# Deso - SE Utah Board of Health restrictions



## 2tomcat2

The Public Health Order has been updated as of April 1

Only primary residents and essential visitors of Emery, Carbon and Grand counties are allowed to overnight, whether lodging, or camping on public
lands

No end date available

Page 3 of order, Section 3


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## 2tomcat2

https://www.seuhealth.com/covid-19


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## caverdan

I received this E mail yesterday.



Dear Permittee, 
You’re receiving this email because you have reserved a Desolation Gray-Green River Permit in the near future. We wanted to make you aware of the South Eastern Utah Health District Order that may impact your trip. Please see the Public Health Order (dated 3/31/20) and visit the South Eastern Utah Health Department (SEUHD) website for any other local updates and information concerning COVID-19. 
At this time, the BLM has not closed the Desolation Gray-Green River or cancelled any permits, however as the situation changes we will re-evaluate. The SEUHD order limits all overnight and short-term lodging facilities, including camping on public lands within Carbon, Emery, and Grand Counties to local residents. The order also states that no camp shall be located within 50 yards of another camp and no camp shall consist of more than 10 people. However, in light of the recent SEUHD order, if you wish to cancel your permit for a refund please do so though Recreation.gov, and call our office at 435-636-3631 to initiate the refund request. Permit staff will be available Monday-Friday from 8:00-4:30 if you choose to cancel your permit and request a refund.


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## 2tomcat2

Thanks, caverdan


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## 50119

If I read it correct, public lands (Federal?) are closed to other "taxpayers" that are not from those counties? It should be open for all or closed for all and not discriminate. How would out of state recreationalists/rafters feel if they were locked out of the public lands, the Salmon Rivers, Selway, etc. in Idaho?

In addition if you are from out of state you have to fill out a form before entering Utah. I wonder what happens if the form raises an alarm? I understand the fears of spread in Utah, but some of these actions are a bit harsh. 

_*Motorists entering near state borders will receive an alert that will direct them to fill out a health declaration, or form.
Following a recent executive order from Utah Gov. Gary Herbert, Utah will, for the first time, deploy a targeted wireless emergency alert (WEA) on certain highways that cross state borders into Utah. The alert will direct motorists to fill out a brief declaration, or survey, that is available at entry.utah.gov.

These are extraordinary times, and Utah is taking extraordinary measures like using this technology (which we have never used in an instance like this before). There may be some kinks here and there, but it’s absolutely essential to help us stop the spread of the coronavirus, COVID-19.
*_

Sorry trooper, I lost my phone and my radio isn't working [pulled fuse].


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## griz

Utah government: Here’s a text message to read and form to fill out while driving.

Brilliant.


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## raymo

So does all this conflicting information mean you can go or no go? Wish they would just say come on down and enjoy yourself or stay away till we figure this mess(situation) out.


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## caverdan

Raymo,
My deciding factor for my May trip will be if River Runners is allowed to shuttle our vehicles. I'll have to check with the BLM office to make sure camping is still allowed along the river corridor. The way it looks to me right now is the only ones allowed to camp on river right are locals. The county dividing lines are the middle of the river. I'm guessing the put in is in Uintah county and you can drive into it by going through Dinosaur Colorado. If the May trip doesn't happen, one of our crew has a June launch date I will try to make. Only time will tell. Unfortunately, Utah is it's own country and not a good place to debate the grey areas of their laws.


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## raymo

caverdan, I sure hope you and your crew get to launch along with others holding permits at some time, the sooner the better. May the river gods be with all. River running is a symbol of life to us.


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## 2tomcat2

What? Y'all want clear information? Only thing I know is "wash your hands, wash your hands, wash your hands"

Caverdan, as raymo states, I sincerely hope your trip is a go. We have a
June 12 launch and are also asking the river gods, Mother Nature and any entity that has to do with river life to be with everyone, on a river or not


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## Andy Hoffmann

Hey folks, I called the BLM yesterday (Friday 04/10) about a solo trip I'm planning to launch on the 17th. They're not checking IDs at the put-in, but I was warned that I could get a pricey ticket at the takeout for camping in Emery county. I'm having trouble finding a shuttle--Melanie at RRT can't give a yes unless things change on April 15, the day the current health regulations expire. My guess is the counties will continue with restrictions at least till the middle of May. I'm in Salt Lake, will only need to stop for gas, contact with no other person but the ranger, who will most definitely ask me to scram while checking my gear. While Deso is still open, from watching the board it appears that the BLM is not releasing cancelations even as they're allowing folks with permits to put on. The BLM guy I talked to did say there's been discussions about shutting down the stretch completely. If they don't close the river to boaters, they're considering dropping group size from 25 and under to 10 and under. My guess is June trips should be fine. We'll know more on the April 15th when new guidelines are released.


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## 2tomcat2

Thank you for calling. I did notice a few dates in early April coming and going this past week, don't know if they were snapped up or canceled by BLM? Will see what April 15 brings, or does not


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## Andy Hoffmann

I'd certainly like to hear experiences from those who've taken off from Deso in the last week.


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## villagelightsmith

Better check in with the Sheriff first, Stranger. And remember; don't be caught in town after sundown.


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## caverdan

https://www.ksl.com/article/4674114...9-state-officials-cancel-mobile-travel-alerts


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## raymo

*"wash your hands"*



2tomcat2 said:


> What? Y'all want clear information? Only thing I know is "wash your hands, wash your hands, wash your hands"
> 
> Caverdan, as raymo states, I sincerely hope your trip is a go. We have a
> June 12 launch and are also asking the river gods, Mother Nature and any entity that has to do with river life to be with everyone, on a river or not


I guess washing your hand's, helps to stop the virus from spreading to our selves and others. Eventually entering our body's through our mouths, if that's the case my mom's technique of washing our mouth's out with soap when we were kid's if we spoke a bad word should work on this virus too, right? I eventually got use to the taste of Ivory Soap after a while.


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## DidNotWinLottery

As we head towards permanent, financial doom politicians in a few places are talking about re-opening some. But at the same time they are passing martial law.....I would stay home.


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## 2tomcat2

Regarding Utah travel, this was updated yesterday at 4:10pmksl.com)

"Mobile travel alerts were instituted last week in an effort to track who was entering the state of Utah so health officials could coordinate in case those people needed treatment or assistance.

The alerts were intended to be pushed to mobile devices for people who were driving into the state in certain highway areas just inside the border.

However, the system didn't work as officials hoped, according to Utah Department of Emergency Management spokesman Joe Dougherty. The alerts were pushed to some people who were in their homes, sometimes far away from the border, he said.

As of 12:17 p.m. Monday, the alerts have been canceled, and the state does not anticipate using such a system for pandemic-related purposes, he said.

"It was a really bold experiment," Dougherty said, noting that Utah was the first state in the nation to attempt any sort of mobile notification system for travel orders.

Some people received the alert at their homes in St. George, the Uinta Basin and Oneida County, Idaho, according to Dougherty. People were receiving the alerts 15-20 times, with some people reporting they received it 30 times, he said.

The department of emergency management narrowed the areas where alerts were being pushed, and the system showed signs of improvement Monday, but officials ultimately decided to cancel the alerts, Dougherty said.

Moving forward, people will still be asked to voluntarily fill out the declaration at entry.utah.gov, but will be notified using electronic Utah Department of Transportation signs along highways, instead of mobile alerts, Dougherty said.

Several thousand people completed the travel declaration as a result of the alerts, which helped the health department gather some important data, Dougherty said.

Though the mobile alert technology won't be used again for coronavirus purposes, the technology is available to the state and may be used in other future scenarios, he said.


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## Andy H.

DidNotWinLottery said:


> But at the same time they are passing martial law.....I would stay home.


Where's this actually happening? Got a reputable source? I've been hearing that story for a month and it's all been wingnut conspiracy theory. If you've got a reputable source, please provide a link.


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## shoptech1

Again, can someone please respond if you've been down Deso/Gray in recent weeks!? would love to know the vibe/situation of trips?! i have a launch for 5/5 and intend to use it. Assuming BLM keeps it "open"- plan on keeping group small- what were your protocols if recently run??
thanks Steve


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## mdt67

FYI my May 5th Ladore trip just got cancelled so not sure why Deso is still a go? anyway they are giving me the same date next year so just gonna roll with it.


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## DidNotWinLottery

Better then a kick in the teeth. So no permits and lotteries next year as all this years get used next year. Basically a lost season. And frankly I have a GC launch next year, so I may lose my Salmon chance as that is too much for one year for us.


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## Andy Hoffmann

*May 5th, canceled trip*

That's interesting that Lodore would shut down. I wonder if it has to do with crossing state lines.


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## Andy Hoffmann

I'm on a Grand trip that's supposed to launch on July 3rd. My guess, that trip will be cancelled. I've heard rumors, and only rumens, that the Park Service will offer dates that usually go out in the follow up lotteries.


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## caverdan

Andy Hoffmann said:


> That's interesting that Lodore would shut down. I wonder if it has to do with crossing state lines.


Ladore is in a national park. Deso is BLM.


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## mdt67

That makes sense since Dino is a park but then why is Westwater closed down? Anyway will see what May brings there.


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## Electric-Mayhem

Andy Hoffmann said:


> I'm on a Grand trip that's supposed to launch on July 3rd. My guess, that trip will be cancelled. I've heard rumors, and only rumens, that the Park Service will offer dates that usually go out in the follow up lotteries.


The people who had their permits cancelled from March 24th through May 21st had a couple options. They already ran the 2021 lottery...so they couldn't just give them the slot next year so they said they could take the same date in 2022 or they can wait and see if their date for next year gets cancelled and get first dibs on that. Because most people want a while to plan, the GCNP is giving people the option to have a cut off date of their choosing for that option...at which time it will just go to the 2022 date. Not sure if they only get first dibs on the same date as their 2020 permit was for in 2021 or if they'll get preferential treatment for all of the cancellations that happen any time this year or next year. 

My permit holder for the May 3rd trip I was signed on for has opted to just take the date in 2022. I'd probably wait and see what happens with the cancellations personally...but she just wanted the certainty of having the same date in 2022 so she could worry about other stuff right now (she is a Pediatric Oncology Nurse at a Children's Hospital...so plenty to worry about).

As for all of the different levels of shutdown or not... each area is administered by a different management team... so they are making decisions on an individual basis for their area. The Moab BLM office is being much more shut down happy then the Vernal and Price Offices...probably because of higher traffic in the Moab area compared to Vernal area.

If there are people running Deso still...they are staying pretty quiet. Understandable considering the ire that I've seen brought down on people who have "dared to not stay home".

I know I had a couple of invites for Deso at the end of this month but the permit holders have all decided to cancel either because they wanted to adhere to stay at home orders or due to lack of interest on other peoples part for the same reason. I talked to a few people who would probably do it if more were interested...but interest in a raft trip is pretty rare, and will likely remain so while most places have a stay at home order in place. I guess we'll see what happens as the orders are relaxed and people get back to a more normal life.


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## caverdan

mdt67 said:


> That makes sense since Dino is a park but then why is Westwater closed down? Anyway will see what May brings there.


E/M touches on it in his post. The Utah governor is letting each county decide what form of shut down they want to take. 

I have a future Deso trip in May that our crew is going to wait and see what the next week or two has in store. I'm still hoping we can go. :-D


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## BLM_Moab

mdt67 said:


> That makes sense since Dino is a park but then why is Westwater closed down? Anyway will see what May brings there.


BLM-managed campgrounds within the Moab Field Office will not accept any new arrivals. This campground closure is *consistent with the Southeast Utah Health Department’s public health order issued on March 16* and is subject to change as new guidance is developed. Moab Field Office-managed restrooms have been temporarily closed. The BLM is committed to the health and safety of recreational visitors and our staff. The BLM will continue to closely monitor the situation and respond as conditions change. 

*Consistent with guidance from state and local health authorities*, the BLM is canceling all private river permits and commercial launches for the Westwater Canyon Special Recreation Management Area (SRMA) within the Moab Field Office until further notice. Refunds for private permits will continue to be issued. In addition, all commercial use of Labyrinth Canyon of the Green River and the Moab Daily section of the Colorado River is suspended. The health and safety of recreational visitors and our staff is our number one priority. The BLM will continue to closely monitor the situation and respond as conditions change.


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## 2tomcat2

The 1 notification for Deso permits on Rec.gov has vanished...


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## kwagunt2001

*Notification is still there*

10 minutes after your post it's still there. You must have missed something?
Thanks for checking on this and keeping up the posts about Deso.
I have a launch early June so following for sure.
Also a May Chama. We'll see.


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## 2tomcat2

Well, that is strange. I refreshed the page and still did not see it, oh well it's back, thanks for double checking me
Yep, kinda the catch phrase for everything, "We'll see...."


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## blueotter

So I'm curious why Westwater is closed, but Ruby Horsethief is not.
Would it be cuz there's more chance to F up in WW and need a rescue?


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## Electric-Mayhem

blueotter said:


> So I'm curious why Westwater is closed, but Ruby Horsethief is not.
> Would it be cuz there's more chance to F up in WW and need a rescue?


Ruby is in Colorado and Westwater is in Utah. They are managed by different offices in different states so they are under different orders. Utah, and especially the Moab area, are being much stricter about health orders and such. 

At the end of the day BLM land as a whole is managed federally...but each management area makes its own decisions... the Moab BLM office has decided to mirror the state health orders... but the Price, Vernal and McKinnis National Conservation Area that Ruby falls within (and who's offices reside in Grand Junctionm CO) have decided to remain open while urging people to take precautionary actions and take local and state level restrictions into consideration when planning trips.

IMHO, we are closer to stay at home and other health orders being relaxed then we are to them staying for longer...so closing things now is a bit of "too little too late" if they were gonna do it and its better to just stay the course they have been on. My gut feeling, which I'll admit could be wrong, is that we'll start to see a lot of restrictions loosened starting in May and that, pending what happens, most of the restrictions will be gone by June. That is the hope at least... but it will be largely down to what happens as things relax and if there is a resurgence of cases when that happens.


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## ColoradoDave

After hearing about the Phase approach presented today, at least 29 states will start loosening restrictions somewhat by or around May 1. The curve of new cases is rolling over right now, almost to date what was predicted quite a while ago ( Doom porn aside ) and will fall off as rapidly as it increased in the past weeks.

My hope is that Jaredopolis decides to let it be up to the counties to decide more after May 1 and not dictate the whole state suffer for the Front Range overpopulation / virus problem. 

Then, all that's needed is for people traveling to recreation areas to be considerate and still keep their distance and wear masks when around service people they come across along the way.

I started wearing a mask in the grocery store. Not because I am afraid of catching it, but because I didn't want anyone to be afraid of me.


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## Fishn

Any news on Deso now? Still Emory County residents only?


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## 2tomcat2

https://www.seuhealth.com/covid-19

Perhaps someone more discerning than me or the powers that be can clarify this:

May 4 - situational update, case numbers for Carbon, Emery and Grand Counties

May 1 - joint statement from Moab Regional Hospital and SEUHD

April 30 - Grand County amended Public Health Order

April 30 - Carbon & Emery counties

April 27.....


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## caverdan

Best bet would be to call River Runners in Vernal and see if they are open for business or not. I called my trip off because I couldn't get through to them on Monday. Our group has a launch date next month we are shooting for. Good luck. So much for two Deso trips for me this Spring.


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## kwagunt2001

This is the current notice on Rec.gov (5/7). The restrictions for locals only has been removed from earlier notices. I believe that the Grand County portion is on river left (but no camping there anyway) so not an issue. Please correct me if I'm wrong on this. Next step is to find out if there are any camp size restrictions. FYI- 

_ALERT: Updated Health Order 

The South Eastern Utah Health District (SEUHD) has released an ammended health order that effects the Grand County Portion of Desolation Gray - Green River Permit. Please visit and review the South Eastern Utah Health Department (SEUHD) website for any restricitions and information concerning COVID-19 regarding camping in the Grand County Portion of the Desolation Gray - Green River Permit. 

*At this time, the BLM has not closed the Desolation Gray-Green River or cancelled any permits.*_


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## T.O.Mac

can anyone tell me if the group size is still limited to 10?


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## caverdan

T.O.Mac said:


> can anyone tell me if the group size is still limited to 10?


It is limited to 10 and I doubt it will change over the next few months.


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## Shakes413

Talked with River Runners last week. They are opening soon and I have them booked for a shuttle on June 8.

And where are you guys seeing that group size is limited to 10? I clearly understand why, just trying to figure out where the info is coming from.

Thanks.


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## caverdan

I can't find the link but it is on the Utah.Gov site under the orange status for the covid 19 reopening of the state. I was supposed to launch May 9th.


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## CRP85

I have a July 3 launch so have been keeping an eye on things too. The Orange / Moderate Risk phase in Utah mentions under recreation that "Private, social interactions that occur without oversight by a formal organization are allowable in groups of 20 or fewer," so I think more than 10 is OK if we are to follow state regs. 

https://coronavirus.utah.gov/utahs-moderate-risk-phase/


I think the mention of the Grand County portion of the river refers to being able to camp on river left once past the reservation. River left is Grand County which still is under the locals only camping restrictions. Emery County on river right is following state guidelines at this point.


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## UtahBrian

> I think the mention of the Grand County portion of the river refers to being able to camp on river left once past the reservation. River left is Grand County which still is under the locals only camping restrictions.


Swasey Beach, where almost everybody takes out, is in Grand County and therefore presumably prohibited. 

Nine miles downstream, Green River State Park is a potential takeout and the park is in Emery County.

Be careful, though. There's a diversion dam between the two takeouts. It withdraws water to grow the famous Green River melons. There is a safe rafter's route through the middle of the low diversion dam, which you should probably read about before you try to use it.


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## jvwoods

I have a May 21 launch, have talked to Melanie at RRT and the shuttle is setup, they are taking huge precautions to keep everyone safe (THANK YOU), talked to BLM and they confirmed that the previous order restricting camping to locals has been lifted. It sounds to me like as long as you are not camping at Swayzee takeout then the trips should operate normally. Now I just need to figure out who is going to be able to give me a solid bug report! Looks like pretty warm and dry weather so I'm expecting near peak flows and hopefully no blood sucking demons.


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## CRP85

Thanks for the info, JVWoods. Very good news!

I don’t believe the take out was ever closed at Swaseys based on the regulations . . . Going forward might be helpful if we all only post confirmed info and not speculation.


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## MNichols

The date of the order ending is May 29th. I'll attach the actual order here,which seems clear as mud, but the gist of it is:


Non-Commercial Camping

●In Grand County, all campgrounds on public lands shall remain closed. All dispersed camping areas on public lands shall remain closed, except for Essential Workers and Primary Residents of Grand County, Utah, Spanish Valley, Utah, and Green River, Utah.
●An Essential Visitor is any individual renting, lodging, or camping for an amount of timeless than 30 days for the purposes of work within Grand County, or for an employer within Grand County, and their spouse and dependents. Primary Residents are any individuals renting lodging for periods of greater than 30 days, or who are permanent residents of Grand County.


What I'm seeing is you can indeed run the river, you just can't camp... Note at the end of the order, it gives the local police and sheriff authority to enforce, but that's pretty vauge..


This information came from here https://www.seuhealth.com/covid-19


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## RidgeLivin

MNichols said:


> What I'm seeing is you can indeed run the river, you just can't camp... Note at the end of the order, it gives the local police and sheriff authority to enforce, but that's pretty vauge..
> 
> This information came from here https://www.seuhealth.com/covid-19


You just can't camp on river left, which is Grand County. You can camp on river right, which is Emery County.


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## Junk Show Tours

Are trips limited to ten people and if so when is that restriction currently scheduled to expire?


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## caverdan

Paddle Iraq said:


> Are trips limited to ten people and if so when is that restriction currently scheduled to expire?


 They are limited to 10 at the moment. keep an eye on the Utah links in this thread and follow the updates they keep making. The best I can tell....(it's a screwy site to decipher)....it's in orange stage now and needs to go to green before the limit of 10 people is lifted. I'm hoping by June 1st they allow more people in a group. 

Remember....drama is what's driving this TV show.....  lot's of drama...


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## CRP85

caverdan said:


> They are limited to 10 at the moment. keep an eye on the Utah links in this thread and follow the updates they keep making. The best I can tell....(it's a screwy site to decipher)....it's in orange stage now and needs to go to green before the limit of 10 people is lifted. I'm hoping by June 1st they allow more people in a group.
> 
> Remember....drama is what's driving this TV show.....  lot's of drama...


The Orange restrictions excluding Grand County are groups of under 20 according to the links. 

"Private, social interactions that occur without oversight by a formal organization are allowable in groups of 20 or fewer"


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## caverdan

CRP85 said:


> The Orange restrictions excluding Grand County are groups of under 20 according to the links.
> 
> "Private, social interactions that occur without oversight by a formal organization are allowable in groups of 20 or fewer"


I hope your right and I'm wrong. I'm probably reading too much into what is being said in the statement as I see the river permit being overseen by a formal organization. That would be the BLM and the ranger at the put it. I'm going to call the BLM office on Monday and try to get word from them on how many are allowed on a trip right now. I'd hate to get to the put in next month and have too many people.  It's hard to cut our group down to 10 when 12 or 14 really want to go.


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## caverdan

Just got off the phone with the Price BLM office. There is not a restriction on the number of people on your trip. The normal 25 people per trip applies to all trips going forward. CRP85....I'm glad your right and I'm wrong. Sorry for the misinformation everyone.


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## 2tomcat2

Thank you, caverdan, for following up and getting first hand info!


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## bcpnick

jvwoods said:


> I have a May 21 launch, have talked to Melanie at RRT and the shuttle is setup, they are taking huge precautions to keep everyone safe (THANK YOU), talked to BLM and they confirmed that the previous order restricting camping to locals has been lifted. It sounds to me like as long as you are not camping at Swayzee takeout then the trips should operate normally. Now I just need to figure out who is going to be able to give me a solid bug report! Looks like pretty warm and dry weather so I'm expecting near peak flows and hopefully no blood sucking demons.


My group has been unsuccessful in reaching Melanie or anyone else at RRT. What's your trick?


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## RidgeLivin

bcpnick said:


> My group has been unsuccessful in reaching Melanie or anyone else at RRT. What's your trick?


Just got off the phone with Melanie and set up our shuttle for this weekend. They're up and running with extra precautions!


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## bcpnick

Thanks, I'll try again!


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## MNichols

bcpnick said:


> My group has been unsuccessful in reaching Melanie or anyone else at RRT. What's your trick?


Consider it an omen, and call Redtail Aviation. There was another Deso shuttle company listed on another thread here,but I can't remember the name.


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## 2tomcat2

A friend of mine sent a message via Facebook and the RRT site and called; as stated above, they are just getting up and running, reached Melanie yesterday, shuttle reserved


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## caverdan

caverdan said:


> Just got off the phone with the Price BLM office. There is not a restriction on the number of people on your trip. The normal 25 people per trip applies to all trips going forward. CRP85....I'm glad your right and I'm wrong. Sorry for the misinformation everyone.


I going to put a disclaimer on this post saying ya'll should check with them yourselves to make sure this is true. Never believe 100% in anything you read on this discussion board. :roll:


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## tjligon25

caverdan said:


> Just got off the phone with the Price BLM office. There is not a restriction on the number of people on your trip. The normal 25 people per trip applies to all trips going forward. CRP85....I'm glad your right and I'm wrong. Sorry for the misinformation everyone.



For what its worth...Our group has a May 21 launch for Deso. Called price BLM office a few minutes ago and was told "with everything about Deso, in regards to the river, everything is 100% of normal, with one exception and that is you can *not* camp at Swasey's beach. Other than that it is as it would be any normal year."

I confirmed with him that this mean permit size and everything. We only have 15 going so if it was 20 or 25 did not matter, but I figure it was a good confirm for other folks. So thats a +1 on no meaningful restrictions currently.


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## kwagunt2001

*Cancelling June 15th Deso in 3,2,1.....*

Just cancelled June 15th launch date. 

Go get it! It will be interesting to see when it shows up. (cancelled at 2:05 pm MST 5/14)

(we picked up another date that worked better for our group)

Edit: it showed up within 5 minutes at rec.gov. (2:10 pm)


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## villagelightsmith

Andy H. said:


> Where's this actually happening? Got a reputable source? I've been hearing that story for a month and it's all been wingnut conspiracy theory. If you've got a reputable source, please provide a link.


Oh, Andy, Andy! It's been a Police State for a long time ... decades already. Go back to bed. The next generation will never have a clue, but they'll have what they asked for, and will have not a clue where they got it or what they lost.


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