# New Rapids on the Snake? Picking up cancellations on MF Salmon after 8/15?! For real?



## Gardenvalleykayaker (Jul 23, 2011)

Yes, for real! It is all possible if you add your voice to the comment period to remove the four lower snake River dams prior to the 2/7! Time is of the essence here, take time to comment now. The easiest way for me was via this link: 
Save Our Wild Salmon

Removal of the dams means Salmon will recover. Recovery of the salmon would delist them, which would cause the policy on the middle fork salmon to be revised, we'd be able to pick up cancellations after 8/15 again (most likely). Not only that, but there's rapids under those reservoirs!!! 
This is relevant to the local whitewater community. If you need further convincing. Watch this: Salmon: Running the Gauntlet | Full Episode | Nature | PBS

This was produced by a local Boise rafter/kayaker and GC guide. It tells the tale of Idaho salmon better than any. Well worth 50 minutes of your time on this rainy day. 

Spread the word!!




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## mattman (Jan 30, 2015)

Thanks for putting the word out! Comment posted, friends emailed, next will be making sure river conservation groups I support know about comment period, so they can pass it on to other members!! This is great news, let's seize the day.


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## Gardenvalleykayaker (Jul 23, 2011)

Thanks Mattman! The American Whitewater site has a really good write up on it too. This is definitely the closest we've ever been to removal. So you are exactly right, seize the day! I guess there's a 140 mile multi-day under those reservoirs!! Whoot Whoot!

Here's a link to the AW page.

https://www.americanwhitewater.org/content/Article/view/articleid/32688/

Their comment link is actually better for boaters as it gives our perspective. Unless of course you have time to write your own.

Take care!


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## dirtbagkayaker (Oct 29, 2008)

There is no way that AWW really believes that there is 140 miles of white water under the 40 feet of mud behind each dam. I fish those dams way too much to know that the up river wind with the lack of any real current would be miserable at best. The river would drop about 2.5 feet per mile. 

Right now the salmon hatcheries put soooo many smolt in the water that salmon have now outnumbered steelhead. The clearwater Killer B Steelhead run is all but gone. 

At the end of the day the restriction on the MFS will never change. It's also kind of funny that we would do everything possible, like remove dams, but then open the MFS? Those two just seem to leave a sour taste in my mouth for recovery. Im sure there are those that say science says float when we want to float and tear down what we want to destroy.

I signed this a long time ago, but we all know that when the dams are removed, it will be packaged with a deal to pipe line the water to California and the salmon/steelhead will die all because we a love them strawberries and MFS trips.


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## mattman (Jan 30, 2015)

Regardless of personal opinions on white water under dams, and the like, when is it ever good to have this concrete crap in our rivers fucking up the natural order of things?


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## Gardenvalleykayaker (Jul 23, 2011)

Let the river flow is my motto !


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## dirtbagkayaker (Oct 29, 2008)

mattman said:


> Regardless of personal opinions on white water under dams, and the like, when is it ever good to have this concrete crap in our rivers fucking up the natural order of things?



It's not a "personal opinion" Lewis and clark described the water in detail and made it to the columbia in hollowed out logs. There is no whitewater between lewiston and the tri cities. There is like one class 3 and one class 2 between the mouth of the salmon to the mouth of the snake. It drops 2.5 feet per mile below lewiston! 

Now dworshak at orofino would be a milestone. My head would freeking explode. But the lower snake dams need to go first before the political machine would consider that one. But it would probably take 50 years for the river to stabilize.


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## jbomb (Apr 10, 2015)

> It's also kind of funny that we would do everything possible, like remove dams, but then open the MFS?


Are you really trying to compare the impact of boaters on fish with the impact of 4 dams?


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## dirtbagkayaker (Oct 29, 2008)

jbomb said:


> Are you really trying to compare the impact of boaters on fish with the impact of 4 dams?


Obviously dams have a bigger impact. But to me it does not nullify the impact of boaters on fish. 

I'm not comparing them, I'm pairing them! I think both need to happen to make the "best" effort for salmon recovery. Even small things can have a big impact. It makes no sense to go through all the massive amount of work of removing dams and then opening cancelled waterways over reds. There are many things that need to happen. All are important. Some we can do some now and some we can't. I would advocate for reduced private permits on the MFS too. I'm more into habitat for fish, deer, elk, and such than access for people. I will error in favor of wildlife, especially in the Frank Church. I just feel that removing dams in the name of fish habitat and then going after cancelled permits that are not reissued to protect salmon reds is suspect at best. Just my opinion and you can own yours. I get why you have yours.


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