# M-WAVE



## Kris M (Oct 22, 2003)

Making news on other kayak post boards....... you should all be proud!

http://www.boof.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2039


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## Force (Apr 27, 2004)

I agree. Please take that shit somewhere else. It so lame and predictable it sickens me and it's only playboating.

Yo Gillman, how's the NW treating you? looks like you've been up to something out there. Hope you're having fun.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

what up leif! been meaning to get in touch w you (& everyone else back home) with an update .. it's going great up here in seattle. 

as of today, i'm working on another production crew. this time for a feature-film horror flick. fun stuff. went to skook last weekend & might be going up to BC for some creeking this weekend. possible multi-day first d currently being air & ground scouted. should be ready to go in the coming weeks as well. 

lots to do in the city -- saw Arcade Fire at the paramount the other night, which was amazing ,, 5 million dive bars to check out ,, ladies ,, endless thai restaurants ,, etc. 

gotta go. peace,

tg


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## JJH (Oct 14, 2003)

Leif,
I thought you loved to playboat, well atleast in Gore rapid ehh!  
maybe Gore next week? tour de fat Saturday?

TG, 
hard at work as usual. Finding gems and making fliks. keep us desert dwellers entertained with some footage. Or else I have to see people dorking out over ditches. So sad.


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## stiff (May 23, 2004)

I'm pretty pissed off at all this attitude. I'm going to ask my buddy, who's been there, where the wave is. Then I'll post directions here. 

The M-wave is almost certainly on the South Canal at the bottom of map below. You could probably find it by just driving along the South Canal road that you see on this map:
http://maps.msn.com/(dvy42qajtlk0il...P=|5597|&TI=Montrose,+Colorado,+United+States
You may be able to find the exact spot from Google Earth. 

To get flow information, check out:
http://www.dwr.state.co.us/Hydrology/flow_graph.asp?ID=SOUCANCO&MTYPE=DISCHRG2
Looks like it's flowing pretty good. 

Here's the map of the South Canal:


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## EZ (Feb 10, 2004)

Finally a definitive Fax Off. Good Work.

Also, finally someone who calls out the virtue of our place in history; Google Earth is a pretty big advance. "Advance" in terms of spatial awareness, which most posts, and most of our (collective) endeavors are centered around.

That map is the first stand up, Fax Off, Bad Ass, thing to be seen on this board since ChunderBoy.


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## Ridgeway Paddler (Sep 24, 2005)

*Stifffy*

Stiff you're a f-ing punk ass beeeyotch. You seem to surf this forum and drop your 2cents on everything from religious debates to how hard the Pueblo WW park will be for your newby 4+ paddling whino ass.

Here's the deal. Anyone can find the M-wave. It's really not that hard if you just put a little effort and imagination into it. There are resources out there which make it possible as you desplayed so well (but you're still a little off).

The problem is not that people don't want to share the wave with others. It's that we, and especially me, don't want punk ass wannabees like you coming down here and destroying our ability to access the wave. Too often I see people racing around throwing up dirt and mud like they've entrered the Baja 1000 with boats on their roofs. Have some respect.

There's PRIVATE PROPERTY surrounding the M-wave and if you come down here like a f-ing yahoo disrespecting the locals ability to live in peace on their land, they will most certainly find a way to limit everyone's access to the wave.

That's not the only problem for a wanker like you. You probably wouldn't be able to figure out how to get in the water without trespassing on the private property down here. Then you'd get in the water and endanger everyone down there by taking a swim. No you say? You aint seen nuthin like the eddy lines & boil rooms the wave creates down here. You'd probably get in the water & soil yourself outa fear, then drive 4+ hours back to where you came from. I heard just recently that there was a solid group from the front range down here a little while back. One of the paddlers took a swim and nearly drowned. And he/she was supposedly a pretty darn good paddler.

It's not about not sharing the goods with others. It's about preserving everyones ability to use it and most importantly RESPECTING THE PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN THE AREA. 

Most importantly for you through would be the fact that, and I quote, 



> yes, I am bothered by the religious part. I am just mystified that people take the bible as total truth


you'd shit yourself if you knew how seriously we take religion down here. So come on down you bible bashing wannabe. We'd love to show you the wave and introduce you to religion at the same time.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

Hey retards -- do you fail to see the irony here? Obviously. Guess I have to spell it out for you, huh?

You've hijacked/polluted the one thread on here that was established to say "We don't give a funk about the M-wave & we're sick of the childish 4-year shit-storm surrounding it", by propagating it further. Did you not see or "get" the "Beating a dead horse" GIF? Did you not comprehend how the thread talked about topics OTHER than the M-wave?

Whether you're crying about not knowing where it is, or you know where it is & you're not telling, & especially the guy who attached a map & the other vagina who's pissed at him, you're all lame.


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## stiff (May 23, 2004)

Ridgeway Paddler: I don't think you are very good at respecting other people who aren't exactly like you.


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## Cutch (Nov 4, 2003)

> So come on down you bible bashing wannabe. We'd love to show you the wave and introduce you to religion at the same time.


Aren't you guys all mormons? I grew up in Junction and I thought most of the people there are mormons. Crazy... now people want to recruit me for their religion when all I want to do is throw a couple of air blunts. 

The Olathe Sweet Corn you guys have is so good. I can't wait to pick some up next time I'm down there surfing your wave. It's not far out of the way if you know which dirt roads to haul ass on to get there quickly.


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## yetigonecrazy (May 23, 2005)

olathe sweet corn is so bomb


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

There's a variety of sweet corn where i grew up (eastern shore of maryland) called Silver Queen. I'd put it up against Olathe product any day of the week. Throw a ton of buttah on it & some Old Bay seasoning .. the bee's knees ..

Hi Kyle! Hey, there's a pretty good wave not too far from where I moved. It has reliable & predictable flows all year long & the local's welcome you. Plus it's way better than that one wave in CO that everyone gets all chaffed about. When you comin' up?


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## twitch (Oct 16, 2003)

Silver Queen's not bad, but it's no Olathe. However, we don't have Crab Cakes. I used to drop my crab trap from Capt. Bunting's dock in Ocean City and my grandma would make the bomb ass crab cakes with what I brought back. 

The waves there kinda sucked though. Locals were friendly.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

Crab cakes? Buntings?? You're speakin' my language man! Where you from?

OC waves were great to grow up with. Depending on the movements of the sand bars, we'd always have at least waist-to-chest somewhere around. Summers could be flat for a long time. The Inlet, 8th St., north to Indian River & Manasquan, south to some secret barrier island shit off VA & down to Hatteras. We had all the spots on lock. I would call the surf report 10 times a day when I was a kid, plus listen to the NOAA weather-band radio & usually got waves somewhere. There was a spot we called "the wedge" that entailed paddling across the bay from West OC to Assateague right by the inlet. It peeled on north swells. We usually stayed til the tide or wind killed the swell, but then once, the incoming tide was so strong, we ended up *miles* down the bay towards the assateague bridge & had to get towed back to W.OC by a fisherman. Those were the days!

Maybe it's local pride or that it's been forever since i had an ear of silver queen, but I'm still backing it.


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## twitch (Oct 16, 2003)

*Slick Chick*

Could've been my Grandfather or Uncle who towed you back! Slick Chick I & Slick Chick II were his boats. He was the one catching all the big sharks. MD state record for the Mako, World Record for the Sand Tiger, and then he caught that big Great White up in NY. Still have the head stuffed & in storage out there somewhere. I miss those days for sure.

I didn't grow up there but spent the summers at the family condo at the Capri. I was from the other coast. Our wedge is so much better than your wedge...but you've still got the crab cakes.


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## 217 (Oct 27, 2003)

twitch- get rid of those crabs fast!

-aaron


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

DUDE! i have 2 cutouts from "the coastal fisherman" newspaper with my pops who *also* held the MD state record for mako back in the early 80's, two different times. he captained a boat called the "housewarmers" & another one that i forget the name of. I bet he knew, or at least knew of, the Slick Chick for sure. Prolly knows your gramps -- what's his name? Weird ..

Yeah, my friends & I stole "the wedge" from Newps .. but ours had a similar tendency to jack up & drill the beach hard .. & ours wasn't overrun by a million aggressive body-surfers. In fact, when we went to the wedge, we were always the only ones there cuz it was so inaccessible.


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## twitch (Oct 16, 2003)

*Pop Pop*

Millard Sindler aka Pop Pop. I'm pretty sure your pops would know him. The Slick Chick Boats & their crew were somewhat notorious. Whenever I visited it seemed like he knew everyone in town. One of the nicest guys ever is what they all told me may he RIP.

Dude! Your wedge sounds so much like this wave I've been to. It's in BFN Colorado someplace...


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## stiff (May 23, 2004)

Yea, sorry to hijack your thread. I should have posted the directions to the M-wave on the other thread or just created a new thread. I'll do that when I get the exact directions.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

thanks man, but do us all a favor & don't. seriously, leave it alone .. not because i give a shit about keeping the location under wraps, but because you're totally exacerbating the issue when you could just enjoy the fruits of your sherlock holmes-ish labor. go have a surf, take a friend, & just forget about it.

twitch, i'm waiting to hear back from my dad, but i *think* he may have been aboard with PopPop on one of those mako missions. I think I even know who your gramps was! How weird would that be (given I have no idea who you even are ...)


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## sundown (Jul 16, 2005)

OC...gotta like *Secrets*.


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## BKC (Apr 18, 2004)

I say ... get the f'ing directions on here and dissolve this conversation. You want the area protected. Then join AWA. You want to make sure that the area is perserved by your kayaking peers, then trust in us to do what they we all know is right with any area we travel down ... through ... around. It's the community coming together that get's er done ... If its worth protecting ... then lets do it right. So get them on, get this over with and if you want it protected, work with the organizations that support access.


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## GDalton (Nov 4, 2003)

You pussies. Talking about corn and crabs while your east coast brothers are throwing air wheels and such on the Upper F_cking Gauley! 

Gilman, why are you spilling the beans on the top secret W-spot? The wedge is for locals only bi-atch. We all know you can't surf anyway.

For the record, the best corn is white shoe peg from Kinston, North Carolina. Or thereabouts.

Threw down at G-Fest last weekend. All you coloRADo boys were missed.

Enjoying the M-wave show from Down East, keep it up,
GD


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## JJH (Oct 14, 2003)

you are all wrong.
Indiana sweet corn can not be compared to.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

Hey GDalton, sorry I was a bit late to respond/flame. I've been outta interweb access up in BC running creeks. You can spray all you want about "airwheels" on the Gauley during GF weekend, but I know the deal -- up all night boozin' in a raft company parking lot listening to glory stories about so-and-so's "rowdy" line at Pillow from drunk overweight Nine-to-fivers .. then spending all day superbly hungover & waiting in line for Geeks & Hungry Ma only to have your rides ruined by the incessant line of party barges .. all the while you wish Mann's or even the Meadow had water in it so you could get "away", but even if you could, those runs would have not only every "pro" & pro wannabe, but also every aspiring class V guppy from Philly to Charlotte to Columbus plugging up every eddy & sieve. Sweet, wish I was there. 

Yeah, we pretty much had the whole province of BC to ourselves the last couple days. 

JJ -- yer new nickname is "mellencamp" .. "jj cougar mellencamp" .. little pink corncobs .. we need to catch up. I'll give a call.

BKC, get a clue.


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## badkins (Oct 30, 2003)

> BKC, get a clue


Nice Todd, he was saying if the place is worth protecting get AW or CWWA involved and actually do something that will protect access. Instead you defend this localism bullshit where you and only the chosen few have any supposed right to be there. You are perpetuating the problem. THAT is why people are rooting for it to get shut down, why don't you get a fucking clue and check your ego.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

Let's do this.

I've been there twice & have no idea how to get back there & don't care. I think the secretive ocalism sucks ass & i think that the whining about not knowing where it is sucks ass & i think the whole issue is juvenile. 

If you could get past your *literal* interpretation of everything printed you might get my sense of irony with the ORIGINAL POST that i put up (i.e., "beating a dead horse") .. The mtbuzz community at large is sick of this issue. Colorado boating scene upholds its childish image in the larger community thru stupid shit being said on both sides of this issue. It's been the same for FOUR YEARS. 

My "get a clue" comment has to do with the waterway not being "defendable". You, as a longtime CO boater should know this. Everyone by now should know this. <<edit: Neither the AW nor the CWWA are going to touch this issue in a million years.>> It's a private diversion / irrigation ditch. You don't have the right to be there & neither do I -- I DON'T GO THERE. Get it? 

Now that you kooks have hijacked my thread, which was supposed to have been about *anything* except for the whole M-Wave shitstorm (corn, crabs, fishing, sex, botulism, homophobia), I've had to spell out the painfully obvious. I apologize for your lack of a sense of humor/irony.


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## BastrdSonOfElvis (Mar 24, 2005)

Yesssss...now we're getting somewhere..let's talk about SEX and BOTULISM! No two things go together quite so well.


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## steven (Apr 2, 2004)

ok people--let's try to spell it out one last time. if this spot were on a river without access issues--it would be come one come all, let's have a rodeo/festival/whatever. no one is trying to deny anyone else the right to do anything. no one is trying to perpetuate "localism". no one is trying to keep any respectful boater away. there are no crowds there anyway. we only want the access issues not to get blown up. this will happen if folks are not cool while driving/being there. no offense to anyone in particular, but there are some loud, arrogant, jerks who kayak out there. these are the exception in my experience. it is very sensitive with private property issues surrounding a government irrigation ditch. we would like it to continue to be accessable for all who respect the situation. if this does not make sense to you, then you must be an idiot. if folks are indeed rooting for this spot to get shutdown--then you must be something along the lines of an as$hole/idiot combo. the only thing that needs to get shutdown are these m-wave discussions, hence todd g's post.


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## badkins (Oct 30, 2003)

> I apologize for your lack of a sense of humor/irony.


Nah, you were being a jerk and I called you on it, that's all. As far as the rest, yuck yuck, don't quit your day job. (that is if you actually have one)



> Now that you kooks have hijacked my thread


And I'm gonna fly it right into the M-wave, just try and shoot me down mother fucker!


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

Brian, way to sidestep the issue & thanks for your totally predictable ad hominem response (kids, look it up. that's when a someone is losing an argument & decides to personally attack the other person arguing instead of attacking the other person's points. Just like what Brian did to me with his "you're a jerk" comment & the implicative "dayjob" jab). This intellectually inferior strategy works great to divert attention from your mistakes & sometimes results in full-blown battles over non-issues, especially on internet forums. 

Point is, you were presumptuous in your knee-jerk reaction comments directed at me & you were just wrong in your assertions .. most likely because you didn't read/comprehend all the previous posts in the thread. But whatever, you still put your foot in your mouth. 

Oh, & just so you know Brian, I've been OVERemployed for the last 7 yrs working for companies like Airwalk & Red Bull, all while maintaining a pretty full extracurricular schedule of side-projects, volunteer work, & way more boating & snowboarding than you can imagine. You can verify that with just about anyone of stature from the CO boating community -- I've played a role in supporting this community quite a bit over the years. Until recently, when I quit my fulltime gig & now I'm happily underemployed & just working on fun projects as they come up. You wish you coulda been creeking in BC the last 3 days Brian -- How's your day job now?


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## newby0616 (Jun 16, 2005)

BSoE,
Don't forget the "CORN" and "CRABS"... because we all know you can't have sex and botulism (maybe you can?) without CORNCOBS and CRABS to sweeten the package deal!


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## Force (Apr 27, 2004)

This thread is rad... give it to him Todd. 

I love how every fall when the waters in CO stop running besides some POS irrigations ditches, gore and baily every CO boater devotes hours of their day reading the buzz and posting wothless shit. Like somehow by flaming what creeks boat is the best, who' s done what and some new retarded freestyle manuver done in a POS irrigation ditch will somehow confirm our status and a badass motha fucka. Get out and live a little people. 

Man I need to move back to the northwest and rediscover my roots. shiat.... Didn't anyone besides Gillman, Cutch, and Hanah get the point.


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## badkins (Oct 30, 2003)

Look at the big brain on Todd! Going all Ad Hominem on my ass, ouch! Ok, I'll see your Ad Hominem and raise you a "why don't you help yourself to a nice big steaming cup of shut the fuck up"!  

OK, I'll bite. Just 'cause a location is legally indefensable does not mean it is impossible to negotiate access. Basically it comes down to this: it may be easier for the parties involved to negotiate access than to totally shut it down or go to the trouble of destroying it. So why not at least try?

A great example would be UNSV. The Button Rock Wilderness preserve is essentially a big block of private property where the city of Longmont not only owns the land but the water as well. By your definition it is not defendable. As a person of "stature" in the CO boating community I'm sure you are aware of the access problems there. It became evident in 2004 that a new ranger was in town and he was going take it all the way if need be to keep kayakers off the reservoir, so some local paddlers, Peter Roth in particular, took it on themselves to sit down with the parties involved and try to negotiate access. Long story short, the city of longmont basically decided that it was easier to make nice with the kayakers and establish a code of conduct while on their property, than to lay the hammer down and start arresting people. 

Sorry I didn't spell it out for you at first, I guess my mind was blown trying to imagine all the boating & snowboarding you've been up to. (That, like my job comment, was sarcasm. You can call it what you like.) I was trying to keep it short and light hearted, even if I was being a bit of jerk myself. But what good is the internet if not for flaming? I mean come on! You may resume stroking your ego...


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## adrock (Apr 28, 2004)

*other topics*

Speaking of talking about shit other than the M wave:

I was paddling until 3 in the am last night. I love a good overnighter but, Damnit I'm tired. Anyone want to buy an S6F? 192, its yellow. I need to sell it if I want to go to Argentina. Been riding my mountain bike alot, night riding with the ipod is the shit! Hey, watch out for the naked guy on the prospect bike path. He's been making appearances. 

Vive, JJ, cutch, anyone else in FC/Denver, poker night? Hows mondays work? three weeks from now, hold em. Maybe TG can fly in for a weekend, we'll get together and coop his ticket.

Fight aids, fuck tits. And fuck all the whiny post perverts out there.
PEACE


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## Force (Apr 27, 2004)

Dude, I am so down with poker night. As long as we're talking cards here. 

Paddling until 3am, I'm perplexed but will let it be.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

My Pops is shipping 2 bushels of MD blue crabs to your address Force. Adro's got the col'beers, of course. JJ's bringin' the Mellencamp. Cutch is bringin the baby & the Olathe corn, but not "baby corn". & EvanDotcom is bringing a computer. Frenchy always brings the, well, nevermind. 

I'll bring the big box of "clues" for Brian Adkins. Maybe then he'll get it that this thread ISN'T. ABOUT. THE. FUCKING. M-WAVE!


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## badkins (Oct 30, 2003)

Todd, way to sidestep the issue. You seem to be making up the rules as you go along.


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## 217 (Oct 27, 2003)

"i love twitch, he is hot" -ToddG (spoken right after he finished giving him crabs)

"thekid and surfpimp make a great sandwich"-batkins (spoken while eating corn at the bridge of the m-wave)


i love flamers!

-aaa ass hole


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## griz (Sep 19, 2005)

ToddG said:



> My Pops is shipping 2 bushels of MD blue crabs to your address, GRIZ


mmmmm.... can't wait. thanks! 

man, crabs are the only thing i really miss about MD. 

... and save the "got crabs" jokes, you bunch of clueless landlocked fucks!


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## BastrdSonOfElvis (Mar 24, 2005)

If youz guys would shave your balls like you're supposed to, you wouldn't have to worry about the crabs.


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

Hey Adkins, WTF is your problem man? 

The issue since you corrupted this discussion is how you somehow think that I am a "jerk" engaged in "supporting localism bullshit". You have me confused with someone who actually gives a shit about the M-wave &/or keeping it "secret". 

OK, for the last time, I DON'T CARE ABOUT THE MWAVE. OK? I don't care if it's a secret or if it's crowded. I don't live in CO, I don't know how to get to the Mwave, I don't like playboating, I don't go to the Mwave & I don't give a shit. 

I *am* sick of you & everyone else on both sides of the fence who keep dragging this stupid topic on year after year. That, & I am a "jerk" .. sometimes even a "jerkface" .. but I've come to terms with all that by now. If you can do something to make positive steps forward in ensuring that the MWave is safe & accessible, then please, for the love o' corn, go do something about it. You'd make about 500 people really happy. Just stop running your mouth about it on Mountainbuzz for 5 seconds, & stop trying to pick a fight with me over it. OK?

And If you're looking for an apology for the "get a clue comment", you ain't gonna get it,, cuz anyone that hijacked this particular discussion to do exactly what the thread was started to ridicule, NEEDS TO GET A CLUE. How much more literal do I need to be than posting that "Beating a Dead Horse" GIF? At least Stiff apologized for corrupting the thread, you on the other hand still don't get it. 

So, to summarize, I will not be dragged into some cliche e-battle over something that is not in any way meaningful or important to me. I regret that I allowed you to rile me to the degree that I even responded to your childish taunts, but whatever. I'm ready to be left alone now, but you seem like a "last word" kinda guy, so please have it & be sure to really make me look real dumb.


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## BastrdSonOfElvis (Mar 24, 2005)

Hey, corn guys...I'll bet you could find some tasty niblets on the shore o' the clear creek! mmm...no matter what kind of corn it started out as, it sure does taste better after a pass through the ol' guttywuts.


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## Podium (Sep 29, 2005)

I have decided to settle this once and for ALL. 

I met with the farmers, who grow corn on the private property and crabs in the eddy, and who OWNS the wave, water, rebar, concrete, fridge, and 100yds of barbwire located in the eddy. Over a recent game of poker, we discussed a solution.

They want parking permits. These will cost $120 ea this year and be available by INVITAION ONLY. No one else is allowed. That means all those west slope players now need parking permits. The farmers expressed to me that you have been getting away with this secret society for too long. They also don't like that secret handshake you do, tickling their palm with your middle finger. 

I told them they have been missing out on alot of $$$. They were pissed. They thought that you were doing it for fun. I showed them the magazine articles and mentioned how each of you have been making a ton of money on the wave as professionals.

So, unless you have the M-Wave Club Parking Permit sticker on your bumper OR a hanging permit, YOU WILL BE TOWED. This is strickly business, don't take it personally. Contact Podium Permit Systems for more information. Remotes for the gate will be $350.


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## marko (Feb 25, 2004)

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: 

Holy crap...I am still laughing from Todd's description of Gauley Fest. That is an amazingly accurate description. All of my memories of waiting in a frustrating line at Geeks came rushing back.

Todd, Glad to hear you are having a great time up there in the NW.


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## Electric-Mayhem (Jan 19, 2004)

I hate to say it Mr.G, but what did you expect?

Bringing it up even to ridicule it isn't gonna change the fact that its gonna become a big discussion. If you don't care, have no interest and don't want to hear anything more about it, then why bring it up at all? Obviously this means something to people, whether its jealousy or access rights or overcrowding or territoriality.

If you don't want to hear anything about, don't click on a thread that has "M-wave" in the title. Its that simple. I don't mind the discussions on this subject, though the false information that some give and the attitudes that others give is a bit disheartening. It is my belief that if its open to one kayaker, then it should be open to all, though not at the same time. Unforutunetly the attitude and situation don't always cater to this ideal. Oh well, I have a feeling it will eventually come down to all or none. While I think blowing the doors open and letting anyone who wants to come in is a bad idea, I do think that everyone deserves their chance to experience this wave without getting attitude from people (as long as they are cool about it too). More and more it seems that the wrong kind of people are gaining access while people who would be prone to be more responsible are denied it. Until someone decides that it would be cool to figure out how to make a real wave that is man made, this topic will likely never die. Hopefully something can be figured out in the near future so this can become a non-issue.

JH


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## ToddG (Nov 29, 2003)

EM -- I had no plans to post to this topic any more, but just wanted to say that yeah, you're absolutely right .. 

It was never my goal to change anyone's stance .. just to point out the redundancy of the topic itself & hopefully open a few eyes -- via a snappy, not-so-subtle, but totally appropriate GIF -- that all the bickering & posturing was nothing more than annoying & not furthering either side's cause. 

What really irritated me was not only the perversion of the discussion (as you pointed out, that was to be expected), but the totally off-base assertion that I actually had a stake in the MWave argument, that I had some support role in keeping the spot "secret". My "I don't care" rant was mostly directed at that assertion, but extended to include the whole shit-show. Yeah, I know I don't have to click on anything "M-wave" related, & therefore I DON'T .. yet I know exactly what lurks behind those doors if opened, cuz it's been the same for the last couple years. 

Thing is, there's real amazing news happening out in our community every week that gets completely lost in the quagmire because the CO boating scene would rather bash each other, whine, & pound their chests about a wave in an irrigation ditch. Case in point: The entire Stikine was just recently completed in ONE DAY. Have you folks even heard of the Stikine? Are you aware of its existence & place in the canon of our silly sport? Or is the entire scope of your whitewater world the local playspot? This is big news guys. 

But yeah, yer right EM, & i'll think twice before top-posting ever again .. & as for the rest of your email .. I'll leave that to the folks who do care about the MWave so they can continue Beating this Dead Horse.


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## BobbyWalker (Jul 19, 2005)

Todd, you have some great points. One thing I have notice from these forums and reality shows is that most Americans love drama and create it whenever they can. I thought kayakers were above that crap, but I'm bummed to see that it isn't true. WTF. What ever happened to the kayaking community where it was all about supporting your fellow boaters and running the shit. I will go out of my way to help out a person just because they are a kayaker. This use to be the general attitude of kayakers. What happened to it?


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## BastrdSonOfElvis (Mar 24, 2005)

Bobby...I think that attitude still prevails. Don't let a few rotten apples spoil your perception of boating society. The way I see it, if people don't feal the way you do then they're not real boaters. F 'em.


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## benrodda (Mar 27, 2004)

The point about drama is sooo true.... but it is not a recent thing to Kayaking. I can remember when Rock Island was a secret, and when a famous Kayaker had a "Dancers only" club, secret creeks in the southeast, and when Corran bitched about the rules of a rodeo or when he got put in jail... actually thats just Corran. Its just that now that we have a forum like this we pick up on it a little more, but we have a choice as too how involved we are going to be with it.

Its actually kind of fun to get under each others skin a little... I actually wanted to map quest some directions to a gay bar as the location of the M wave.... By the way I have never been there, i would like to go, but that kid Alex (sheriff of the M-wave) might be there and he seems like he is kind of a whiney bitch. That's just based on how I saw him react to getting beat down at the Teva games. I might cry a bit too if that happend to me..

Hows that for Drama?


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## TheKid (Aug 25, 2004)

I feel that i must defend Alex in this situation. Frist of all Alex is the shit. The kid kills and he is super nice. Secondly I was told a little story about something that happened at the M-wave a few weeks ago. Some Fuckers from Gunnison were at the M-wave when My friend Johnny, and Alex rolled up. Now both these boys paddle for dagger. They are both super friendly, nice, and bad ass boaters to boot. But these Gunny boys started talkin trash to John and Alex. Telling them to leave. Now they might not have known who Alex was. But no one has the right to tell someone to leave a play spot for no reason. And NO ONE has the right to tell Alex to leave the M-wave. That is one of the most fucked up things I have ever heard. You wonder why Alex might feel like has to protect the wave a bit sometimes. Assholes like that is why. I wasn't even there and this pissed me the fuck off when i heard about. So get off Alex's back.


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## FLOWTORCH (Mar 5, 2004)

Nyah-ahahaha. That horse is so right on. I been purposely stayin away from this thread cause I'm so frickin tired of CO boaters beating that dead horses arse, and then low and behold this is what I find. Way to address the issue TG. No need to go on repeating what has already been said here, but what the hell. It's a fucking wave in a fucking ditch. Enough said. Now, Todd or anyone, where can I find some good info and pics on that one-day stikine drop??? Thats the shit i'm talkin bout.

TG-check your pm, i gotta ? for you.


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