# 2017 Owhyee



## oarboatman (Jul 20, 2006)

Looks like it's going to be a high lake year. I talked with Robin from JV yesterday and she said they were actively working in reopening the birch creek road due to wash out areas, but Leslie is GTG. 

Feels like winter here but season kickoff is T- 7 days👍


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## CurrentLY (Aug 24, 2016)

A subset of our crew is looking at a mid-April lower Owyhee (Rome to LG) trip. Yee haw!


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## Easy Tiger (Jun 22, 2016)

Do you think flows will hold through mid-June? We are hoping put on the Owyhee on June 19th on our way to our Rogue trip this year.


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## CurrentLY (Aug 24, 2016)

Could be but it's likely to be really low by then. The daily mean discharge based on 68 years of data is 718 cfs on June 19. American Whitewater reports the lower Owyhee to be runnable from 750 - 10,000 cfs. However the monthly mean discharge for June 2011 was 3012 cfs. I guess it all depends what kind of spring we have this year.


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## Junk Show Tours (Mar 11, 2008)

2011 was an unusual spring. Very cool and wet with a delayed runoff across the Northern Rockies.


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## landslide (Dec 20, 2014)

I did a solo kayak-self support trip down the Owyhee last year (April 26 to May 1) and really enjoyed it. I'm hoping to do another run again this year and have been keeping an eye on the snow pack, etc. Out of curiosity, I started Googling commercial trips to see when they run it and how often. This was by no means an exhaustive search, but I came up with seven outfitters running 16 different trips between 4/12 and 5/13. Almost half the trips were in the last week of April. 

As permits become harder and harder to snag on the 4 Rivers, I think the Owyhee will see increasing pressure. At what point usage of the Owyhee increases to the point that permits become limited, I don't know. Right now, it still feels like a "remote" run, but it's really not much of a drive from Boise. Campsites seemed to be in fairly good shape last year, but that was after several years when the runoff was so meager there were few private or commercial trips.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

CurrentLY said:


> Could be but it's likely to be really low by then. The daily mean discharge based on 68 years of data is 718 cfs on June 19. American Whitewater reports the lower Owyhee to be runnable from 750 - 10,000 cfs. However the monthly mean discharge for June 2011 was 3012 cfs. I guess it all depends what kind of spring we have this year.


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## Roguelawyer (Apr 2, 2015)

Hoping for a cool spring. 

How many days do people take to go from Rome to LG?


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## T4eresa (Mar 10, 2017)

*4 days in canoes at 1300 cfs*

That was my first time down, and it was a reasonable pace.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

Roguelawyer said:


> Hoping for a cool spring.
> 
> How many days do people take to go from Rome to LG?


As many as possible within the 14 day limit.


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

T4eresa said:


> That was my first time down, and it was a reasonable pace.


Did 4 last year, which was way too fast. Especially with the 40 mph winds.


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## Wiggins (Sep 26, 2009)

I called Owyhee River Shuttles this weekend. They said Birch Creek Rd is rough, but open. They are starting to grade it today, but even without the grading they are able to get Subarus in there. 

Kyle


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## garnetspur (Aug 14, 2010)

took out yesterday at Birch Cr. Road is good to go.


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## joelduder (Jun 8, 2014)

*Mid May flows?*

I'm planning on making a trip from CO to OR in mid May. I have heard a lot of good things about the Owyhee and think the lower sections would be a good stretch for our group. 
1. Would anyone have an idea what the flows will be like mid May this year?
2. Does anyone know of a company that runs shuttle for the Rome-Birch stretch? 
3. Is there a permit required for this stretch?
4. Is it dog friendly?
5. Lastly, I have heard the Birch creek road is tricky for some vehicles. We have a short bus we are road tripping in, is that going to be an issue getting it to the ramp?
TIA for any info, can't wait!


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## Wadeinthewater (Mar 22, 2009)

1. Would anyone have an idea what the flows will be like mid May this year?
_Probably runable depending on your low water tolerance. Friends did it at 220 cfs a few years ago, but they did nothing except row hard from 7 am to 7 pm for 3 days._

3. Is there a permit required for this stretch?
_Self-issued at the put in._

4. Is it dog friendly?
_Yes, but lots of rattlesnakes and ticks._

5. Lastly, I have heard the Birch creek road is tricky for some vehicles. We have a short bus we are road tripping in, is that going to be an issue getting it to the ramp?
_Hmmm....not a problem getting it into Birch Creek, but it could be a problem getting out. There are a few steep gravel pitches. My 2wd van could not pull a small trailer up the hill. Luckily the Subaru with us has a hitch and pulled the trailer to the top._


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## CurrentLY (Aug 24, 2016)

2. Does anyone know of a company that runs shuttle for the Rome-Birch stretch?

Call Robin/Owyhee River Shuttles at (541) 586-2352. I just talked to her this morning about an upcoming Rome to Birch Creek shuttle. She's super friendly and helpful.

HTH


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

Wadeinthewater said:


> 4. Is it dog friendly?
> _Yes, but lots of rattlesnakes and ticks._


TONS of cockleburrs too. If your dog has a long coat, I would think twice about it or bring scissors and cowboy magic. And skip the morning walk upstream of Rome.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

4. Is it dog friendly? yes with tick treatment. Saw 40+ ticks get pulled off one of those white wolf dogs on this trip that ranged around the country all evening.


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## Johnny (Feb 17, 2016)

Waste dump Q:
We're heading down to do the section below Rome in a couple of weeks. Our quickest route home takes us north up towards and along I-80. By any chance is there a SCAT machine in a convenient location for us after our Owyhee trip?


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## screamingeagle (Jun 14, 2011)

Do you mean I-90? I-80 runs down the middle of the country. The only scat machines near (not really near you) are in Riggins, Idaho and Asotin, WA. I can't speak for what is in Oregon or Washington other than those machines I've listed.


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## Johnny (Feb 17, 2016)

oops... I meant up I-84 way.

Thanks for the info re Riggins and Asotin SCAT machines. Those are a hair farther east than is ideal for us but not out of the question depending how we choose to meander back up to BC.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

Well there is one at the mouth of the Deschutes River in Oregon at Heritage Landing just off I-84, but it has never been working when I have been there over about 8 trips spread over 10 years.


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## Johnny (Feb 17, 2016)

Good to know (and to know it has a poor record of working) - thanks Shap.


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## liquidlimo (Jan 27, 2017)

Looking for some info on camps. 
Plan on doing a May 24th. launch with bunch of river rats. Anyone have any recommendation on camps? Group of 10, going to do this before our Rouge trip June 1st. Happy boating!


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

About any of the camps marked on the current version of the BLM map are good.


Sucks not having whitewater campsites website to look at anymore 


Also, prepare your self for low water. Overall the Owyhee basin is just under 100% of median snow pack today. NRCS has projected 1996 as the most similar year. If things keep on the average path, you should experience flows around 1000 cfs or possibly considerably less, unless there is a rainstorm that bumps up flows or a short time, just before your trip. While that is fine with me, some folks don't like to run the lower Owyhee sub 1500 to 1000 cfs with big loaded rafts. If you are prepared for low and bony, you will be fine.


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## liquidlimo (Jan 27, 2017)

Thanks for the feedback. It's all freestyle anyway. Think we can spread the gear pile around enough to keep it floating. I'll keep an eye on the levels. Min. flow for 16ft. cat?


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

liquidlimo said:


> Thanks for the feedback. It's all freestyle anyway. Think we can spread the gear pile around enough to keep it floating. I'll keep an eye on the levels. Min. flow for 16ft. cat?


I'd rather not comment on a specific minimum, as low water boating is an animal of its own and depends to a larger degree on skill and preference. Suffice it to say, considerably lower than 1000 cfs if you like the MF Salmon off the top at 1.5 feet or less.


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## roundboater (Sep 24, 2010)

Call these guys. They are in Boise. They charge you to clean it but it's spotless when returned. You could go the RV dump station route as well but it's a messy job
ABC Sanitation


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## OregonRafter (Jan 30, 2013)

Also a scat machine in Maupin at Maupin City Park. Similarly I would call ahead to make sure it is working. Along Hwy 197 between Hwy 97 and The Dalles.


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## boicatr (Mar 14, 2013)

I agree with Shap on the flow projection. Current snowpack is almost exactly same as last year on this date, but flows are much higher as they're coming down from big rains. Once the flows drop more you should be able to use last year's hydrograph as a guide. Basin is saturated tho, so rain changes everything from here on out.


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## Johnny (Feb 17, 2016)

Thanks for the toilet clean out info Roundboater. I called the outfit in Boise whose name you gave me but they said they don't offer that service.


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## boicatr (Mar 14, 2013)

Try "A Company" instead. 208 362 3000


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## Blarneystoner (Mar 23, 2016)

Wondering if anyone following this thread has any information on the prevalence of red spider mites at Ryegrass or Greeley hot springs. I've heard conflicting reports. After a shitty experience at an idaho hot spring several years ago left me itching for weeks, I try to do my research. Hitting the Rome->Birch Creek segment in a few days. Any advice appreciated.


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## BilloutWest (Jan 25, 2013)

Blarneystoner said:


> Wondering if anyone following this thread has any information on the prevalence of red spider mites at Ryegrass or Greeley hot springs. I've heard conflicting reports. After a shitty experience at an idaho hot spring several years ago left me itching for weeks, I try to do my research. Hitting the Rome->Birch Creek segment in a few days. Any advice appreciated.


NW:
Hot Springs with Red Spider Mites Listing

For just Idaho:
Northwest Hot Springs With Red Spider Mites | Listing

Question.
Are these Red Spider Mites the same creature as a chigger?

===============

I found this but I'm not sure:



> Chigger Mites
> Chiggers also tend to congregate in groups, easily seen as they cross a concrete sidewalk or driveway, which they are likely to do several times a year. These red spider mites are slightly larger than clover mites, topping out at about 1/20-inch long as adults. The adults feed on small insects and insect eggs, but larval chiggers can bite humans. They tend to live around the base of briar patches or dense shrubs and climb up to a secure area of your body, typically near tight-fitting clothes such as the top of your socks. They bite and release after feasting on some skin cells, leaving an annoyingly itchy bite. However, chiggers aren't known to transmit disease.


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## DoubleShadow (May 2, 2013)

Blarneystoner said:


> Wondering if anyone following this thread has any information on the prevalence of red spider mites at Ryegrass or Greeley hot springs. I've heard conflicting reports. After a shitty experience at an idaho hot spring several years ago left me itching for weeks, I try to do my research. Hitting the Rome->Birch Creek segment in a few days. Any advice appreciated.


Most of the time if you look closely into the water you can see them swimming around. My guess is that Ryegrass would be the one to look out for as Greeley can be underwater and the river current would basically clean it out on a regular basis. Neither hotsprings is really that great in my opinion. Greeley was a muddy soupy mess last time I went down. There were a couple of very large bulls that were wallowing around in it and basically ruined the whole thing, not to mention making it scary to even approach with the bulls in the area. Thought maybe they would charge me.


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## Blarneystoner (Mar 23, 2016)

Hey, thanks for the replies. BilloutWest, I've seen both those lists, but don't know how updated they are. I was hoping for direct experience. I'm no expert, but my understanding is that a red spider mite is not the same as a chigger.

DoubleShadow, thank you for that. I had heard that ryegrass was underwhelming. Bummed that Greeley will likely be too. For sure I would pass if there was evidence of a couple bulls wallowing around in it. I'd heard that the best hot spring on the lower was on the reservoir... but for various reasons we're gonna take out at Birch Creek. Hot springs or not, I'm pretty fucking stoked. Leaving in a few days, and 3100cfs right now.

OP, sorry about the thread hijack. Thanks all.

-J


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

Blarneystoner said:


> I had heard that ryegrass was underwhelming. Bummed that Greeley will likely be too. For sure I would pass if there was evidence of a couple bulls wallowing around in it. I'd heard that the best hot spring on the lower was on the reservoir


Rye grass is a pimp place for a hot shower (no soap) rigging a piece of PVC pipe with an oar tripod. 

Echo Rock hotspring along the reservoir is one of the best hot springs I have been to anywhere. It basically makes the case to do the reservoir and camp there for a night, other than if you have time to camp another night at Leslie Gulch and explore around.


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## Whitewater Worthy Equip (Dec 11, 2013)

Ic never had issues at either. There are ways to make Rygrass spectacular but you have to plan ahead. Echo is lees perfect than in years past as the mortar has developed cracks and the pool was only getting half full, but still worth a soak for sure.


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## Blarneystoner (Mar 23, 2016)

"Rye grass is a pimp place for a hot shower (no soap) rigging a piece of PVC pipe with an oar tripod."

It saddens me that "no soap" even needs to be mentioned.


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## Schutzie (Feb 5, 2013)

Johnny said:


> oops... I meant up I-84 way.
> 
> Thanks for the info re Riggins and Asotin SCAT machines. Those are a hair farther east than is ideal for us but not out of the question depending how we choose to meander back up to BC.


You might check for a porta pot company or septic pump out company. When we first started using rocket boxes for groovers the local porta pot guy would clean them for, I recall $5 no matter how many we set out. He steam cleaned them, which was nice.
They might laugh about it, but for either type of company this would be like you cleaning bird shit off of your camp chair.


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## shappattack (Jul 17, 2008)

Oh shit, full size over loaded raft flows in effect in the middle of June, headed to Belize though, damn. The high flow MF Salmon alternative has the spigot turned on.


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## Soup76 (Aug 19, 2009)

Wow!! 

Have fun in Belize.


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## GROH (Nov 10, 2013)

Just ran the Bruneau River then cruised over to the Owyhee ran it June 9-11 around 1100-1200cfs. Ran my 15' Maravia Zephyr with passenger through everything. Ledges rapid at the start was tricky but manageable. Quarter mile was badass rapid with some big must make moves, definitely should be scouted. Lots of fun class III's mixed throughout. Widow Maker was awesome got the blood pumping and made the beer taste fantastic. Don't think I'd go much lower in flows for my set up. The picture is us scouting widow Maker! Great trip!!!









WYO


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