# Another Dry Ice Question



## Skyman (Jun 26, 2006)

So I've always used frozen bottles of water for ice on my multi day outings. The only thing that is a minus is the space they take up. I'm doing a Deso trip next Tuesday and we have minimal cooler space on this trip. I have a 120 quart Yeti cooler. With the absence of the ice bottles, I could fit some more food. I was thinking of trying dry ice for the first time. I did a search, but didn't find anything conclusive so I thought I would bring it up again. I really like the idea of having a dry cooler, thus the frozen water bottles.

So, what do ya'll do?

Skyman


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## Dave Frank (Oct 14, 2003)

I too have been thinking about using some dry ice more often. I've had reasonable success putting it with ice cream, inside a soft cooler, inside the big cooler, but not sure how long it would have actually lasted.

If you put it a lot of it on top, everything will freeze solid.

Seems you should be able to put a medium amount in the bottom and cover it with food, just keep the stuff that can't freeze higher up.


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## Snowhere (Feb 21, 2008)

Or use a hybrid system with one frozen milk jug and some dry ice. I have kept dry ice to one side of a cooler with stuff that can freeze and then the milk jug(s). I can usually keep stuff beyond the jug ice not frozen but the proportions of dry ice to normal ice have to be dialed in for the cooler. I feel safer having the mix as the regular ice will not even begin to melt until the dry ice is gone, but will last longer then the dry ice. It would suck to get half way through your trip and have no ice at all in your cooler and start to lose stuff or poison your mates.


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## lmaciag (Oct 10, 2003)

I've been freezing the larger water jugs (2.5G?) and it is working well. My thinking is the larger the block, less surface area, slower melt. Every morning I fill up my personal water container for the day from the big jug. 

Our outfitter on the Grand put a layer of 1/2 closed cell foam inside the top of our coolers when they packed them. I had ice on day 21 in an Igloo Marine cooler in November (80 degree days) buy using block ice from them. Going to keep using that as it seemed to help.

I'm planning a two week August trip and thinking about dry ice. I remember hearing that you don't want it to touch the cooler as it will crack it. Any experience there?


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## dgosn (Sep 8, 2006)

As a lover of T-bones and frosty brews on day 8 of a trip I have played around a good amount with dry ice. The first hurdle to overcome is putting it in a bottle with a little water to 'liven everyone up'.

Dry ice seems to work great in conjunction with ice blocks or frozen jugs. Dry ice itself will only last a short time in a cooler, but it will make a cooler much much colder, so the contents will stay frozen longer. Dry ice also seems to be more effective if the cooler it is in is not opened often or at all when there is dry ice left (1-3 days depending on cooler, heat...). The dry ice seems to disappear quickly if cooler is opened even once or twice.

I just did a 12 day trip in ID(not super hot temps), and was little concerned about keeping stuff cold, I put 3 cases of beer in the bottom with all the vaccumn sealed meats, added about 8 blocks of ice, and filled the voids with random items, and then packed 5 lbs of dry ice on top. I didnt open the cooler (Icee Kool 165) for 5 days, when I did the dry ice was long gone, but everything was frozen solid, even juice that wasnt to begin with. There was also an exploded Feta cheese container, and 2 burst Sparks. (i was reminded of this as I cleaned out a warm damp cheesey nasty cooler today). The dry ice did so well that there was 'surface hoar' on everything when I opened the cooler the first time.

I recently found that when you buy ice (block or cube) from the big white freezers that the ice is only about 10-20 degrees. Thats not really that cold, it is frozen but could be colder. My deep freeze at home will hit about -20F once stabilized. I usually freeze my own bottle, and now freeze blocks that I have bought. Think about it: 6 * 8lb blocks = 48lbs of ice, from the store that gives you a 48lb mass @ 10 degrees, or if you make your own or freeze blocks you can have a 48lb mass that is 20-30 degrees colder..... I am sure a smart person could figure out the BTU's etc... but my experince says that this makes a HUGE difference alone. Add 5lbs of dry ice to that 48lb mass, and you can have frozen/cold stuff for over 2 weeks!

I also put the dry ice on top, as cold sinks, and I dont want to build pressure in my cooler, my cooler is now airtight, and I have always wondered if I was riding an ejection seat with dry ice underneath me.

Laurie's suggestion about foam in the cooler on top of everything is spot on, but I usually have the cooler so full that I can barely get the lid shut. I have cracked a cheap coleman cooler with dry ice, but a high end cooler should be fine, but better safe than sorry

Scott


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

I've tried dry ice, but not a lot. It's pretty expensive, needs to be "protected" wrapped in paper so it doesn't crack stuff like the cooler or your hands, and went away pretty quick (poor cooler management). Laurie is absolutely right, a larger block of ice will thaw slower. The other thing to keep in mind is that block ice from the store seems to just be compressed cubes, still not that efficient. We bought a bunch of 2 qt bottles a while back, very rectangular so space efficient. They have been great. Getting ready for a trip tonight I just found one blown out. Poor head space management it seems. I'll be looking for some just a bit larger now.


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## Dave Frank (Oct 14, 2003)

The "crystal Geyser" gallons seem to freeze well and are nicely rectangular. It is really just plain silly to carry ice that will melt into a mess in your cooler instead of turning into drinking water.

Also liking the mylar foil bags. like from box wine or large to go coffee boxes.

If you have the space on a hot trip it is sweet to have a back up ice cooler that has some dry ice to help keep it frozen. Bust it out on day 3-4 and have crisp fresh drink ice.


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## Snowhere (Feb 21, 2008)

lhowemt said:


> The other thing to keep in mind is that block ice from the store seems to just be compressed cubes, still not that efficient. We bought a bunch of 2 qt bottles a while back, very rectangular so space efficient. They have been great. Getting ready for a trip tonight I just found one blown out. Poor head space management it seems. I'll be looking for some just a bit larger now.


I will leave the head space management jokes to your imagination!

In all seriousness just fill your milk jugs, juice jugs or whatever 3/4 full when you put them into your chest freezer. Then, after they freeze, you can judge how much more you need to add to top them off. I leave the tops off and if they overflow the top, they do not burst the container. I cap them when I pull them to use and I never buy the aerated crap ice they sell at stores.


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## Osprey (May 26, 2006)

Sounds like Scott and I have had similar experiences. I always use dry ice for for a couple purposes in conjunction with regular ice. First off, I get some a day or so ahead of the trip to super cool my cooler before filling it. Cooling off the cooler takes a lot of energy and you will lose a lot of ice right off the bat by not pre-chilling the cooler. Then I go ahead and leave the remaining blocks at the bottom under my ice blocks to give them at least a couple extra days on the front end before they even can start to think about melting. dry ice is -109 so getting your ice and cooler insulation super chilled starts you a leg up. dry ice sublimates at about 5-10 lbs per day in any kind of cooler so it will go away faster regardless of what you do. But that also makes it pretty easy to figure out how much you need. If you only want a 2-3 day cushion to get you past your travel days and on the river just get 10 lbs or so and you are off to a good head start.

I also use the rectangular 2.5 gallon drinking water jugs to freeze at home. they'll fit perfect in your Yeti (I have the same one). crank your freezer down to it's lowest setting and freeze them yourself. the store bought ones have aerated water and aren't frozen very solid, you get much better results making your own blocks and cubes. With 10 lbs of dry ice, one block, and some cubes to take up the space and your Yeti you can go a long time especially if some of your food is frozen too. Just make sure you take the meat out to thaw.

some coolers like yeti and the like are dry ice safe so you don't have to worry about cracking or damaging your cooler when using it. although wrapping it in newspaper is a great insulator that will help slow down the sublimation. here's a ton of info on the stuff:
dry ice Info .com Dry Ice Information for dry ice suppliers of Carbon Dioxide Gas and dry ice manufacturers in the USA, Canada and world countries


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

Snowhere said:


> I will leave the head space management jokes to your imagination!


Chicken!


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## Chip (Apr 7, 2007)

Some alternatives: 

For long group trips, putting frozen meat, etc. in a designated cooler with dry ice can keep it frozen longer (but you can't put in vegetables or stuff that can't be frozen). Open quickly, once a day. 

For one-cooler trips, you can get a smaller soft cooler and put your frozen food in it with dry ice, then pack produce, etc. in the main part of the cooler with regular ice, frozen jugs, etc. A scrap of reflectix or ensolite between the dry ice part and the produce is a good idea. But be careful what you pack touching the soft cooler (frozen water jugs are best). Most likely, you'll be opening the cooler often enough to keep the dry ice from freezing the vegs. 

If you've got a long drive in with rigging time in the sun, a bit of dry ice in the bottom of the cooler among the iceblocks or frozen jugs can help maintain low temps. Too much and your lettuce is history. 

Probably makes sense to spend money on a good cooler rather than loading it up with dry ice every time.


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## wreckoftheairefitzgerald (Jul 11, 2008)

For some of our longer trips we have bought cases of bottled water and asked the grocery store people to put it in their freezer. Pick it up the next day, gives you cooler ice that becomes drinking water later. Squish the empties down like an acordian and re-cap them to take up less trash space. Had no luck with dry ice, did not last 2 days for us on a hot San Juan trip.


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## Chip (Apr 7, 2007)

What I meant by using dry ice for a frozen food cooler on long trips is that you load blocks or frozen jugs, the frozen food, then pack however much dry ice you can afford. Then tape the cooler lid, keep a wet towel or reflective cover on it, and don't open it until at least a few days into the trip. The dry ice will be gone by then, but it amps the chill so the water ice blocks should be still intact.


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