# Ruby horsethief fishing license



## 83786 (Nov 11, 2020)

Not sure but a single day Colorado fishing license (which I'm sure would suffice) is fairly cheap ($14 if a CO resident, $17 if not).


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## Quiggle (Nov 18, 2012)

It’s only to use the loma ramp not to float on the river. Just put in up river and you will bypass all of fishing license requirements


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## ArgoCat (May 14, 2007)

Yep. Only at the ramp. If you are using Rim Rock for your shuttle, you can out in there, If not, you can put in at the State Park and pay a daily fee. If it is high water or you are doing three days, this actually breaks up the trip quite nicely. I never put in at Loma anymore.


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## liltownhero (Mar 22, 2017)

Thanks for the replies. $17/head buys a lot of river beer. Guess I’ll be changing my put in location and floating a little longer.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

The fishing license, or hunting license, is in order to access state parks lands, if you aren't using their lands, you don't need one. Launch at James L Robb river park instead, is a nice addition to the trip.


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## JustinJam (Mar 18, 2009)

I don't understand how they DOW can expect people even be aware of this fee specific ramp. There is nothing on rec.gov or the printable regulations regarding a ramp fee of $17/person


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## NoCo (Jul 21, 2009)

I was talking about this with an advid fisherman last week. I see his point about the upkeep of these areas being funded by fishing and hunting licenses. My problem is it is confusing. What ramps? If i already pay say AHRA day use fees do i need this too. I usually get a parks pass, do i need a fishing license too? Does everyone in the boat need the license or just 1 person? The fact that fishermen think that everybody at every ramp need a license. Are these restrictions going to be implied on the Poudre where there are some state land access that does not require paying for day use. I dont mind buying a pass, i get it we all need to pay for maintenance of the access of these areas, but requiring a license is double dipping.


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

Specific ramps are funded by different agencies and sometime are cooperative efforts between agencies. Its fairly convoluted.

Re RHT and Loma I do think its easy to see as double dipping (for people that have a permit) since it has been the traditional launch for RHT ( hell, the run was called Loma in CRC2) and the permit should have it built in. Now, people that want to launch fruita could say, hell no I don't want it built in, I have to pay at James Robb and the CPW fee and the permit fee? Guys like me that already bought a fishing license (and however much other money I give CPW) would then be paying even more, even though we built the ramp. Its all a real cluster. Problem with that specific permit and the confusion is that its a "camping permit" managed by the BLM (feds) and has different agencies involved. Back when there was no permit and Loma was free, we would pay to launch in fruita just to get the extra miles and avoid the shitshow. Overuse, the limited camping situation and people not being able to manage themselves with the courtesy sign up is why the permit system was put in place. Its pretty common, in the off season especially, to have guys blast down in jet boats to fish black rocks area and blast back to Loma. 

You can launch at Loma ( paid for by CPW) and day trip RHT all you want with a fishing license and no camping permit. Cant have one guy with requirements to use the launch and one without. These are the guys that paid for the ramp. Non angler floaters piggybacked for free for a long time.

Hunters and fisherman do fund a whole hell of a lot of things that non hunters and anglers take advantage of for free ( like Loma for the past x amount of years). So I don't mind the state trying to collect from users. I don't always agree with how they go about it, but its all a mess and a lot of brain damage to figure out how to collect fair fees. Just know, if you do buy a fishing license, even if you don't fish, that you are funding a bunch of different things besides stocking trout and paying game wardens. Lots of boat ramps, shitters, access, conservation, new public lands (that can be used for other things than hunting and fishing) etc are funded with that money. Also, there is a built in S&R fee when you buy a license. If you get in deep shit, you're covered to some extent for your evac. Cheap insurance of sorts if you will.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Well, here's the deal. It's not ramp access, it's all the areas managed and maintained by CPW.. From their website

*A valid hunting or fishing license is required for everyone 18 or older accessing any State Wildlife Area or Colorado Parks and Wildlife-leased State Trust Land, effective July 1, 2020.* 

Gleaned from Colorado Parks and Wildlife

Here's another helpful link


https://cpw.state.co.us/Documents/RulesRegs/Brochure/lands.pdf#page=55



So, yep, it can get spendy to launch a group from Loma.. In a hurry.. As Zach said, it's a real cluster..


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## jeffro (Oct 13, 2003)

I understand the issue and the need to kick $$ in but I really hate the implementation. I wish they could have a $5/person boat ramp fee or something. From what I understand there used to be a SWA Access Permit your could buy but the funds didn't go to them. Seems like a legislative fix is needed?

I also hate that I have to hold a small game hunting license to apply for a large game license. I have no interest in a small game license. Just raise the large game tag to whatever it needs to be instead of making me buy some other license. And those habitat stamps grind my gears. They were required for SWA areas only, then one covered a hunting and fishing license, now one is required for each license. I don't have an issue paying my way but I hate the convoluted BS.

Rumor last year was you need the fishing license to float over their SWA property which extend to the middle of the the river at Loma. I doubt that would ever get ticketed but you never know.

At least with the AHRA fees are clear and they appear to be used to improve the access and manage the area.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

It was a legislative fix that created this problem... 

When CDPOR was forced to merge with CDOW, CDPOR stripped CDOW of their surplus of money, now CDOW doesn't have any money left to manage wildlife, where parks and outdoor recreation is a giant succubus of money. AHRA is the only state park in all of the Colorado state parks that is self-sufficient, and it doesn't come from user fees that you and I pay at fee kiosks. It comes from the special use agreement holders contribution of, as I recall 10 years ago it was 7% of what they charged their customers. That's why the commercial outfitters have such a huge voice on the Arkansas, cuz they fork over the big bucks to AHRA. 

Doesn't do anything for the rest of the public lands out there which the division of wildlife used to be able to afford to manage and keep up, but once all the money went into a giant bucket, they got the short end of the stick...

I saw stuff like this coming years ago, it started with habitat stamps, and now the requirement to buy one license to become eligible to buy another license... They are nickel and diming people to death, except with inflation it's now 5 and 10 bucking people to death. once it's begun, it's a vicious cycle, and will never stop, it will only continue to feed on itself until it becomes untenable and there's a revolt.
I understand the need for money to keep things flowing smoothly, but the legislature will never give CPW as the new unified agency is called enough money to support their needs... It hasn't historically happened, and it's not likely to happen in the future... On the bright side tourism is not diminishing, and the sites are getting more and more and more use as the days go on, and what's really miserable, is with covid people that never used to leave the security of their nice safe cities are now venturing west and putting it unbelievable demand on a finite resource. 

There was a study done in chaffee county last year that showed the local satisfaction with the way public lands are being managed was dismal... being overrun and unable to get away from the tourists was number one on the list of things people thought needed to be managed more. This in and of itself scares me, more management usually brings more fees, and more rules and, more regulations that weren't previously needed...

Unfortunately I don't have a solution to this problem, short of putting up a fence around the state of Colorado, nice square state, should be easy, and charging the visitors an admission fee like they do at the national parks. That, to me anyway, being a resident, seems equitable lol


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## jeffro (Oct 13, 2003)

Excellent points MNicols.

I am _SHOCKED_ that DOW money was raided. Was I told a lie when they were planning it? I thought it would streamline operations and everybody would come out ahead. /s

In the end I try to zen about the fees. Of all the places my money goes public access is one of the best. However Rec.gov deserves outrage. Most of that money goes straight into private coffers while our public lands are being neglected.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

Thank you sir, and yes, I was shocked when I found politicians were lying to me as well lol

As well you're preaching to the choir about wreck.gov, I wouldn't really care quite so much if it was functional and easy to navigate.....


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## zbaird (Oct 11, 2003)

No doubt implementation is a huge problem. God forbid you get multiple agencies involved with the same section. Thats how we see these fees start stacking and being unreasonable. Pretty soon we'll see a fee specific for the Utah side as well.


The small game requirment for a big game app thing chaps my ass. I think turkey tags count too so if you turkey hunt that would cover you and you wouldn't have to get the SG. Good reason to start maybe? I am going to buy a combo anyway, so it doesn't matter for me but chaps my ass somethin fierce other people have to pay it. Its no doubt a money grab and nothing but. Other states started that shit, CO saw the $$, and jumped on board. The guys that really get smoked by it are out of state. If they apply for the draw they are $130-300 ( depending what they apply for) in just to apply. I have to buy the SG every year in NM to apply for the oryx tag and will likely never go there to hunt small game, or draw the damn oryx tag. 

Habitat stamp is every license now? I thought it was one a year? I bought the lifetime when it came out because I didn't want the hassle of dealing with it every year and knew at some point it would go up in price. I was wondering if it would ever pay off since I was on the cusp age wise for it to make sense but if it is for every license then it damn sure should. At 4-6 licenses a year it won't take long. Its a great lifelong present for a kid if you think they'll be in the outdoor lifestyle.


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## MNichols (Nov 20, 2015)

zbaird said:


> Habitat stamp is every license now? I thought it was one a year? . Its a great lifelong present for a kid if you think they'll be in the outdoor lifestyle.


Yessir, at least fishing, small game and over-the-counter elk...

Outstanding idea, I can think of three kids just off hand that are going to get a present from me... Thank you so much for the suggestion...


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## sporkfromork (Dec 16, 2020)

Not gonna read the whole thread to say this but apparently you can get a "habitat tag" or whatever, I would call Rim Rock Adventures in GJ or another local outfitter and let them explain it to you. Gear Junction doesn't look like it from the website but those dudes are good at rafting and rafting parts and rafting knowledge and I am sure they will give you the low down


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## liltownhero (Mar 22, 2017)

Just want to chime back in to make it clear that I’m definitely not just trying to avoid fees when I think they actually go to fund the places I use. I have no problem with a usage fee. The fact that rec.gov doesn’t actually give the money to the river Maintanence is one I just recently learned about and it really frustrates me. But I don’t see a fishing license directly helping the ramp. I live in winter park, often float the upper C, I have to deal with uneducated, maybe meaning well tourists who come in and trash places I love. Like others have said there isn’t a clear answer because politicians are involved and they seem to just like collecting money and over paying for mediocre work whenever they do get anything done. If you’ve ever driven to road to pumphouse you know what I mean. How is it possible that road isn’t maintained more than twice a year. The amount commercial trips pay for that launch location alone should be more than enough to cover a simple maintenance.

i digress. I usually get a fishing license simply for the S&R aspect of it, so it wasn’t for me. I just had some out of state friends coming and felt like them paying $17x4=68 seems like a lot. Put a launch box up for $5/boat and that should cover all the maintenance work that actually needs to be done and I’m sure most people would be happy to pay it.


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## Bleugrass (Feb 5, 2018)

Last I heard, CPW was considering a middle-ground fee for day use at places like Loma. This article from January suggests it would $8 or $9 a day, which people would still bitch about but is a step in the right direction.

Personally, I prefer to skip the zoo at Loma and put in elsewhere.


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