# Crab stroke



## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Anyone have a video depicting the crab stroke? I have a rough understanding of where to position the oars but I think I would have a better understanding If I could watch a video. Curious as to how people are positioning their hands, body movement and oar depth.

Thanks!


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## Rightoarleft (Feb 5, 2021)

I've never heard of a crab stroke. Neither has Google but I did find a guy dropping other fancy terms while getting awkward on the oars... ah yes, the Dunning-Kruger effect.

I get crabby when I stroke into the evening against the wind because the TL is dead set on a particular camp. Sometimes I am that TL. Everybody learns the crab stroke eventually.


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## Electric-Mayhem (Jan 19, 2004)

In competitive rowing... "catching a crab" is when your oar catches the current and hits you in the chest and tries to toss you out of the boat. Relatively common with newbs but still happens to the pro's on occasion.

I see references to it in drift boat circles but haven't seen any explanations. A stroke that "crabs" you sideways or something maybe?


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

I've always heard it referred to as crabbing an oar, when the water catches the blade with circumstances such as EM relates..


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## theusualsuspect (Apr 11, 2014)

Most people refer to it as the crawl stroke though some call it crabbing. Usually for fishing so you can maintain a distance from the bank and not alter the angle of the boat towards the shore. One oar almost shipped and is pushing water towards the boat while the other oar is in a normal position doing s back row. That what you’re talking about?


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## LLubchenco (Nov 23, 2016)

The usual suspect is on it. sweep the blade around so that it is nearest to the bow of the boat and do small pushes with your hand to make it draw water toward the bow, the other one does small backstrokes to keep the bow pointed in the correct direction. Key is to time them just right together so that the boat moves without jerking. I use this all the time, but would caution against using it in big pushy water as it would be an easy way to get knocked out. Great way to change position without changing direction of momentum. I'll try and take a video next time I'm out and post it up. cheers!


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## LLubchenco (Nov 23, 2016)

at 5:40 they demo it.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Thanks! I did see that clip. Can’t believe there not another clip on YouTube demonstrating it.


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## theusualsuspect (Apr 11, 2014)

Sweet yeah. Great stroke and super useful. Neal streaks book has some great drawings and pics of it. Like LL said not good in pushy water but I still find a reason to use it every time I’m out.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

I actually ordered that book last night. I’m primarily fishing from my raft so I figured it would be beneficial to learn it sooner then later. Hopefully next time I’m on the river I can watch someone do it.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Couple questions 

1) Is the sweeper oar always placed on the side of the boat that’s closest to the bank your fishing?

2) Is the sweeper oar pushing water directly into the bow or should the water be pushed under the bow ?

3) should the oars be moved simultaneously or is it offset?


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## jberg421 (Jul 19, 2020)

walterwhite said:


> Couple questions
> 
> 1) Is the sweeper oar always placed on the side of the boat that’s closest to the bank your fishing?
> 
> ...


1 - I could be wrong but the oar that's pushing water under the bow controls your distance from the bank. If youre trolling down a river left bank ship the right oar to bring you off and switch to left if you need to come left. The oar pushes water laterally under the boat. At least thats my understanding. In uniform current I don't find myself switching much.

2 - Depends on oar length. I don't think its a perfect science

3 - Depends on what you need. I find that if I use both at the same time I can almost _upstream _ferry in the direction of my sweeping oar.

Really good tactic to separate the men from the boys and the women from the girls. Also as the huge flyfisherman says. It just makes you look huger. Along with squaretops.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Well at least I got square tops going for me, half way there lol .


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## jberg421 (Jul 19, 2020)

walterwhite said:


> Well at least I got square tops going for me, half way there lol .


Pro tip - teach your main fishing buddies to use this stroke (thats what she said) I do it for my buddies and they can't reciprocate so I'm just spoiling them.


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## LLubchenco (Nov 23, 2016)

the bow draw blade is the one that is moving you where you want to go, does not matter what side of the river you're on. That said, be really careful as you are traveling downstream pointing an oar into the water. Best done with some water underneath the boat, or at least a good idea of the depth of the river. Gotten an our shot out of my hand before when it contacted a rock!


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## jamesthomas (Sep 12, 2010)

Every fishing guide I hve ever been with uses it a lot. I have got it totally down on one side but sorta weak on the other. I can’t even begin to explain it verbally.. The usual suspect’s description is as good as I have read. Super useful when fly fishing or approaching a camp when you’re not really sure where it is. You maintain your distance from the bank with the boat angled into it. Not very powerful so not the thing for fast/pushy conditions.


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## tommy2stp (Jan 15, 2021)

I guided in drift boats for years, and more recently raft more often. While I’ve never heard it as “crab walking”, I think I know what you’re talking about. In Alaska we referred to it as “skulling” but I don’t think that’s an accurate term either. But, once you learn it, you’ll use it hundreds of times a day. It shocks me that more whitewater guys don’t know how to do it. It’s not nearly as valuable for whitewater, but I still use it like crazy, sometimes even for just a stroke or two.
The oar you do it with “pushes” the boat, so use the oar opposite of the direction you want to slide. Sometimes you’ll switch back and forth so you’re not back-rowing and slowing down when the water is clingy.
Don’t worry about the timing with your other oar, you’ll naturally time it so the boat stays bow-downstream. 
Its tough to explain and probably tougher to make a video of it...but I can make an attempt. I dip my oar as deep as I can, with the blade parallel to the boat and current, pull the handle toward your body center and you’ll feel it push the raft laterally in the water, to return your handle to the highest point you’ll want to twist your wrist toward your chest so the blade turns more perpendicular to the raft and slices through the water, the current will drive the oar inward as your hand moves away from body center. Immediately start to repeat and you’ll be sliding across the current. 
When using this method, think quick, short strokes. Sometimes it helps to think of it as a figure 8 with your oar blade slicing inward and broadside outward.


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## peernisse (Jun 1, 2011)

walterwhite said:


> Anyone have a video depicting the crab stroke? I have a rough understanding of where to position the oars but I think I would have a better understanding If I could watch a video. Curious as to how people are positioning their hands, body movement and oar depth.
> 
> 
> Hey homie. I think you are referring to what is called a DRAW stroke, and its opposite the PRY stroke. Either can be administered on the BOW or the STERN. Hence, BOW DRAW and STERN DRAW and BOW PRY and STERN PRY. These terms make best sense in context of a canoe or kayak. In a kayak or canoe you also can do a SKULLING DRAW...or a J STROKE which is a combination of forward stroke followed by a stern draw to regain boat angle...anyways.
> ...


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## peernisse (Jun 1, 2011)

walterwhite said:


> Couple questions
> 
> 1) Is the sweeper oar always placed on the side of the boat that’s closest to the bank your fishing?
> 
> ...


1) Whatever
2) Whatever
3) Either, and both, however you like. Switch it up!

Cheers!


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

tommy2stp said:


> I guided in drift boats for years, and more recently raft more often. While I’ve never heard it as “crab walking”, I think I know what you’re talking about. In Alaska we referred to it as “skulling” but I don’t think that’s an accurate term either. But, once you learn it, you’ll use it hundreds of times a day. It shocks me that more whitewater guys don’t know how to do it. It’s not nearly as valuable for whitewater, but I still use it like crazy, sometimes even for just a stroke or two.
> The oar you do it with “pushes” the boat, so use the oar opposite of the direction you want to slide. Sometimes you’ll switch back and forth so you’re not back-rowing and slowing down when the water is clingy.
> Don’t worry about the timing with your other oar, you’ll naturally time it so the boat stays bow-downstream.
> Its tough to explain and probably tougher to make a video of it...but I can make an attempt. I dip my oar as deep as I can, with the blade parallel to the boat and current, pull the handle toward your body center and you’ll feel it push the raft laterally in the water, to return your handle to the highest point you’ll want to twist your wrist toward your chest so the blade turns more perpendicular to the raft and slices through the water, the current will drive the oar inward as your hand moves away from body center. Immediately start to repeat and you’ll be sliding across the current.
> When using this method, think quick, short strokes. Sometimes it helps to think of it as a figure 8 with your oar blade slicing inward and broadside outward.


Really helps!


Thanks everyone!


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## MT4Runner (Apr 6, 2012)

Didn't realize that I do this stroke as well...or know I use it, but didn't realize it had a name.

I don't use it much in rafts, except when positioning very near other boats--to hand off cookies, beer, cameras, passengers, or other valuables.
Use it a LOT in dories, especially for maneuvering slowly around rocks or near shore without wanting to spin the boat.

Absolutely worth adding to your bag of tricks. The video is good...you can come up with your own variations, but do it the way shown in the video to get the feeling/mechanics down.


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## jsheglund (Feb 20, 2021)

It's a little easier to visualize if you think about a still water scenario. Sitting in the middle of the lake, you are able to "draw" the boat right up to shore, parallel. Not bow first, not stern first. 

Now picture the same thing in a river. For fishing, this stroke allows the guide to keep both anglers in a fishing position without a bunch of bow to shore, and stern to shore manipulations, and maintain a consistent distance from the bank, seam, eddy, fish or whatever, all while slightly slowing the speed of boat to allow for good fly presentation and multiple shots at targets. 

The oar drawing water towards the bow is the oar that is moving the boat where you want to go. The opposite oar is often just used to maintain the angle of the boat (counteract the spin effect of your other oars draw).


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## carvedog (May 11, 2005)

Been doing that for a while. Never knew it had a fancy crustacean name.....


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Thanks for the advice. Got out a few times and got the rhythm down. I read an article that stated the stern stern should be slightly angled (15ish degrees) towards the bank that your fishing off. Is this always the case?


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## jberg421 (Jul 19, 2020)

walterwhite said:


> Thanks for the advice. Got out a few times and got the rhythm down. I read an article that stated the stern stern should be slightly angled (15ish degrees) towards the bank that your fishing off. Is this always the case?


I don't think it matters. You can hold it parallel or adjust as needed. Theres no hard and fast ruules


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## Michael P (Mar 18, 2009)

Good explanation in the video and you could also relate this method to a Draw Stroke if you were thinking in canoe stroke terms. You can also use this stroke in the opposite way like a Pry Stroke where you pull on the oar that you have moved parallel to your frame or gunnel and push on the oppisite oar to keep your angle. I find the pry version very handy as it allows you to pry yourself away from an obstruction or shore when you do not have the oar room or time for any other method.


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## Sawatch Rescue (Apr 17, 2010)

Technically it would more closely resemble what's called a sculling draw. You might have more luck searching using that terminology.

Just a thought.


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## Michael P (Mar 18, 2009)

Sculling as a stroke is when you use an oar or paddle perpendicular to your craft, angle the blade and move it back and forth changing the angle to propel you in the intended direction. Blade does not need to leave the water. Watch the video, this is a kind of draw or the crab is an apt name. I use pins and clips, I can draw, pry or "crab" but I cannot scull.


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## Sawatch Rescue (Apr 17, 2010)

Michael P said:


> Sculling as a stroke is when you use an oar or paddle perpendicular to your craft, angle the blade and move it back and forth changing the angle to propel you in the intended direction. Blade does not need to leave the water. Watch the video, this is a kind of draw or the crab is an apt name. I use pins and clips, I can draw, pry or "crab" but I cannot scull.


Yes, I'm well aware of what sculling is. Th


Michael P said:


> Sculling as a stroke is when you use an oar or paddle perpendicular to your craft, angle the blade and move it back and forth changing the angle to propel you in the intended direction. Blade does not need to leave the water. Watch the video, this is a kind of draw or the crab is an apt name. I use pins and clips, I can draw, pry or "crab" but I cannot scull.


Yes, I'm very well aware of what sculling and a sculling draw stroke is. The OP was looking for direction on where to find videos on 'crabbing' which as you've seen, there aren't many of, however there are plenty videos of sculling a drift boat as that is the more common terminolgy and a more accurate description of the stroke and how to move a craft laterally in the water. 

And yes, you are correct that another limitation of pins and clips is that it is difficult if not impossible to do complex strokes like a sculling draw.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Sawatch Rescue said:


> Yes, I'm well aware of what sculling is. Th
> 
> 
> Yes, I'm very well aware of what sculling and a sculling draw stroke is. The OP was looking for direction on where to find videos on 'crabbing' which as you've seen, there aren't many of, however there are plenty videos of sculling a drift boat as that is the more common terminolgy and a more accurate description of the stroke and how to move a craft laterally in the water.
> ...


However it is damn near impossible to miss a conventional stroke with them, and you cannot blow an oar out the top, which is also common with the alternative substandard or system


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## Sawatch Rescue (Apr 17, 2010)

MNichols said:


> However it is damn near impossible to miss a conventional stroke with them, and you cannot blow an oar out the top, which is also common with the alternative substandard or system


Agreed, pins and clips are much easier for beginners to learn and eliminate a lot of variables such as the need for better oar control and the use of advanced rowing techniques. Pins and clips are great for folks that like to keep it simple. 

Different strokes and all that...


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Sawatch Rescue said:


> Agreed, pins and clips are much easier for beginners to learn and eliminate a lot of variables such as the need for better oar control and the use of advanced rowing techniques. Pins and clips are great for folks that like to keep it simple.
> 
> Different strokes and all that...


I don't know, I'm hardly a beginner, having logged more miles on rivers than most people have in cars over the last 40 plus years, to me pins and clips are a superior or system in any and all instances. I am a Colorado certified white water instructor, and ex swift water rescue instructor, current river ranger...

Feathering your oars for example in my dory's in the wind, is an added bonus, but it's not like it's that much easier.

I certainly wouldn't have blown an oar in lava at the V-Wave lol but to put pins and clips on a traditional boat such as the Dory would be sacrilege, so I deal with the inconveniences

With all of the downsides to open oar locks, and all of the attempts to make them workable for river running failing miserably, frog locks, oar rights, etc I think I'll just stick with what works all the time in every situation


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## Sawatch Rescue (Apr 17, 2010)

MNichols said:


> I don't know, I'm hardly a beginner, having logged more miles on rivers than most people have in cars over the last 40 plus years, to me pins and clips are a superior or system in any and all instances. I am a Colorado certified white water instructor, and ex swift water rescue instructor, current river ranger...
> 
> Feathering your oars for example in my dory's in the wind, is an added bonus, but it's not like it's that much easier.
> 
> ...



Good for you.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Sawatch Rescue said:


> Good for you.


I'm glad you're suitably impressed lol


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## Will Amette (Jan 28, 2017)

I'd really like to give pins and clips a try again now that I have tens of thousands of strokes under my oarlocks. 

I started rowing after many years of paddling. I was a back-up oarsman on a GC trip. I started rowing early in the trip due to an injury, and I got to row most of the boats by the end of the trip. Only one had open locks. That's the boat I rowed the most. The boat I bought came with open locks, and I've been totally happy with them. I didn't like pins and clips for the very same reason they are advantageous at times. They are always in POWER mode. If an odd current grabs a blade, it's easy for me to roll a wrist and de-power the oar. I also like feathering. I never learned to just push down on the oar to depower. I wonder if I'd take to it if I tried again.

Mostly it would be keen to try some out before my next GC trip as I'll be renting a boat, and I might have it set up with pins and clips if I think I'd like it better. Certainly it's fun to stick the handles in your sandals and pedal down the river; can't do that with open oars. 

Surely someone here knows the history of pins and clips. When did that technology evolve? I ask that only because I was thinking about what Mnichols wrote about using them on a beautiful wood boat. I do think oar locks are more aesthetically pleasing, but that's neither here nor there. Are pins and clips older than epoxy? Because nobody bats an eye at using epoxy in building wood boats, so why is there any concern about using a rowing system that is clearly superior in any and all instances on a wood boat? I'm not suggesting that pins and clips actually are superior. We can go around and around on that until the Earth switches magnetic polarity. Maybe longer. Just curious why not put a superior system on a boat you love.


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## Sawatch Rescue (Apr 17, 2010)

MNichols said:


> I'm glad you're suitably impressed lol


How do you know when a raft guide walks into a bar?

Don't worry, he'll let you know he's a raft guide.


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## Endopotential (May 14, 2019)

MNichols said:


> to put pins and clips on a traditional boat such as the Dory would be sacrilege


Just to echo Will's question - and please don't take this personally in any way at all -
if you believe pins and clips to be superior, would you really not put it in a dory just because of aesthetics and tradition? Why not make combine the "best" oar set up with the "best" of boats?


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Well, for one thing, I'm not sure you could get the angle of the thole pin steep enough to allow the oar to actually bite the water efficiently, and for the second, tradition. There's just certain things I wouldn't do, and that's one of them. Yes, you blow oars out the top, and yes, it's harder on your old wrists, but it's the way Kenton Grua, Wally Rist, Rudy, etc did it back in the day when they worked for Martin, and I'll be damned if I'll mess with tradition LOL. It would be like putting a bimini top on a Dory.. Can you do it ? Of course.. Should you do it ?


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