# IK on its own



## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

Paddled the upper owyhee in 2011 in older style Lynx II at 2x flood stage starting on the SF Owyhee at Pipeline crossing to 3 forks. Good amount of Big water Class III, one Class IV (cabin rapid) and one IV+ (cable rapid). Ran it all, but lined about 100 yards of Cabin and full portage at the last huge set of holes at Cable. Trip report below and photo attached (1 at owyhee 2x flood stage). Only swam once on the upper owyhee on a bone head maneuver on a latteral wave.

something other than Hood - SF Owyhee 4/16-23/2011 - CascadeClimbers.com

Ran lots of other lower water runs like NF John Day, Grande Ronde, etc. with lots of gear. Handles pretty good, when real creeky and tight manouvering, like on the Uppper Chetco, we go single IKs, Singles can actually hold plenty for like a week long backpack trip style. (photos attached 2 NF John day low water, 1 NF John day medium water)

Singles on upper Chetco this year (to much tight manouvering ment a double would have sucked):
riverlog


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

I've never used one myself but some of my paddling partners regularly use IK's for multi-day trips. Not entirely sure of all the brands, but I know at least a couple of friends have Tomcat Tandems. They usually handle fine fully loaded up to solid III-III+.

Lower Gunnison:










San Juan:


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## Rojo (May 31, 2012)

Not me or mine, but a classic picture of the "Aire Freighter".

I've been looking for a deal on an IK for years, but always find them too late.
The kids may be big enough to push our 14 SB before I actually score an IK.


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## theBoatPeople (Jun 19, 2012)

Wow, I knew big rafts were good for supporting your dozen hardshell buddies, but I never knew a SuperLynx could do it! 
I've done lots of multi-day trips in Lynx II's, and way back, in a Maravia tandem that was only 11'2" long. Both worked great. It takes a day or so to get used to pivoting the bigger size, but the hull speed is better than an equally loaded solo. The main key is to forego inflatable backrests, which take up too much space, and to load the heaviest stuff close to your back. This prevents the "flywheel effect".


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## spider (Jun 20, 2011)

A buddy of ours came on the smith trip self supported. He dropped in at our camp up above the put in and met us on the river. 4 nites easy. Get a hammock.


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## spider (Jun 20, 2011)

*This is way too cool!*



Rojo said:


> Not me or mine, but a classic picture of the "Aire Freighter".
> 
> I have loaded my 13' boat pretty heavy. Lol But not that loaded, it would be hard to pee.


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## slickhorn (Dec 15, 2005)

*IKs are the sweet spot*

for small river self support. 

We routinely do the SF Salmon, Illinois, Jarbidge and other IV+ runs in IKs carrying self support gear. I've self supported in my IK on the Selway, MF Salmon, Salt, Yampa, Rogue, SF Salmon, Lower main salmon, Illinois, Jarbidge-Bruneau, MF Flathead, Lil NF Clearwater, Big Creek, Joseph Creek, the Grand Canyon Elwah, the Chetco, the grande ronde, the owyhee, the john day, the deschutes, the Virgin Narrows, the Verde, the Gila, and many smaller local Oregon/Washington runs. 

Like in a gear raft, the biggest issue is learning how to manage the additional load. This affects route choice, because you need a little more time to maneuver. But short of trying to boof a 20' waterfall, I've never found a move I could make in an empty boat but not a gear boat. In fact, I've found more the other way, as I usually drop into some silly big holes my first day back in an empty boat, because a well packed gear IK is a hole punching machine. low, narrow, and long. 

Packing is critical. You want to keep your load low and centered. I use down rather than synthetics, and I use compression sacks to keep things dense and small. I rely on Watershed bags (everything else is splash bag, not a drybag...) and have never been let down, even after leaving a boat wrapped for an hour. 

You don't need a chair or table, the IK is a great couch/chair/cot. 

Alcohol stoves are great for 1 person kitchens. 

The Eco-safe boom box or the old school climbers pvc poop tube are great groovers (use wag bags). 

For a firepan, I like 2" or 4" deep full size stainless steam table pans. cheap, light, bomber. 

Get a good light tarp. Campmor sells nice silnylon ones that are uber light. 10x12 goes a long way to protect a small kitchen. 

Pick tents, if use them, that pack tiny. I like the REI Qtr Dome UL, frequently seen for cheap on their outlet site. 

what else? the k-60 is a great pump for hike in/fly in runs. top off pump that can inflate a boat, but will fit in a watershed ocoee. 

I recommend a gravity water filter shared by the group. 

Always carry a spare paddle for every 2 people. a robust repair kit. And a pin kit, because you might unpin an empty IK but a fully loaded gear boat often requires a z-drag. 

Do a shakedown on a local run. Our first trip, some folks were sceptical. So we picked a day run with an intermediary bridge. We camped just below the bridge and that way there was a way out if a sleeping bag got wet or someone couldn't handle the gear boat or whatever. 

Around here in the winter, IK self support trips require each boat to haul a bag of firewood. that can be a packing challenge ... 

Do it and don't look back. You'll never find a better tool for having a wide range of rivers and flows. It lets you pick the weather, the crowd factor, or whatever and dial it in without compromising the ability to run real rapids. 

One of my favorite trips to do is the SF Salmon around 2.2' -- NO ONE is there because it is "too low" for the gnar V boaters. Fine with me, every beach is unclaimed. Took a week once in late july, saw zero people for a week on the SFS. Pretty magical. 

Share some trip reports when you go!


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

I would like to see some pictures or footage of you running a fully loaded ducky in IV+ Slickhorn. I know rapid ratings are subjective, but IV+ is full on, and I call bullshit.


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## slickhorn (Dec 15, 2005)

riverlog

Lots of evidence all over my blog, though I'm quite a few TR's behind. 

Most folks, regardless of their personal boat of choice see IKs as "duckies" or "tuber" style boats, fit only for commercial custies or a timid girlfriend. 

Well, the inflatable kayak is a legit boat. I've take mine down the Little White Salmon. Yeah, I swam Spirit. But I stuck Wishbone, S-Turn, and the rest of the drops. Not in a gear boat though I've often thought Farmlands to the Columbia would be a dope 2 night trip on the White Salmon, and yes, I believe I could paddle the Truss in a gear boat.

The Green Wall on the Illinois has never looked "only IV" to me, and I've paddled it self support in my IK several times. Fall Creek, Surprise, Devil Creek on the SF Salmon are pretty legit rapids that are every bit of IV+ at 2'. 1500+ CFS in Five Mile on the Bruneau? How do you rate that?

Maybe before you call someone out, you should revisit your preconceptions. But I'll take your request for proof as a chance to share some eye candy:

Here's Nick nailing a thin line through Devil's Creek on the SF Salmon:









Here's a self-support IK eddied out in Nightmare, the unscoutable unportageble class V sieve-laced crux of the Grand Canyon Elwha









Here's a little class V gear boat swimming from the Elwha:









Here's me on the Chetco at the top of the IV+ gorge (a classic shot by Shap -- thanks man!):










Here's me dropping S-Turn on the Lil White. 









Here's Mark Yauney dropping BUD on McCoy creek. Not a gear boat, but not a class II one move ledge either. 










Last but by no means least, here's Dr David dropping 45-foot Lower Lewis Falls. Also not in a gear boat.


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## slickhorn (Dec 15, 2005)

Also, Shapattack dropped the big rapids on the upper Owyhee at something like 17,000 cfs cat-surfing levels. 

Just because you don't think an IK can run hard water does not mean no one is doing it. because they are, and frankly, many are doing it well.


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

Sweet pictures Slickhorn, definitely pushing the limits of what I have seen done with inflatable kayaks. However, most of those pictures appeared to not be loaded down for a multi-day trip. Every one of those moves looked difficult enough with the chosen craft, let alone with the loads most people take on multi-day's.... again, cool pics. Thanks for sharing.

I have ran solid IV with IK'ers plenty of times..... like Numbers/Gorge at respectable flows as well as seeing Cayo2 drop some falls on Fossil Creek in an inflatable, but the OP asked about double ducks for multi-days......


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## slickhorn (Dec 15, 2005)

All of those photos are in gear boats save the last 3 shots of waterfalls. All of them. 

To keep this post on-topic, I will say tandem IKs are great for class II-III and are gear hauling machines, but don't get into technical consequential whitewater in them unless you an run it in the tandem without gear. My dad loves his tandem tomcat and takes it on the GC San Rafael, Gila Wilderness Run and stuff like that up to III-. Myself, I don't need the gear capacity and like a more nimble boat, but tandems work just fine.

Here's Bill in the entrance to Devil's Creek. All the boats are packed like this in the shots above, again, except the 3 waterfall frames. 










Here's a shot from Deep Creek, a trib of the Virgin above Zion.


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

Right on. I didn't mean anything personal, you definitely boat harder stuff than 9 out of 10 IK'ers I know. All awesome photos, so if it took me calling you out to get them posted.... I don't feel bad about it


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## slickhorn (Dec 15, 2005)

Glad you dig 'em. 

I don't mind being called out personally, but I do get sick of IK's being called out. 

They are the ideal tool for multiday boating. A kayak can handle the rapids, but the gear is tough. A raft can handle the gear but needs more flow/less gradient. 

The IK is the perfect tool to extend the season because it widens the flow window. Sure, take a raft if you are going to the grand canyon, or a creek boat for the Clark's Fork. For more ordinary stuff, the IK opens new doors to where you can camp, what you can run, how much water you need to do it, etc. 

There's a huge difference between an Illinois trip in February where it is 30 degrees, snowing, and dark at 4pm as opposed to may trip where it's sunny and 70 degrees and light til 8. What makes a may trip possible? Being able to take something smaller that opens the door at lower flows.


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## Phil U. (Feb 7, 2009)

Nice pics. I'm a fan of anything that gives us access. And I've got friends that have been running hard class 5 in Thrillseekers (high performance ducks) back east for years. But the important question for me is how was Deep Creek accessed?


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## BarryDingle (Mar 13, 2008)

Phil U. said:


> I'm a fan of anything that gives us access.


True dat.


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## Gremlin (Jun 24, 2010)

Phil U. said:


> Nice pics. I'm a fan of anything that gives us access. And I've got friends that have been running hard class 5 in Thrillseekers (high performance ducks) back east for years. But the important question for me is how was Deep Creek accessed?


I'm interested in the Thrillseekers and don't want to jack this thread so I started a new one. http://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/f15/thrillseeker-iks-46143.html.

Please share any insights. Thanks!


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

To the OP, you've probably discerned by now that an IK is fine to run loaded, the size and difficulty of water is dependent on you. Heck, 2 years ago on a late august mf salmon trip we saw a group of canoes and IK's, and the IK's had ridiculous loads. I think they were tandems, and had coolers that looked much too large. Get an IK and go have fun!


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

lmyers said:


> I would like to see some pictures or footage of you running a fully loaded ducky in IV+ Slickhorn. I know rapid ratings are subjective, but IV+ is full on, and I call bullshit.


This statement proves your true ignorance, lack of imagination, and probably your impotence 

Slickhorn is indeed a badass IK master. Check out his blog, riverlog and eat your shorts


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

slickhorn said:


> Also, Shapattack dropped the big rapids on the upper Owyhee at something like 17,000 cfs cat-surfing levels.
> 
> Just because you don't think an IK can run hard water does not mean no one is doing it. because they are, and frankly, many are doing it well.


To be clear, I portaged Cable (for fear of my life) 
cable on our trip (the blue cat is 15' long, water much bigger than it may appear): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOpB-33lNNY
and a different angle
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfGEbL9uVXM&list=UUT3SXMZRCX6x7qvLeIgVA0Q&index=14


and lined a little on the start of Cabin, to avoid a potential nasty 1/2 mile swim if I got taken out by any of the first several large laterals. 
and Cabin a long rapid with multiple crux moves
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZM3-TH9AWqI&list=UUT3SXMZRCX6x7qvLeIgVA0Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ay9OXUsPQgE&list=UUT3SXMZRCX6x7qvLeIgVA0Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaNaUeoeqzs&list=UUT3SXMZRCX6x7qvLeIgVA0Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31oT5Ur1lFo&list=UUT3SXMZRCX6x7qvLeIgVA0Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHbmwLb91R0&list=UUT3SXMZRCX6x7qvLeIgVA0Q

Ran everthing else though. Nothing IV, just some real bigwater III


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

lmyers said:


> Right on. I didn't mean anything personal, you definitely boat harder stuff than 9 out of 10 IK'ers I know.


you need to get out more


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## Nborelli (Nov 5, 2007)

shappattack said:


> This statement proves your true ignorance, lack of imagination, and probably your impotence
> 
> Slickhorn is indeed a badass IK master. Check out his blog, riverlog and eat your shorts


I've been enjoying watching this thread develop. Hate to say it, buy IKs are the way to do class IV or better technical overnighters with creature comforts. Hard shells yes, I get it on where your advantages are, but don't knock it just because you don't understand it. It has taken years of experimentation and gear selection to be able to go out for a remote class 4 trip and be both comfortable and well fed (tenderloins, anyone?)Thanks Brian for the props in Devils on the South Fork. On the topic of running things better with a loaded boat, I'll add this. We ran the Yampa at 12000 Cfs a few years back. When we got into Split Mountain I took on a hole that would have flipped me silly (and probably a 14 foot raft) but weight and good gear load I punched that sucker.


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## jmacn (Nov 20, 2010)

*Can't spell sIcK without IK*

Enough said about the benefits/limitations of self support IK or tandem IK trips. Tandem for scenic trips when you want to bring a bunch of stuff. Lets not get all huffy. Sweet photos of sweet runs in the NW. SW boaters get dizzy when they see how much water you boys have...


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## Datju (Nov 5, 2007)

FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT! 

LMyers gets out plenty, almost to the annoying level, and IMO demonstrated humility and respect in his follow up post once we got to see all the IK imagery. 
The rest of you PacNW sandbaggers who had to rally around your bro's need to chill. IK's are cool. Nuff said. What you guys are doing with them, even cooler (than my wife in hers at least) Good on ya.

All this name calling and finger pointing is stupid. Chill. Maybe he IS an ass hole, maybe he's not. Only one way to find out. Shappattack and LMyers should have to go on a self supported desert trip together, in a tandem IK. That'll smooth everything over.


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

Datju said:


> All this name calling and finger pointing is stupid. Chill. Maybe he IS an ass hole, maybe he's not. Only one way to find out. Shappattack and LMyers should have to go on a self supported desert trip together, in a tandem IK. That'll smooth everything over.


Sorry, deleted my last post Datju..... decided it was inappropriate to continue bickering. I am cool with anything that gets you on the water. Hope the OP got some good information out of this thread..... I like your way of thinking!


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## Nborelli (Nov 5, 2007)

Yes - good idea. Maybe they could follow in the footsteps of the crazy dude who "floated" the MF Salmon Jan Ice breaking trip that was just posted...the theme would work. LOL 

SYOTR


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## slickhorn (Dec 15, 2005)

look, I can piss farther than you, for longer, in a smaller boat, carrying more gear, in harder water, farther from the road. neener neener neener! 

seriously though, didn't mean for this to become a pissing match. keep it friendly please folks!


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## okieboater (Oct 19, 2004)

Fricken Awesome stuff.

Man I appreciate this thread.

Last sept on the grand canyon horn creek, I suffered a horrific accident. riding in the bow of a gear boat, hit the green rock full speed and bow folded on me to the gear box. Broken left tibia, broken right femur (titanium rod inserted), pelvic fractured 3 places, 13 fractured ribs, and the big one crushed 2 vertebrae ended up with L6-L10 in a titanium cage. Due to awesome work by Dr John Hill in Flagstaff medical center and their nurses, awesome work by Physical Therapists in Mt View Prescott and a bunch of awesome physical therapists here in Tulsa. I am back walking with a cane and should be able to paddle by summer time. Only issue is spine Doc thinks doing a hardshell kayak roll will result in tearing loose the vertebrae cage and big time damage. My boat of choice all my boating career has been hard shell kayaks. Bottom line in order to kayak, I am gonna have to be in a IK. Been thinking about Aire Lynx I or II but this thread has me thinking a Thrilseeker may be the boat to get me back to what I love to do, kayak creeks.

Been happy to recover, but pretty sad to give up hard shell kayaks.

This thread and the pictures has me back smiling big time.

Much appreciate the photos on hair runs.

Much appreciate the info I am sure to get off the new Thrillseeker thread.

The Buzz has to be the best communication tool for us boaters.

As has been posted, don't care if it is in a truck inner tube or a 10,000 dollar raft outfit - it just does not matter if a person gets on the rivers with it.

Thanks guys, made my day and much more!


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## slickhorn (Dec 15, 2005)

hell yeah okieboater! I hope I have 1/10th your verve and positivity when my turn comes to face that kind of adversity. 

congrats on all the hard work paying off and may your boating future be bountiful!


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

wow Okie, that is some crazy painful life you are living. Good for you to keep getting on and stay positive. None of us know how long we will be able to do this or anything in life, and just keep doing your best to do it.


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## Learch (Jul 12, 2010)

*IK's*

I started paddling a Riken Comanche IK back in around 1993 ( I was 14) and was running mild class IV by 1995. I am 6'6", 280 lbs, so I didn't fit in the hard boats my dad and his buddies were paddling. I had to paddle an IK, or stay home. We did a lot of coastal rivers in Oregon, and once a year a May trip (Week long self contained) with gear rafts and kayaks on rivers like the Owyhee, John Day, Rogue, and Grand Canyon once. That boat went on all of those trips, not always with me paddling. I moved to a Force XL when they were new, I bought it on 9-11-2001. I paddled it on a lot of those same rivers, and some new ones. I married a girl who had never camped before she met me, and she has been paddling with me since we met 16 years ago. My wife got a great deal on a barely used Sotar IK, and after 8 years it was still looking great when we sold it to another local Portland area paddler. If I was to buy a new IK for me tomorrow, I'd buy an 11 foot Sotar and another 10 foot Sotar for my wife. I love the way those boats handle, wife few complaints. The one I have, is it a difficult boat for a petite paddler like her to flip upright after a swim when she couldn't touch the riverbottom. That said, her only swim was in a Popular hole on the Deschuttes river above Boxcar. Oh, and I love Brian's blog.


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## billfish (Nov 22, 2009)

*bump to top*

This has been a great thread.

Meyers, thanks for the call out, that's when it really got interesting.

Slickhorn, I've been enjoying your blog for a couple of years, only to find out that your holding back on the goods. Your pre call out post was also very interesting. What else you got?

Shap, I may not always agree, but you are the name I look for first on the buzz. Thanks for keeping it real.

In my mind, the next great small boat debate will be "packraft or IK?" Do I really need both? I know I want both.

Cheers boys, keep up the good work. We're all after the same carrot.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

billfish said:


> This has been a great thread.
> 
> Meyers, thanks for the call out, that's when it really got interesting.
> 
> ...


Word, debate and disagreement is a sign of a healthy society, if that is gone, then we know we have truely been taken over by China. 99.9% of what I post is all in good fun and not meant to be serious, just banter. If you like it, I post more goat and sheep love oriented stuff for even lower life forms to enjoy (climbers, of which I consider myself more related to than boaters). I would boat with any of you, except the one who really can't take a joke. Keeping up with my favorite owyhee theme:
[TR] SE Oregon Boner Storm - scoping 4/8/2012 - CascadeClimbers.com

PS, no debate, IK and packraft are enough different I think both are required to have in the navy! Problem is, I have been cut off from buying any more boats. But then again, if I could sell it to the boss as a real expensive pool floaty (keeping its true nature a secret) I might be golden.


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## John the welder (May 2, 2009)

Maybe packraft, IK or mini? You can have a lot of fun in a small boat and go where big boats don't go. Keep it simple.


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## slickhorn (Dec 15, 2005)

well thanks for the kind words. the blog has fallen off a bit as I have become the editor of WRRR's newsletter, the Waterlog. (Check out an issue at http://wwik.org/Waterlog_v12_n05_web.pdf and maybe join a great PNW club!) or, yano, not  

Most of the stuff waiting to be posted is better media from returns to trips that are already on the blog. SF Salmon, lllinois, some owyhee stuff, bruneau, etc. Only a couple are new, got a Yampa and a Gila Wilderness I need to get up there. Also considering branching it out a bit and including some other back country trips I've done via ski or backpack.

I'm also a wordy bastard, I dig the writing part of it but it's time consuming and it doesn't seem most folks read it ... maybe I should just post image galleries and keep it simple. but then, I do it mostly for myself...

the current goal is to expand the blog into a site and get some pages up on how to approach multiday boating. this thread is timely and I'm making good progress on that project ... so look for a revamp and some new content here in the coming months. I"m also collecting all my video work and getting on the site too. my personal fav is the Elwha (can't seem to embed, but it's at pdx MSTR on Vimeo )

And yes, we clearly all need packrafts. desperately. for the bike-paddle-bike no-shuttle Dirty Devil run, and to make the one day ELF blitz of runs like the Elwha .... any kind of hike approach multiday or multisport traverse benefits from them. Such a cool tool. best innovation in inflatable boats in many many years. Really cool trip was just done down the SF Salmon, then hiking out and over the big creek then down that to Cache. cool trip, not feasible in normal boats.

what? TL;DR? story of my life ...


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## crispy (May 20, 2004)

*overnighters and extreme throwbagging*

Iks are great for multiday. load my wife up in the lynx I while I take the playboat on overnighters once in a while and it is great. she is a great wife, i am really luckly. amazing how light you can go if you cut out all the crap. my wife wont go without a tent and all is still good.

nice stuff slickhorn, definately more than the wife and i do on ultralight overnighters but nice to see. have Yauney pm me if he is on here, we did a MF trip together a few years back. 

It is a nice drop on McCoy creek to be sure, but the dude with the throwbag is far-out. that is definately a class five toehold to throw a rope from! if it is an easy swim, why bother, anything more and why join the victim with a loose rope in the water?


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

slickhorn said:


> well thanks for the kind words. the blog has fallen off a bit as I have become the editor of WRRR's newsletter, the Waterlog. (Check out an issue at http://wwik.org/Waterlog_v12_n05_web.pdf and maybe join a great PNW club!) or, yano, not
> 
> Most of the stuff waiting to be posted is better media from returns to trips that are already on the blog. SF Salmon, lllinois, some owyhee stuff, bruneau, etc. Only a couple are new, got a Yampa and a Gila Wilderness I need to get up there. Also considering branching it out a bit and including some other back country trips I've done via ski or backpack.
> 
> ...


and most importantly finish the last day for the Chetco!


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## treehugger (Jul 29, 2009)

I got a IK and a 8 foot fishing pontoon boat. I have been thinking about building a frame to make a Rat Gear hauler/float fishing boat. I was thinking about using part of the Pontoon frame and making new cross bars, but they would have to be bent to keep the pontoons level with the IK. Any other Ideas? Maybe PVC or Wood? The ducky is 11' with 12" tubes. The pontoon has 12" tubes as well. Weight capacity on the pontoon is 400 lbs, and 750LBS on the ducky. This could be a pretty fun Fishing boat for another low water year on the Ark.


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