# Casper creeking



## Roy (Oct 30, 2003)

So, that gage is showing 100 cfs and climbing. What's a reasonable minimum for Boxelder?

Also, is there anything else flowing around Casper?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

Two days ago


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## ACC (Oct 30, 2003)

two days ago it was 30 cfs and rising. I am doubtful that anything will really be running well this weekend with the cold snap tomorrow night through thurs morning. 

CM, are you saying that there is 200 cfs in Box Elder even though the gauge says 100?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

Basic hydrology is not brain surgery. Like I said the gauge station is located up stream well above the actual canyon. Look at the north platte gauges. Also the cold snap isn't so much a snap as a chill. I've kayaked boxelder in the snow. The ground will need to cool off before the snow stops melting. It's gonna be in


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## Nathan (Aug 7, 2004)

I did a little rocket surgery for the area.

North Platte in Casper - 912 cfs (NOAA)
North Platte at Glenrock above Boxelder - 1340 cfs (NOAA)
North Platte at Orin - 1630 (NOAA) or 1540 (USGS and WY SEO)
Boxelder - 114 (USGS and WY SEO)
LaPrelle below reservoir - 107 (WY SEO)
LaBonte Creek is an unknown inflow between Glenrock and Orin but it would be safe to say that 100 on the Boxelder gauge does not equal 200 in the canyon. 

That said I've run it at 92 on the gauge in a snowstorm and would do it again.

Roy I would say a reasonable minimum for most people would be 125.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

You missed the two diversions at the end of the canyon Nathan.. You act like the farmers and ranchers don't take any water in spring of all times. Like I said its not brain surgery it is running anyways better if some of you negative nancy don't show up. Optimistic people only. Like I said trying to go through the canyon not walk around it.
http://binged.it/ZTVmnL

Going off a gauge that neglects how much snow is in the hi plain above the canyon is pretty poor for judging flow in the canyon. Particularly cause the gauge is located closer to the source than the actual canyon..


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## Roy (Oct 30, 2003)

Nathan said:


> That said I've run it at 92 on the gauge in a snowstorm and would do it again.
> 
> Roy I would say a reasonable minimum for most people would be 125.


Thanks Nathan, that's what I was looking for. I'm not against a little mank boating, but it's 25 F in Casper right now and flows dropping. We'll see how things shape up over the next couple days.


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## whitewater_fishin (Mar 28, 2012)

caspermike said:


> Going off a gauge that neglects how much snow is in the hi plain above the canyon is pretty poor for judging flow in the canyon. Particularly cause the gauge is located closer to the source than the actual canyon..


Yeah, what do you know Nathan? It's not like you're some sort of water resources engineer! 

Oh wait...


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

What do I know I only lived there for my entire childhood...and opened up the creek def don't know a thing about it.... Yeahhh


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## ACC (Oct 30, 2003)

I know I ain't drivin' no 4 hours for no 60 cfs!


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

Good! Honestly I am not butt hurt if you don't come creeking 
This is 83 cfs on the gauge. Def not 83 cfs.. 
https://vimeo.com/22633644

I'm stoked the snow couldn't have come at a better time all the snow will be flowing into the creeks by this weekend it is Wednesday Jesus. You all act like it doesn't snow in the spring..
You all jealous casper is better choice than escalate or what?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

USGS Current Conditions for USGS 06647500 BOX ELDER CREEK AT BOXELDER, WY looks like its locked up alright.... Not


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## glenn (May 13, 2009)

I think it will be running. Just a matter of how much a gamble the drive is and what your mank tolerance is. What else is running at the moment that looks like a better option for the weekend?


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## RiverWrangler (Oct 14, 2003)

Casper, Jesus man. I love you bro but you're just arguing for sport right now? This is not the first time. Anyway though, I agree these fools just don't know what's up. I'm going to predict that it will be running this weekend and can attest to the fact that at certain times there is a good deal more water in the canyon then what the gauge is reading. The canyon is the last gradient before the plains but the creek travels a pretty long way collecting tribs along it's whole length. Above the canyon there's a surprisingly wide valley (I know cause I drove the entire length of creek just about, searching for the put-in, not believing that it was back down at the bottom - whoops)

I ran it about this time a few years ago when it was peaking. It was bankful, bare minimum 500cfs in the creek, my honest estimation was more like 7-800cfs. The gauge only got to 400 on a pretty big upswing on the graph. Call bullshit or whatever but I work for AW essentially estimating flows. I'm not gonna get it within 50-100cfs sometimes but I've tested it and can tell visually the range of cfs most creeks are in pretty accurately and the Boxelder was flowing strong that day! Let's just say strong enough that it felt like a good warm-up for a trip to BC a week or two later.

All that said, if it doesn't hit around 200 on the gauge I'll be contemplating other options... but from what I've heard it's still pretty good even at relatively low flows down to somewhere around 125 on the gauge.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

It's worth it if you ask most people. deer creek will be running too.. Aswell as some other creeks.. And the whitewater park...boxelder is back up to 100cfs already on the cold day. If you want to meet up give me a ring if not to bad.


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## RiverWrangler (Oct 14, 2003)

If I don't go it will because I can't get a fun ticket from the wife to go that far and something closer is running. If it get's juicy I'll beg. I think it's that cool of a run. But if it's low it just ain't worth pressing the issue.


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## Flying_Spaghetti_Monster (Jun 3, 2010)

You got a decent run description of box elder mike?


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## GAtoCSU (Apr 18, 2005)

When did you CO boys start tolerating Casper on the Buzz? Man how times have changed. :/

lol


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## craven_morhead (Feb 20, 2007)

So? How was the boxelder this weekend?


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## Nathan (Aug 7, 2004)

Great.


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## ~Bank (Jul 31, 2010)

It was questionably low considering the long drive. Everything was runnable. More water would be better...


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## leif (Jul 11, 2009)

Yeah, low but a ton of fun. And the hike gets easier every year.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

Obviously more water would be better.... It was min low but tons of fun. No pain no peaches we paddled to the interstate the hike out was easy


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## Nathan (Aug 7, 2004)

The hike out was easy at the interstate, but how was the hike in? We were wondering who stashed the boat when we were hiking out Saturday.

I looked at what the gauge was showing two years ago when we spent a couple weekends up there. The three days were 100, 92 and 66 cfs. Saturday the gauge was 70s and Sunday it was 80s and there was more water than the day with 100 a couple years ago. The fresh snow I'm sure helped, but I left feeling the gauge really doesn't give much indication of what the run will be like other than once it starts to come up it's probably in.

Considering the drive from Fort Collins is shorter than the drive to Gore it's worth it. From Denver it's about the same for Boxelder or Escalante. Boxelder makes you earn it.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

It was more of a hike over. we paddled the upper stretch Friday got a super late start and had to get back to casper so spent some time with the family and than came back on Sunday finished hiking boats out and than back in. It was Good! Overall it was something like 2.5 hours of hiking. It's hard to say how much is up there I agree Nathan the gauge is far to close to the source and with the melt water coming in right now I feel like there is curve relative to the snow pack. It was a fun time. Box elder is great box training one trip will get you in shape.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

Some vid of the lower canyon in here...
https://vimeo.com/65776793
Push play.. And make sure to paddle to the platte..


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## foreverhard (Apr 14, 2009)

*more beta please?*

Firstly, thanks, caspermike, for tipping us off that boxelder was running. I feel richer for having experienced that beautiful canyon.

However, I also feel like a fool by comparison. We paddled only about half of the canyon and then hiked out at about the deepest part. That sucked. You paddled the whole canyon and hiked flat(ish?) terrain to a road. WTF?

We scouted the exit to the canyon and couldn't find a view without a "no tresspassing" sign. You mentioned paddling to the Platte, which is even farther than the interstate, and which is a ways from the exit of the canyon. Is this a secret, or would you mind giving us the skinny on your takeout? Are there fence portages and trespassing issues? Does a crew have to paddle with you to finish the canyon? I'd like to paddle that again, but not if I have to hike out half way again.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

You pretty much have to do a little portage up and over anyways you guys took the easier way brother. No easy way to do it the lower is a good hike back in and than down the river through private property.. We had a slight confrontation at the land at the interstate so if You continue down stream to a bridge with possible easement like the state highway bridge or possibly even further to the platte. The land owners were pretty ignorant to the boating access laws in wyo and had a problem with us floating through the bixby ranch land but we have that sorted out for the most part. They thought that water rights ment they owned the creek, which in wyoming is false. They can own the land under the creek but we have the legal right to float and portage fences if you can't get under them. I made the mistake of thinking the interstate was federal land instead it was still private the manager lady was pissed. So we had a nice highway patrol show up give us warning and told her to beat it and get the water rights law straight. Which was nice he also drove back up to the property to give them a chat. He also seen the past box elder videos and is down to brown. Remember to stay in the creek and be quite and respectful and know the laws! And maybe get a land ownership map.. Anybody can do it.. Just have to put the extra effort in. Guess we didn't put enough in but as long as we paddle to a legit take out its not a problem...

Also it's possible to run the canyon in its entirety but that's a big BUT. Take a hike in and look around in the middle gorge bs falls has some slight consequences but it has been run with bad and better results..


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## freexbiker (Jul 18, 2005)

Papa CM you in wyo still?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

Nah next Friday I should be back might try to get up in big timber this weekend with week of 70s... Sorry hombre flows are getting nice down there though. 

What you have in mind maybe I can rally some boys to head back again this weekend..


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## glenn (May 13, 2009)

Sweet vid mike. Still amped on that lower canyon.


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## Schizzle (Mar 26, 2004)

I've run the upper canyon. What is the access point to run the lower canyon? I understand the takeout from previous comments. I can't remember the name of the last rapid in the upper canyon, but when you hike out river left from there, is there any way to shorten the hike into the lower canyon? Seems like there were some rock strata bands up 500 feet or so that you might be able to contour? Is that how you guys have done it in the past?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

I will draw a map. Hike from below hairy beaver over the saddle than over the next saddle than down the sage scree field to the first side canyon thing. If you drop to early you will probably get cliffed out before you reach the creek. Take the first big crack it starts in the west and runs east so don't mistake it for one with a bunch of trees. Than keep on trucking down the ravine thing till you see water. Look at the first rapid expect a interesting possible portage if you don't like sieves we needed more water for this drop. Than you are good after the clean 10 footer, theres a another rapid in the gorge we didnt have quite enough water so be ready for another portage. And you come straight to gspot... Have fun ill draw up the portage we did..
Also more water it would be possible maybe to run the drop below bs falls and come out through the granite walls taking away about 60 percent of the portage, pretty sure it's a sieve though..


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

i made it so you can see the look out.. honestly if you had time to make it a overnight trip and just put your camping gear where you hike back in you could potentially have a killer trip. just double check your balls for ticks


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## Schizzle (Mar 26, 2004)

Okay, those directions and that map make sense. Bummer you have to go clear to the top. Does it take you guys a full day to do the lower? Probably kind of ambitious to think we could do both in a day.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

Both are possible in a day got start early and expect to paddle all day..


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## KSC (Oct 22, 2003)

Is there a good way to measure how much snowpack is left in that drainage? I assume flows ought to bump up this weekend as the weather warms?


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## glenn (May 13, 2009)

Mike likes to use the Reno Hill snotel but I think the Laprele snotel may also be applicable. Of course neither will tell the whole story and as we found out this weekend the gauge is even less reliable than we thought.


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## Nathan (Aug 7, 2004)

Sunday we did the upper in about 1.5 hours. We only stopped to set safety at Loaf and portage a log above Hairy Beaver. That's a big hike to get around the middle gorge. Probably wouldn't be too bad to do in one day.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

The reason the gauge isn't as reliable is because there is snow pack coming in after the gauge. So depending on how much snow pack is left below the gauge there is a direct correlation to the water in the canyon. More snow equals more water less snow equals less water. As the season goes on the snow melts so the correlation diminishes. It could be 80 on the gauge have a 160 at the beginning of the season but the end of the season that correlation is pretty much none existant and 80 cfs on the gauge will be 80 cfs in the creek. Reno hill is less than a mile from most of the boxelder creek source.. Check it out laprele works to but isn't as close to the same elevation as the boxelder source. That's the reason I use Reno hill.
http://www.wcc.nrcs.usda.gov/cgibin/wygraph-swe-only.pl?stationidname=06G02S-RENO+HILL&state=WY


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## Roy (Oct 30, 2003)

Big ol' 50cfs bump on that gage last night. Straight up vertical. Is there a dam upstream of it, or is this a gage correction?

http://waterdata.usgs.gov/nwis/uv/?site_no=06647500

Also, anybody with local knowledge gonna be up that way Saturday or interested in going?


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

Looks like wood if you know what I mean... Hard saying. Luke sutton is wanting some


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## Nathan (Aug 7, 2004)

Seems odd that a correction would occur at 11:00pm, but if it was a correction it would make the flows from last weekend fit with the flows I ran it at two years ago better.


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## caspermike (Mar 9, 2007)

I was thinking the same thing Nathan.


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