah blah ... I mean hopefully I'm going to be able to ditch the wife and the kid and come up and run that thing soon but please if you're going to name these rapids come up with at least one original tag. So far the three names I've heard already have a place on other rivers and creeks of note: 1. Balls to the Wall - a little canyon up in the northern parts of the state you're claiming, I believe it is the Clarks Fork Box, has a drop with a similar... or exactly the same name. 2. Hairy Beaver - up sorry already taken again, named after the late Charlie Beavers on the North Fork of Fish Creek. 3. Electric Slide - and once again hmmm, taken by a funky slide on Cross Creek near Vail.

All in jest, but seriously, respect the history, and get creative with it Casper, you're giving the young bucks a bad rep.


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

Also give the guy who ran the shit first, some imput! Don't just name them, with the guys who walked out. 

Mangler, Headless, room without a view, wintergreen, lol. I miss the east.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

Gary E said:


> Headless


Man that drop was nuts my first time. It was running just shy of 18 inches and when I got to the put-in, I realized that my skirt had falled out! I hiked back up, ran a mile down the ridge and found it. When I got back, my group was already starting to run Headless. So, I ferried across, went around Anaconda to save time, and said..."hey Ted...what's this?" He said "Headless Horseman...Just clear the hole and drive to the right"...I said... "Is it bad? Think I should scout it?" 

Right then he looked at me, lost paper, rock, scissors, and went. All I saw was him getting backendered and surfed in the hole. Once he cleared out, my Sniper flew over that hole and under the rock.

Sooooooooo fun. I'm moving back to GA in July and I can't wait to get on that run again.

Scott

Not me but good picture of it. Water Tribe


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

"You're not gonna like this one", and "liquid drano", "Eclipse", Tingle balls, Energizer, stairway to heaven. Man GA, you have me wanting to get back there. 

Great east coast line from Harjes as were heading to the Green at a high 200%--When you've ran gorilla, it's was a mad chimpanzie, right now it's an angry, silver back gorilla. LOL! That was a great day. Hammer factor was scary also.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

heh thats a whole 3 you guys named and i am so bummed you won't be joining....... by the way the crew hasn't walked out till half way both times and the second through snow who's the pussies? dungball, grind, wild turkey pretty much all original. luke was there the second time when we bombed down the electric slide sorry for using the name we boat scouted and hit it and it was great since its actually the portage routte around a massive nasty 30 cascade into pretty much seives and verticle pins. except the portage was covered up. when a drop has multiple seives in the entrance and after the crux move and all around i count that as must make moves class V+ if you haven't run it or seen the country how do you fucking know? the possiblities of hiking out are there but very unlikely from several places unless you have lots of climbing gear in the back of your boat plus ticks and a abundance of rattle snakes makes portaging very unlikely. 

sorry ill keep the runs to myself. i should've known that greenies wouldn't have any part. it makes the crux of bluegrass look like preschool..............


by the way how can you call aarons trip report full? he hiked out and missed over half the action. where it's steep to the beginning of the tight he missed and only got the paddle in. you can all kiss my ass. class V+ from multiple kayakers besides yourself. the paddle in is easy 3 and 4


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## doublet (May 21, 2004)

caspermike said:


> plus ticks and a abundance of rattle snakes makes portaging very unlikely.


quoted for hilarity.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

doublet said:


> quoted for hilarity.


you don't know the region. lime disease is carried by ticks and having many of them i don't think you want to be checking your buddies ass hole after everyrun do you? you can believe me or not about the snakes but don't say i didn't warn you this is central wyoming not colorado.

peace you are hopeless


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## Rando (Mar 24, 2004)

Mike, I've held off on this for long enough. You and your big mouth drive me crazy and if you don't shut up I am gonna call Pat and have him shut that mouth of yours permanently. You are the mouthiest, idiot I have ever heard speak which isn't a surprise since you are from Casper, which has a reputation for dipsticks. Go play in your one hole whitewater park do some meth and shut the hell up you are getting on everyones nerves.

A REAL COWBOY


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

rando where are you from man i don't know anything about you same as you know nothing about me shut your face. before i make pat shut it for you.

a real cowboy? as in brokeback mountain cowboy?

its simple you talk shit i talk shit.


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

Casper, you're great man! You sound off the hook SIK! Snow, ticks, snakes, 5+++++, my knees are wobbling as I type. Wait--snow, snakes, ticks? SNOW, snakes, ticks? Then throw lime disease into the mix, shit, you're pushing the limits man.

Now back to Aarons trip report. On another post about the dangerous and unforgiving box elder, you posted, you and Aaron got through the steepest part? Where you wrong? Dude you're scrambling and it's not looking good, so please explain.

You want to see some real 5++++, head up to Boise this weekend and put on the NF at 3500. Introduce yourself and I'll show you the way. When I hop out at jakes you can show us "pussies" how it's done.

Just curious, what other 5+ runs have you done? Like post above, i'm curious where you come up with such a stiff rating?

I just started to love this post.

Poudre kills it, also. Great river! When is it gonna have water? LOL!


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

blah blah blah......im scrambling and its not looking good you must be talking about when im trying to run back up through the box with my throw rope while aaron is in the cave? or are you talking about me scouting from the left wall tied to a rope please explain all knowing one? since you where there right? 

gary you sound like a great guy but you act like aaron is your god. the steepest section is where aaron put on its a whole one good rapid and than a portage and than you go around ablind corner and you are stuck. and than its balls to the wall so kiss my ass. he missed the entire good section between where it starts to get steep to the begging of that steepest section which is 1/4 mile long barely. he missed about 2 miles. IM NOT GETTING INTO THIS WITH ALL OF YOU. NONE OF YOU WILL SEE THE CANYON SO IT DOESN'T MATTER.


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

"you act like aaron is god" LOL, unlike you kid, I give respect when it's deserved. I've only paddled with Aaron once, son. From what I saw on christopher creek he is solid. Of course I think that run is a solid class 5 with one 5+ drop.

My old friend Paul Zirkelbach always said, and I'm giving you pearls here son. 

"No matter how good/crazy you think you are, look around, the competition is staggering" 

These are words to live by kid. You obviously have no clue about how many unreal paddlers there are in this state, country, world. Give respect, cause a lot more people then you think, deserve it. Great boaters are a dime a dozen.

Have you ever left Casper? What have you done in the sport to feel so rightous and great?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

gary take your own advice i have nothing to prove and i have many long road trips to colorado...... i do give respect more than you or aaron can even fucking realize. im not the one running into shit i don't know i am the one following through as a trip leader to make sure every member of the trip is safe. maybe thats why i was still in the cave with aaron huh. or helping pull my friend from the snake at 14,000 cfs when all i see is his head spinning in a eddy. what about helping your friend out after the crux of bluegrass after he just got his head rattled? you don't know me gary and i don't really give asshit to meet you..... its different for me and you i don't look at my crew as competition i look at them as my brothers.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> luke was there the second time when we bombed down the electric slide sorry for using the name we boat scouted and hit it and it was great since its actually the portage routte around a massive nasty 30 cascade into pretty much seives and verticle pins.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Good new is that if you keep insulting the creek boaters from the area you might have more friends to paddle with. Rando is as solid as it gets but yet you still want to talk shit.

What is it... 6 vs 1 now?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

peace i never rated it for the snakes and ticks. i rated the drops as is i guess my friend didn't run dungball last weekend backwards and almost get pushed underneath a seive huh... how can anyof you rate something you havent seen im not calling big south class 3 and 4 cause i haven't seen it later boaters.


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

"its different for me and you i don't look at my crew as competition i look at them as my brothers" Casper, you really should do some research before you spout. I paddle with the best in the world on a regular basis, so competition would be rough for me cause I'm not that good.

Not too mention paddling some of the toughest runs in the world with an ego for competition, I probably wouldn't be here to rattle your fragile little cage.

Go get a glass of warm milk from mom and relax, it's ok to want to be great at what you do, just try not to spout so loud about how good you are.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

Gary E said:


> "
> Not too mention paddling some of the toughest runs in the world with an ego for competition,


 
YEAH you are right gary its a big ego alright the hardest runs in the world. you are the best gary

boxelder new rating is class 2 with some 3 plus and a little4 in between. just for good ol egogary. i will let you get the last word in here gary otherwise i know that ego might make your head explode.....  

I never once said how good i was maybe you just think im that good and are a little jelous?? huh gary???


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

Gary E said:


> Not too mention paddling some of the toughest runs in the world with an ego for competition, I probably wouldn't be here to rattle your fragile little cage.


that right there seems to be the problem here. With all the carnage that Casper had on that creek, you would think that they would want to scout whatever they are about to run. Instead, they broke boats, had swimmers, etc.

Egos are a problem.. On Mtn buzz who cares what you want to act like... I just hope that in person, on a river, you're more calm, collected, and conservative even when you're running the super "class 5+" that is Boxelder. There's nothing worse than having you bro get killed b/c you didn't scout some "30' horizon line with sieves and pins spots everywhere."

Grats on coming into the creekboating scene though. It's always nice to have some more people around.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

theres been one swim on boxelder and one broken boat due to shitty brand..... not a rapid

everything was scouted the first time through the only thing i boat scouted on the entire run was elcetric slide on the second run because that is the portage and i knew it would be okey.. what do you know 0 swims last time and 0 broken boats just plain carnage. 

you all talk as if you have seen this canyon and have experienced the drops?


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> theres been one swim on boxelder and one broken boat due to shitty brand...... aaron on both


And how many close calls? I wish we had a multiple quote feature on here. Anywho, slow down... quite trying to impress people and attack them for being class 4 boaters. You're not the only one that runs class 5. I've been doing it since I was 14.. I'm 26 now.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

whos attacking who? i think you are clueless about whats going on in the conversation. we had one close call last weekend with a seive but luke and I were right there.

you haven't run with me so how can you say slow down. i know to slow down and wait for everybody. once again you are preaching to the wrong choir. 

i gave you shit yesterday and i am sorry for hurting your feelings man


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> whos attacking who? i think you are clueless about whats going on in the conversation. we had one close call last weekend with a seive but luke and I were right there.
> 
> you haven't run with me so how can you say slow down. i know to slow down and wait for everybody. once again you are preaching to the wrong choir.
> 
> i gave you shit yesterday and i am sorry for hurting your feelings man


You didn't hurt my feelings. I was laughing all day long when I was reading your posts. 

When I say slow down it's b/c your boat scouting, what you self-proclaim to be "class 5+". I hate to be the one to tell you this but if you're running "30 foot cascades with multiple pin spots and sieves" without scouting them then you're going too damn fast. It's either safe enough to boat scout, meaning it's not "class 5+", or your being fucking stupid.

Either way, I'm back up on the class 3 narrows this evening with a beer in my hand.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

GAtoCSU said:


> You didn't hurt my feelings. I was laughing all day long when I was reading your posts.
> 
> When I say slow down it's b/c your boat scouting, what you self-proclaim to be "class 5+". I hate to be the one to tell you this but if you're running "30 foot cascades with multiple pin spots and sieves" without scouting them then you're going too damn fast. It's either safe enough to boat scout, meaning it's not "class 5+" or your being fucking stupid.


 
YOU DON'T RUN THE CASCADE you run the sneak down the river left side which is your portage route the sneak is easy 5 down the side of the cascade. so if you can picture the drop. you can't really scout the sneak because you can't get to it from the otherside because of the cascade. it was a nessecary boat scout that i knew would run with enough water and it was good almost 0 carnage except for one of 1 of us got squirly on his angled and piton alittle and dented his boat hardcore. you were not there like a have said. you wouldn't know.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> YOU DON'T RUN THE CASCADE you run the sneak down the river left side which is your portage route the sneak is easy 5 down the side of the cascade. so if you can picture the drop. you can't really scout the sneak because you can't get to it from the otherside because of the cascade. it was a nessecary boat scout that i knew would run with enough water and it was good almost 0 carnage except for one of 1 of us got squirly on his angled and piton alittle and dented his boat hardcore. you were not there like a have said. you wouldn't know.


Step 1: Stay away from using 










Step 2: Quit being so offended. You don't see the LVM boys coming on Mtn buzz to talk about how hard their run was or how good they are. It's Mtn Buzz... We all can't be that hard...


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## milo (Apr 21, 2004)

*....gayness happens...*

....this post is gayer than two guys kissin'.....and if you could scatch and sniff...it would probably smell like hand lotion....just my two cents....seeing how i have always concidered myself an ADVANCING INTERMEDIATE with HIGH HOPES i should probably exit this thread....not good enough to comment on the yakers involved or the CANYON....just the thread....junior ranger 420 cb......


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

first off i don't compare my self to a LVM boy because they are my idols. 

second the only reason i posted a trip report in the first place was to get the word out about more runs in central wyoming incase somebody drivng through on there way to the big horns would like some since its 5 minutes away from the interstate. and once again i never once said i was good or great or anything like gary ego.

third i love kayaking obviously more than any of you can imagine whats why im looking for closer runs in my backyard. because it beats driving 5 hours to run gore or driving north it's another local run to add to the list


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## doublet (May 21, 2004)

Gary's boating accomplishments have earned him the right to talk mad shit on the buzz. 

This thread is the sweetest mtbuzz train wreck I've seen in awhile.

T


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

doublet said:


> This thread is the sweetest mtbuzz train wreck I've seen in awhile.


/thumbs up


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)

Massive thread hijack. That being said.

Mike, Aaron called me right after he got off that creek, and I missed his call. I was... where was I... Jackson, maybe Montana when it came in, and basically it turned into an "Oh my god." kind of story. The difference between you and Aaron, is, for one, he may have a fairly large ego. He knows to control it. You are trying to prove how big your balls are by running this amazing BOX ELDER!!!!1111 run. But, your version of the story and his vary significantly. And, being as how he is one of my very good friends, and I have boated with him ALOT and he has taught me ALOT and we have done first or second D's together, I will tend to trust him a little bit more than you.

I will qualify this by saying: I am not a "Class V+" boater, or a class V boater. I am maybe comfortable on some class IV, but mostly like class III. I don't run the higher grades, not for lack of skill, but for lack of experience. I am sure I could bang, portage, and swim my way through TEH GNAR of BOX ELDER!!!!1111 but I realize I am no where near capable of doing it safely. Aaron invited me to go on his Arizona trip, and I declined, because I knew I wasn't ready. Before you start to talk shit, and say how you were the man on everything BOX ELDER!!!111 you may want to make sure that you tell the same story as other people on the run. 

To check your skill level, I recommend coming up and running Ten Sleep. Or for that matter, I have the perfect creek, and I will play tour guide. Lower Tongue, it would be great fun. There is alot going on in there, and it has been something that I have wanted to do forever. Do you want to come up here and do a personal first D with me? We don't need a shuttle, since it is a hike up, but we can take my Jeep once you get to Cody. It would be cool to do. But, if you are going to boat with me, or with most of the other Wyoming folks that you seem so hell bent on calling out, I would recommend you get on your knees and pray to the gods of forgiveness, because you have really rubbed alot of us the wrong way. Another thing to do, something that has been discussed, by quite a few of us in regards to your BOX ELDER!!!111 run, is check your ego and your need to prove how big your cajones are at the door. I have had to bury paddling friends who were a hell of a lot better than you, without the ego. Shit happens, but it happens much more quickly when you are trying to prove you have balls. And don't deny it, you have talked up this AMAZING FIRST D!!!11 too much to suggest otherwise. 

Good luck with the coming season, if you get up here, I wouldn't mind doing a ditch run, or a Lower Tongue with you, it's all about the boating, and having fun. This little flame war has gotten wayyyyy too far involved, and all of us are doing the one thing I hate about message boards, and that is cunting up a good thread with trash.

Oh, and for the love of god, pick up this book. Reviewing Basic Grammar: A Guide to Writing Sentences and Paragraphs. It will make this flame war at least a little easier to read. 










Sorry for the thread hijack, now, let's get back to the stoke!


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

"This thread is the sweetest mtbuzz train wreck I've seen in awhile"


I second the thumbs up, lmao!


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

how can you put anything against me when you haven't meet me skibum. 

the person who taught me and I respect was on the Trip and wasn't mentioned once in aarons TR, why not? his story was one person of 4's view on the canyon. he missed over half of the trip...... 
i have nothing to prove in kayaking like i said i have wanted to do this canyon for 2 years now because its something other than driving 5 hours to gore.......

i run the drops i do because 1st off i know my physical ability
and 2nd because i know my crew( something you should try to paddle with) has my back.

and how can you skibum act like i can't paddle im sure aaron can say otherwise.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> 2nd because i know my crew( something you should try to paddle with) has my back.


Always taking stabs at people? About the worst thing you could do is post to continue this argument with all these people. Lol.

I think I just saw a flashback to myself when I was 18. Cocky as shit, had to talk crap on boatertalk, and came across as overly abrasive.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

GAtoCSU said:


> Always taking stabs at people? About the worst thing you could do is post to continue this argument with all these people. Lol.
> 
> I think I just saw a flashback to myself when I was 18. Cocky as shit, had to talk crap on boatertalk, and came across as overly abrasive.


skibum doesn't own a kayak


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)

I don't have to meet you, you are doing a perfect job showing what kind of person you are by being on the board. Nobody, at any time has said you can't paddle, I think the general consensus is the "Class V+++ UBER GNAR TEH BOX ELDER!!!!1" may not be such a high level run, and maybe you are overplaying it a bit. No one is saying it isn't a cool run. Aaron himself has said he wants to go back and do it again. And, I'm sure you have experienced it yourself, when one person says one thing, like that dude you kind of know in biology class, but your best friend says something completely different, you tend to side with the person you know a bit better. The whole thing has gotten out of hand, and I am simply trying to prove a little bit of a point to make you think a bit about the consequences of your actions, and of your tongue. 

Oh, and because I am a nice guy, a.k.a. the Grammar Nazi:

"How can you put anything against me when you haven't met me, skibum. 

The person who taught me and whom I respect was on the trip wasn't mentioned once in Aaron's TR. Why not? His story was one of four points of view in the canyon. He missed over half of the trip. 
I have nothing to prove in kayaking, like I said, I have wanted to do this canyon for 2 years now, because it's something other than driving 5 hours to Gore.

I run the drops I do because first off, I know my physical ability
and second, because I know my crew ( something *or maybe whom* you should try to paddle with) has my back.

And how can you, skibum, act like I can't paddle? I'm sure Aaron can say otherwise."

Thank you and goodnight. I'm washing my hands of this. It has been drawn out far too long. The great Wyoming kayaker's fight. I won't play a part in it, anymore. If you want, though, Mike, (and I am dead serious with this) come up here, I want someone to run the Lower Tongue with.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

fuck off skibum


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)

caspermike said:


> skibum doesn't own a kayak


Ok, one more little point. I have never had to own a kayak. I worked for the college for four years, and didn't need one. I used their demos. Now, I work off and on for Aaron, and use his demos. I have all the kayaks I could ever want. Why would I drop close to a grand on a boat when I don't need to? I can save that money to afford to go on all the trips I do. 

Now, I am really done. Syanara.


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

GA I was expecting you to come back with rivers/creeks for my east coast drops I through out? What the hell? I used to go back east every April to warm up for the season.

Gary


"You're not gonna like this one", and "liquid drano", "Eclipse", Tingle balls, Energizer, stairway to heaven


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

Gary E said:


> GA I was expecting you to come back with rivers/creeks for my east coast drops I through out? What the hell? I used to go back east every April to warm up for the season.
> 
> Gary
> 
> ...


I dont' recognize the first two...or Tingle Balls. I think those suckers are in the Chattanooga area. Never made it over there to paddle with Tony in his back yard. "Shoot me in the face with a 9mm" is my favorite name.

Cullisaja, Toxaway, Bear

There are so many good rivers, creeks, and runs. I can't wait until the season really starts here. I'm stoked to get on the river, boof around, and drink beers with my home boys.

I never liked Stairway to Heaven.. it might be b/c I have degenerative Cartilage loss between S1 and S2 from a weird hit on the green about 10 years ago. I run it, but it's not as much fun as the stuff on Energizer, Wintergreen, Mike Tyson's, or Mortal Kombat. God do I love Mortal Kombat.


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)

Mike, you crossed the line. Prepare for whatever comes your way at this point in time. I retract my offer to boat with you.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

i don't care to boat with you either skibum.

skibum didn't you throw it up on tetongravity for everybody to check out?

wow you are cool. especially for dissing it now.


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## Tim Kennedy (May 28, 2004)

*Anyway...what's the level on the Poudre right now?*

Extremely entertaining! 

How did a report on river levels and early season boating on the Cache la Poudre River become a dick swinging contest involving the creeking abilities of Wyoming kayakers and an internet workshop from several people on "How/how not to win friends and influence others" ? 

I'm not complaining though. I'm just a little confused.

It's all incredibly amusing. Please this "trainwreck" of a thread going...


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)

I really do not know. It was kind of like a car wreck. You can't help but look.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

trainwreck into a brick wall is a better way to put it. i am the wall and they are the cars saying " its class 4"..... vroom..... mike you are not safe..... vroom. ... im a little grammer nazi poser boater......... vroom......... blah blah blahh.... vroom.... im going to get pat to kick your ass... vroom........ vroom.....


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)




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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

1st two are real manns and tingle is linville.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> trainwreck into a brick wall is a better way to put it. i am the wall and they are the cars saying " its class 4"..... vroom..... mike you are not safe..... vroom. ... im a little grammer nazi poser boater......... vroom......... blah blah blahh.... vroom.... im going to get pat to kick your ass... vroom........ vroom.....


Lol.. Please point me to the post that said Box Elder, AKA the new "gnar benchmark," was class 4.

Please?


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

Gary E said:


> 1st two are real manns and tingle is linville.


Real Manns is calling my name..I hope it runs during Gauley fest! I went to Linville once about 4 years ago. I bet it changed names since then...I don't see it on AW as one of the 200 rapids on that run. Talk about a scary place.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

GAtoCSU said:


> Lol.. Please point me to the post that said Box Elder, AKA the new "gnar benchmark," was class 4.
> 
> Please?


 

vroom......... straight up pointless.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> vroom......... straight up pointless.


Are you now some type of a car? You said we called it class 4.. Now, like your paddling style and flagrant disrespectful attitude, put up or shut up.


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## freexbiker (Jul 18, 2005)

1.Mike Chill out
And to everybody else, I personally don't think Wyoming is at all like what Mike makes it seem like. Although I have only kayaked for a couple of years(maybe,if you could call it kayaking) it seems like all the boaters that I know don't blow themselves up too much like this.

And to end the bull shit on Wyoming it is empty, awesome, beautiful(even in Casper) and one of the best places to grow up. I have lived here all my life and ever since I was five I have learned that Wyoming is amazing to live in. Just in the last year since I got my license I have learned that we have one of the best trout rivers in the world, a world class cross country skiing area, the Bighorns 2 hours to the north and the Winds two hours to the west.
Although we don't have much boating other than an irrigation ditch. I think it is one of the best area to live in.
Again, Mike chill the F out
Luke


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## freexbiker (Jul 18, 2005)

and there are plenty of girls  
You just have to know which ones are in Mike's family.:shock:


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

freexbiker said:


> and there are plenty of girls
> You just have to know which ones are in Mike's family.:shock:


you are a punk luke, i will put up as gatocsu would like to see. just bought a new camera with 33mm by 369 lens so good shots should be coming see later ladies. 

luke stay away from my sister not like you really had a chance in the first place.


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## yourrealdad (May 25, 2004)

I am late for work now after reading this post. Who is going to buss the tables now?


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## splatdog (Mar 2, 2004)

*chiming in*

I'd just like to chime in and add that I boated with Mike at the whitewater park in Casper (I know, nothing else was running, it was March)... and he's not really the asshole in person that he is online... its like the kid transforms into super badass MF when on the interweb. Mike, do you even think about some of the shit you post? You have no reason to be talking smack and bashing folks. You keep saying 'you don't know me' in your defense, but then you online bitch-slap people you've never met. As a creeker whos from Wyo-- I'm gonna have to say, 'Shut the F*&k up'


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> you are a punk luke, i will put up as gatocsu would like to see. just bought a new camera with 33mm by 369 lens so good shots should be coming see later ladies.
> 
> luke stay away from my sister not like you really had a chance in the first place.


I don't care what drops you are running. Do you not understand this? There are so many good class 5 creekers that I have met, over the last 10 years of creek boating, that would never say the dumb shit that you're saying on here.

What I want you to do, since you are obviously aiming to please the critics, is find a post where someone called Box Elder a class 4 run.

Are you trying to prove anything other than the fact that you forgot to log in your "alter ego" account before you began this horrible attempt at flaming?


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

Linville is scary. One of my favorites though.

Tim, send me some shades dammit. 

Couples weekend in a few weeks at the locsha, you in?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

has the poudre come up anymore this week? you guys getting snow this week? 
jessie why don't you come and join me this weekend boxelder should be running nice.....

sorry just had to throw that out there for you guys.


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## skibuminwyo (Nov 8, 2005)




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## COLDFEAR (Apr 20, 2004)

Mike, 

You have dug yourself a giant grave and you have done a good job of burying yourself. I was going to stay out of your little battle but, especially after you’re private message to me, which I will not get into in this forum and now your private message to Skibum calling out the group that was in the box when Dan died. 

First off I boated with you, so this is first hand experience. You’re a good boater but you lack the skills of a good class 5 boater. When we came to the first class 3 boulder garden you were a jack in the box. If you can’t eddy scout, your in big trouble no matter what class of whitewater you are on and this was the first lesson I learned from one of Wyoming’s finest paddlers, Ed Conning. You don’t know how to move well or efficiently and this is something you need to work on. 


Yes, I moved ahead of the group when I broke my boat, so that I wouldn’t hold the group back. I figured me hiking the banks in flatwater and getting in my broken boat in class 2 that you would catch up to me (one would think right?) When any part of the run got to eddy scouting who was in front? When I hiked out I missed about a half mile of water and 2 drops per your trip report right? One of which looks completely boatable.

I’m standing at the top of a horizon line and I just roped you across the creek to scout the drop.

Me: Mike is it good to go?

Mike: Yea, it’s the 20 foot slide I scouted

Me: Are you 100% sure its good?

Mike: Yea its good

Me: Ok let’s do it

I believe you and I made the decision to move forward.

Is this me pushing the group to far? Or running something I shouldn’t? 

I went off your verbals and that was good enough for me.

Did I swim? Hell yeah I did, I’m not denying it, I was upside down, didn’t know where I was and just ran a drop that was completely the opposite of what was described. I knew I was in a bad spot and was pinned up against the wall. I have NO excuses for you. It happened and yes I was glad to have someone there to help me out. Don’t say I ran the wrong line you were in the same place I was! Box Elder is not 5+ and honestly it’s easy class 5. 

I have boated with many and if someone on this forum thinks I’m dangerous then please speak now.

You need to respect what others have done before you, and next time ask the guy who ran the drop first what he thinks the name should be. Also didn’t the landowner on Box Elder creek tell you he had seen kayakers in the canyon before you?


Don’t questions my abilities or my skills, they speak for themselves as my good friend once said 

“Google my name Bitch”


To the rest of the crew that was there, Luke and Pat I think you guys are great and I have nothing against you, and would paddle with you again, Mike just needs settle down and realize his own actions have consequences. Mike, it’s too small of a state to loose boating partners in. The Big Horns are full of class 5+ what runs have you hit their? 

But seriously Mike I believe everyone deserves a second chance but don’t call me out like you have.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

COLDFEAR said:


> Mike,
> 
> You have dug yourself a giant grave and you have done a good job of burying yourself. I was going to stay out of your little battle but, especially after you’re private message to me, which I will not get into in this forum and now your private message to Skibum calling out the group that was in the box when Dan died.
> 
> ...


 
great line on the beaver to and a swim doesn't count as running a drop it counts as a swim. and if you followed through left left you would have been good aaron. don't call me out brother i boat for the safety of my crew as in knowing there limits as well as mine.

the one drop had a shitty entrance into a poor over directly onto the rock i guess if you made it to that far you could've seen what we were seeing. we scouted this drops 2weeks ago and last weekendand portageged both times. dungball electric slide, portage and a couple more good hits. you missed it all so don't call it full report next time aaron peace. remeber you were invited along we didn't invite you to lead.

you don't even see the lines you just go thats the problem here. theres more to kayaking than just kayaking aaron and the whole reason i brought up the box was to prove a point that when you r in a box canyon you shouldn't be pushing ahead making time or anything especially when you don't know it. i knew there was an exit after that corner where you swam. i knew ...... you didn't thats the plain and simple point, people can die if you aren't paying attention


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## Tim Kennedy (May 28, 2004)

*Yeah...the threadjack is really on now.*



Gary E said:


> Linville is scary. One of my favorites though.
> 
> Tim, send me some shades dammit.
> 
> Couples weekend in a few weeks at the locsha, you in?


Gary, I thought Jackson was a Smith town? j/k 

Don't think I can make a "couples weekend" (no longer with the other half). Charlie, some other CO guys, and I might be up in the ID/MT area at the end of the month, though. Multi day self support? Get in touch w/me or Charlie.

As for rapid names, here are some that I am fond of:
Puke, Angle Left and Piton, My Nerves are Shot and I Can't Take Much More of This, and Shock to the System on Upper Blackwater
Gluteal Mash, World's Ugliest Rapid on NF of Blackwater
Frog in a Blender, Carnal Knowledge of a Deviant Nature, Liquid Bliss, Gerbil in the Plumbing, and The Great Wall of Misery and Despair on Bhote Kosi
Piece of Shit on Homestake
And of course, Coming Home Sweet Jesus, Brink of Disaster, Rites of Passage on the Meadow

TK


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## gapers (Feb 14, 2004)

You douches better stop cunting up my Poudre. Thread.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

caspermike said:


> remeber you were invited along we didn't invite you to lead.



That right there sums up why people are having a problem with you on this thread.


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## Nathan (Aug 7, 2004)

GA, have you been up the Poudre lately, is it getting any higher?

Mike, you should think about the people outside of those you are arguing with. Your in a pissing match with guys that are classy and respected in this sport, and your right "I don't know you" but I would never paddle with you just based on your attitude on this forum. Sounds like your a nice guy when your not behind a computer screen, it unfortunate you want to act this way.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

Nathan said:


> GA, have you been up the Poudre lately, is it getting any higher?
> 
> Mike, you should think about the people outside of those you are arguing with. Your in a pissing match with guys that are classy and respected in this sport, and your right "I don't know you" but I would never paddle with you just based on your attitude on this forum. Sounds like your a nice guy when your not behind a computer screen, it unfortunate you want to act this way.


In the upper narrows, the water has risen about 2-3 inches/week with a bit more rise since Sunday. I would say that the upper section has come up 2-3 inches in the last 3 days.

It's still low but it's a lot less boney than it was 2 weeks ago.

Scott

PS. I was up there 3 hours ago.


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## Rando (Mar 24, 2004)

Caspermike, SHUT UP! and maybe people will like you.

Splatdog, I heard you were back in the neighborhood. How are the wife and kids I mean boston terriers? Hope to see your green plates on the poudre this summer. 

Scott, you are having to much fun. 

Gary- i heard something about hair on fire in Idaho, drunkeness in Norway, and a very large water trip to Canada. I have one question, did you recently buy a sports car or leave your wife for a 21 year old? I think somebody needs to check Gary's meds cuz the mid life crisis is here. Sounds like a great summer, you should check with AARP I heard they have really good insurance rates.


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

Rando said:


> Caspermike, SHUT UP! and maybe people will like you.
> 
> Splatdog, I heard you were back in the neighborhood. How are the wife and kids I mean boston terriers? Hope to see your green plates on the poudre this summer.
> 
> ...


I get so bored at work. Are you coming to the wedding? Poudre should be going good next weekend.. Lets do some class 4+ gnar gnar.


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## xkayaker13 (Sep 30, 2006)

"Good Boaters are a dime a dozen"

It's so true... there are so many sick boaters around here that you've never heard of, and just paddle because they love it.

Oh yea, and my favorite rapid name from back east is "Lucifer's Anus" up on the Gatineau in Canada
*http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gatineau_River*


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## Gary E (Oct 27, 2003)

"Gary- i heard something about hair on fire in Idaho, drunkeness in Norway, and a very large water trip to Canada. I have one question, did you recently buy a sports car or leave your wife for a 21 year old? I think somebody needs to check Gary's meds cuz the mid life crisis is here. Sounds like a great summer, you should check with AARP I heard they have really good insurance rates."

That is so F$%ked up Rando. It's not me, my friends are the problem. I just go where they tell me, put on what they tell me. 

Those Idaho folk are crazy! 

You should come up and paddle, nothing like hearing the bee gees Kung Fu fighting, while driving up a river with mortar shells hitting the water. 

It's priceless! The best is the agendas they put together. There plan is NF tomorrow night, 2 little whites on fri, 2 on sat and a NF on sun morn. 

I hope I can hang for half of that. I tried to tell my boy I was scared and he yelled into the phone "we're all scared, be here at 4 dammit".


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## Rando (Mar 24, 2004)

I wanna come visit and go to Idaho! So how are your playboating skills now day? I hear they get a lot better up in the independent republic of Jackson cuz theres no creekin. As far as that hit list goes it scares the hell out of me to even think about all that volume (we break boats down here, we don't lose them into the ocean). Have fun with all that you sick old man.

Hey if you run into that little sh*t Justin aka Carpet tell him if he doesn't call me soon I am gonna hunt his scrawny ass down and beat him with his pin kit.


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## Rando (Mar 24, 2004)

Scott, Yeah we will be there. I'll see you soon as the water comes up a little more, I like schlickn but that is ridiculous.


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## splatdog (Mar 2, 2004)

Hey Rando-- Its good to be back in the Rockies. Speaking of Carpet he pulled my carping ass to shore a few times in WA this winter... I think the lack of boating in the CO winter made me forget I'm not an NC creeker anymore


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