# Smith River Logistics



## GOTY2011 (Mar 18, 2018)

These folks in White Sulphur Springs are the "go to" for shuttles. Opt for the long-way around, as the short cut road is rough and sometimes impassable. 

Charlie's Think Wild Shuttle Service in White Sulphur Springs. Call 406.547.6338

You'll be assigned campsites at check-in by the MT FWP folks, based on your group size and schedule.


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## mattviles (Jun 13, 2018)

You are allowed to choose your camps, and there are very few sub-par camps on that river. Have only floated it twice, but can highly recommend Sunset Cliff, Fraunhofer and Rattlesnake. There is a sign-in at the ranger cabin at Camp Baker– you can sign in the day before your launch, and the sign in order determines the order in which groups choose camps. I think the earliest you can sign in is 7 AM, but don't remember for sure. Get there EARLY to sign in if you want the best choice of camps, but as I said, almost all are good. Person who signs in (at least this was true last year) does not have to be permit holder.


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## GOTY2011 (Mar 18, 2018)

Matt is also correct, permit holders are able to select camp sites but expect that some bargaining will take place given your trip schedule and group size. Given this year's snow pack to date, three days in June will have you moving right along to get to each nights camp - 20 +/- miles a day. I did it in May during a good water year, and had a lay over day with four nights total on the water. First camp was Canyon Depth, second Table Rock, and Lower Givens the third. All great camps.

Lower Givens Gulch is the second to last site and a good one if you're needing to push out your last day. Had four days of absolutely beautiful weather for late May, and woke up to 8" of snow the morning of the last day. 

I put in for early October this year.


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## okieboater (Oct 19, 2004)

I have been on the Smith three times.

Used Shuttle Info - Smith River Shuttle | Great Falls, Montana
each time and very pleased with their service.

Their lot and business is a very short walk from the take out. We were surprised to find our trucks washed and looking good for the drive home.

They come by the put in camp site to answer questions and meet drivers the day before groups put in.

They are locals living there for many years and this is their income and based on my history of doing business with them are the way to go.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

The snowpack is looking good right now, hopefully it keeps up. Has anyone fished Late June on the Smith? I picked up a cancellation last year in early April, however the river was closed due to ice jams. It's crazy how fast the weather can change.


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## JakeH (Nov 1, 2003)

*Is there enough water in Oct?*



GOTY2011 said:


> Matt is also correct, permit holders are able to select camp sites but expect that some bargaining will take place given your trip schedule and group size. Given this year's snow pack to date, three days in June will have you moving right along to get to each nights camp - 20 +/- miles a day. I did it in May during a good water year, and had a lay over day with four nights total on the water. First camp was Canyon Depth, second Table Rock, and Lower Givens the third. All great camps.
> 
> Lower Givens Gulch is the second to last site and a good one if you're needing to push out your last day. Had four days of absolutely beautiful weather for late May, and woke up to 8" of snow the morning of the last day.
> 
> I put in for early October this year.



Is there enough water in Oct?


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

You can float it in Sept or Oct. I believe its floatable because they aren't pulling as much for irrigation purposes.


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## JakeH (Nov 1, 2003)

Thanks


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## StarDog89 (Feb 20, 2016)

Smith River Shuttles is hands down the best service. Like someone said above, they wash and detail your rig, but better yet, they are super friendly and reliable.


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## [email protected] (Jun 1, 2010)

Smith River shuttle is my choice. They checked our tires, fluids and lights before pulling out for shuttle.
Never had any problems. Always got a clean truck at take out. Its nice to jump in and drive off with a clean windshield.


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## seantana (Mar 5, 2015)

Another vote for Smith River Shuttles. We used to use Charlie's until one of their drivers spilled a full coffee in my buddy's truck, and left it. Refused to cover cleaning or any kind of refund. Won't use them ever again.


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## mtgreenheads (Jul 15, 2011)

I have made many Smith River trips. I would never use anyone other than Smith River Shuttles. Awesome folks.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Thanks for the info. Really hope we’re able to pull a permit this year. If not, looks like will be floating the South Fork of Snake River during the Salmon fly hatch.


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## mr. compassionate (Jan 13, 2006)

Make sure to stop by Heaven on Earth and see Vince. Hot shower and Deep Cricks-his specialty drink!  Maybe play his 9 hole golf course. Don't miss it!


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## [email protected] (Jun 1, 2010)

mr. compassionate said:


> Make sure to stop by Heaven on Earth and see Vince. Hot shower and Deep Cricks-his specialty drink! Maybe play his 9 hole golf course. Don't miss it!



Also take a Guinness Stout and some cash for a beer float.


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## seantana (Mar 5, 2015)

mr. compassionate said:


> Make sure to stop by Heaven on Earth and see Vince. Hot shower and Deep Cricks-his specialty drink! Maybe play his 9 hole golf course. Don't miss it!


Those things are dangerous! Delicious, but dangerous.


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## gail221 (Jun 28, 2018)

I'm impressed - October? Even though they are not pulling water, there isn't a source. Just looked - it avgs 120 cfs in Oct. Might be walking! River shuttles, I've used both the suggestions you were given - they are all great to work with.


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## 802flyfish (Oct 22, 2014)

https://www.wcc.nrcs.usda.gov/ftpref/data/water/wcs/gis/maps/mt_swepctnormal_update.pdf


Hope it stays this way..


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## spider (Jun 20, 2011)

I’ve run it at 100 in an 18’. Smith river shuttle is where it’s at.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Anyone pull a smith permit ?


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## MontanaLaz (Feb 15, 2018)

Just checked. Results aren't in yet but the drawing is today.

Update:

AAAAANNNNNNDDDDD........

I was unsuccessful


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Same..


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## WyBackCountry (Mar 20, 2014)

Same here, denied on the Smith as well.


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## mtgreenheads (Jul 15, 2011)

Yup, same here. Denied.


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## Detolvep (Dec 4, 2018)

Yup. Nope. :roll:


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## GOTY2011 (Mar 18, 2018)

Successful!


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## Pigpen (Nov 8, 2017)

Successful!!


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## AirEms (Jan 16, 2011)

Successful!!! Aug. 8th. Hopefully there will be enough water. And yes, I have floated the Smith in October and the fishing was unbelievable...(to answer a question posed earlier)


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Just found out someone from our group pulled one. First smith river trip!


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## trailcreek (Dec 7, 2012)

Took about 30 years of going on other’s permits or in the shoulders seasons. Finally won a lottery. June 15


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Has anyone floated the Smith in 3 days? Due to work schedules, we might only have two nights on the River. Hopefully the flows won’t be to low come the end of June.


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## elkhaven (Sep 11, 2013)

walterwhite said:


> Has anyone floated the Smith in 3 days? Due to work schedules, we might only have two nights on the River. Hopefully the flows won’t be to low come the end of June.


Yes, in April at 200 cfs 3 days 2 nights, 6 to 9 hours on the water daily. It was surprisingly enjoyable from a guy who would much rather do the trip in 6 days.

It is very, very unlikely that it'll be too low to float in late June of this year.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Thanks, that gives me a rough timeframe. That’s not to bad for 200 cfs. I’ll have to check the USGS for average flows for that time of the year.


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## elkhaven (Sep 11, 2013)

walterwhite said:


> Thanks, that gives me a rough timeframe. That’s not to bad for 200 cfs. I’ll have to check the USGS for average flows for that time of the year.


probably high - 500-1000 cfs.... the average won't do you much good. wait until the water year progresses, then find a specific year that follows the same early trend as this year and use that. Not that any of that really matters, what actually happens depends on temp, snow pack, precipitation, irrigation uses, etc and can change very quickly as those criteria vary. I would plan on there being plenty water - it's super rare that there is not plenty in June and this year looks to be well above average at this point. Nothing you identify now will hold water, so to speak, this far in advance.


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## SERE Nate (Feb 1, 2019)

Hows the river looking? I have a April 22nd launch date.


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## elkhaven (Sep 11, 2013)

it's still closed but low elevation snow has largely melted here in the gallatin valley... still drifts and piles on the north side of buildings but mostly gone. I'd be optimistic about it.

Their website hasn't been updated, says it still frozen, but eagle creek gauge is getting to 42 degrees and shows the ice affects ending on march 31st.


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

3 mile ice jam


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## Central oregon crew (May 2, 2016)

Last year we did June 30. Almost didn't have water and then heavy rain saved us. I think 600 down to 300 Cfs. Great trip


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## walterwhite (Jan 25, 2017)

Looks like Smith River region still over 100% SWE. So far it looks a lot better then last year. Only time can tell.


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## OhBetty (Mar 16, 2021)

*Curious for the group's thoughts regarding Smith floats in July this year.* My family finally pulled a permit to put-in on July 11th. I know it's a low snow pack year across the west... But I've been impressed to see that the Smith drainage sits at ~95% of median snowpack to-date. Over the past 10 years, the Smith appears to cross the 300 CFS threshold at about July 15th, on average. Our fleet would include a couple 15' rafts and IKs loaded to the brim.

For those who have a bit more experience with the Smith, is it pretty safe to expect the river to drop below 300 CFS before July 11th this year? And, for a crew that is very intent on fishing, any concerns about the water temp pushing above 67 degrees around then? 

Looking for any good news that could help us keep morale high in this low water year that we finally got a permit! Cheers buzzards,


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## gnarsify (Oct 5, 2020)

You should be ok for early July, but it kind of depends on how much moisture we get this spring. In my experience flows are most effected by irrigation diversions and if we have a very dry May/June it might be on the low side by then. The good news is the fishing should be excellent as the river gets cloudy during peak runoff. I know folks who've launched rafts as low as 150cfs (they definitely did some dragging and packed light), so you can get away with it being a bit below 300cfs.


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## mattviles (Jun 13, 2018)

OhBetty said:


> *Curious for the group's thoughts regarding Smith floats in July this year.* My family finally pulled a permit to put-in on July 11th. I know it's a low snow pack year across the west... But I've been impressed to see that the Smith drainage sits at ~95% of median snowpack to-date. Over the past 10 years, the Smith appears to cross the 300 CFS threshold at about July 15th, on average. Our fleet would include a couple 15' rafts and IKs loaded to the brim.
> 
> For those who have a bit more experience with the Smith, is it pretty safe to expect the river to drop below 300 CFS before July 11th this year? And, for a crew that is very intent on fishing, any concerns about the water temp pushing above 67 degrees around then?
> 
> ...


I have not floated it a bunch, but in my experience, it's all about the rain at that point. It was under 200 a few days before my last trip (July 2 launch). Rained for a few days before and on our first day- we were good to go.


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## mattviles (Jun 13, 2018)

OhBetty said:


> *Curious for the group's thoughts regarding Smith floats in July this year.* My family finally pulled a permit to put-in on July 11th. I know it's a low snow pack year across the west... But I've been impressed to see that the Smith drainage sits at ~95% of median snowpack to-date. Over the past 10 years, the Smith appears to cross the 300 CFS threshold at about July 15th, on average. Our fleet would include a couple 15' rafts and IKs loaded to the brim.
> 
> For those who have a bit more experience with the Smith, is it pretty safe to expect the river to drop below 300 CFS before July 11th this year? And, for a crew that is very intent on fishing, any concerns about the water temp pushing above 67 degrees around then?
> 
> ...


and yes, water temps can be a concern (state could even impose 'hoot owl' rules, which are not fishing after noon or. something like that. Warms up/ gets mossy.


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