# Drones for scouting



## jaffy (Feb 4, 2004)

Sounds like a pain in the ass, but then I've never done anything that couldn't be scouted from shore or boat scouted. Still, though, what would you do? Try and pack it in your boat and take it out for the occasional hard to scout drop? 

I've seen them used to get some pretty good camera footage though.


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## jakebrown98 (Mar 4, 2008)

It would spell the end of the Un Un, which I think would suck. Its always good to have a frontier. Realistically, most folk pushing that edge couldn't be bothered to somehow pack an freaking helicopter and camera into their kayak. 

There was a big thread about drones on the Rogue a while back and incited a fair bit of vitriol. Much talk of scatterguns in dryboxes and year round hunting season on varmints and such...


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## FlyingDutchman (Mar 25, 2014)

Drones, probably not good for scouting purposes.
But drones are great for getting cool aerial shots of your buddies running rapids or getting a beat down in a keeper hole. We are planning to use a drone this spring with a go-pro!


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## spider (Jun 20, 2011)

I want one too. For the footage not the scouting. Expensive toy to loose in the river. Hope to see one on the lochsaa this year.


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

Beyond my own distaste for them in the backcountry....

I would think it would all depend on the video optics being used and the skill of the operator. Possible option for small parties but no likely large groups as you would be limited by portable screen/viewing size. Not sure you would save much time between setting up, deploying and reviewing footage. 

Costly to lose if poorly operated. I know several forums of recent that have posted rewards for crashed quadcopters. 

I can imagine them having their place but don't know of any rivers I have rafted that they would be beneficial enough to deploy.

Phillip


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## MonsterSlayer (Oct 15, 2012)

My son uses one for filming long board runs - kinda spendy at $4k


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## BilloutWest (Jan 25, 2013)

June 21, 2014



> The National Park Service announced Friday it is prohibiting drones -- properly called unmanned aircraft -- from all NPS-controlled lands and waters. That includes 84 million acres in every state and territory, including monuments, battlefields, historic sites, seashores, rivers and trails.
> It all comes down to noise and safety, said Director Jonathan Jarvis in a statement announcing the policy.
> "We have serious concerns about the negative impact that flying unmanned aircraft is having in parks, so we are prohibiting their use until we can determine the most appropriate policy," Jarvis said.





> A lawyer who represents drone enthusiasts called the NPS' temporary ban "overly broad" and said he expects it will be greatly narrowed when it goes through the federal rule-making process.





> And volunteers at Zion National Park in Utah witnessed a drone disturb a herd of bighorn sheep.


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## Randaddy (Jun 8, 2007)

Good. Ban that stupid crap. Can't people just have fun outside anymore?


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## lmyers (Jun 10, 2008)

I've been seeing signs banning them on the ski hills this season too, and that's cool with me. They are cool for the different perspectives achieved by professional film crews, but they are quickly becoming the new gopro where every idiot has one.


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## jmacn (Nov 20, 2010)

I could only see it practically used in that un-portageable, un-scoutable gorge were the scouting team came in over land to fly the section in question. Not all that likely to see happen, but I can imagine an application as part of the homework leading up to a run. I recently had my first encounter with one of those things while hiking in the woods. It came toward us so fast my first thought was "Fuck! Angry swarm of Bees!" It was a very impressive little toy. Annoying, yes. Intrusive, yes. Pretty fun looking to fly, yes. If it were in my backyard with an Amazon logo on it, I'd be hard pressed not to blast it out of the sky. I'd hate to see us all get used to them as a common thing buzzing all around.


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## okieboater (Oct 19, 2004)

Like most of the gadgets now available to many of us, the use of these drones makes me wonder just what is the best use of them.

Put me in the group that does not want a drone overhead every where I go, especially on river trips.

On the other hand, those drone videos of the Rogue I really enjoyed watching. Those rapids are some of my favorites and the videos of other events like the Lochsa's Annual Crash and Burn would be fun to see from a drone's perspective. Maybe a feature length video of rapids of the Grand Canyon as well. Use for scouting of scouting some rapids as well. Possible permits from the Government is one answer to their use.

I could see the use of a Drone in search and rescue video as a key tool to find people in need. Also in Police searches and stand off hostage situations.

Do I want drones buzzing around all the time? NO !!!!!

Is there some Drone use that is OK? My opinion yes, I just do not know how to keep the bad and good use properly managed.


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## garyherballeaf (Feb 2, 2014)

Zippidy_Dew_Dah said:


> With all the talk about drones being considered for commercial and recreational applications, what do buzz members think about using them to scout rapids?


Why not do the entire river? Post the low resolution version on Youtube; Offer up the high resolution version for $29.99.


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## waterismyfriend (Mar 30, 2012)

You bring your drone, I'll bring my 12 gauge. Should be fun


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## BilloutWest (Jan 25, 2013)

okieboater said:


> Like most of the gadgets now available to many of us, the use of these drones makes me wonder just what is the best use of them.
> ..........


Drone delivered Pizza?
Takes away Garbage too?

Skip all that Dutch Oven weight and time cooking.

On the flight in it catches how others are doing the class IV's.

Make 'em programmed with evasive route software to frustrate the crowd that can't afford delivered pizza.


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## jgrebe (Jan 16, 2010)

Neat. Program one with a GPS then you can stay home and still run the canyon. Can I have your permit?


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## BilloutWest (Jan 25, 2013)

jgrebe said:


> Neat. Program one with a GPS then you can stay home and still run the canyon. Can I have your permit?


You'll have to show you can run the canyon with a drone.
Then you're eligible for the permit lottery.


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## yak1 (Jan 28, 2006)

At least you'll know where to set up your blind so it will be easy to bag your limit.


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

On that last note....illegal for any migratory birds as defined by federal law. They are already prosecuting people on that issue. 

Hopefully it is also illegal for big game but haven't looked into it. 

Phillip


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## BoilermakerU (Mar 13, 2009)

I work with someone that has one. Pretty cool toy, but after watching what it takes to pack it along, un-pack it to use it, pack it back up, etc, I really don't see it being all that worth it for scouting rapids.

At least with his setup, I wouldn't be as concerned with losing it or it being damaged, as it can be programmed to fly at a certain elevation on it's own and land in a specific location (down river at your next campsite! LOL), but I just see it as being more of a hassle than it would be worth. It's not quite like a go pro that you just leave mounted and turn on and off as you go...


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## CGM (Jun 18, 2004)

What happened to the days when people just went to a river and put on it and figured it out? 
There were many 1st D's done with a fair bit of help from a rope and climbing gear.


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

spider said:


> I want one too. For the footage not the scouting. Expensive toy to loose in the river. Hope to see one on the lochsaa this year.


No way! I hope the USFS bans them on Wild and Scenic Rivers too. Even though they would be cool, I think the big picture of losing the "wild" is more significant than more boating footage.


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## tanderson (Mar 26, 2010)

I vote less gadgets. I have been on rivers where people are messing around with gadgets the whole time. Its like they can't let go and relax. Cameras and sat phones are the only things I want on my boat.


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## elkhaven (Sep 11, 2013)

lhowemt said:


> No way! I hope the USFS bans them on Wild and Scenic Rivers too. Even though they would be cool, I think the big picture of losing the "wild" is more significant than more boating footage.


And the highway is wild and scenic? I understand that people don't like them and agree that they shouldn't be everywhere but that just seems an odd stance for a roadside river, or vs Jet boats (Main, Rogue, etc.)... kind of seems like drones might be a drop in the bucket on many W&S waters. Too me it would make much more sense to determine use on a situational basis. 

With that said I do see there value, that video of the Rogue was awesome and I'd welcome a drone on my trips as long as it wasn't buzzing other groups. No reason why they can't be used with common sense and consideration for others...but as usual we're here talking about it thanks to folks that cannot be considerate to others.


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

elkhaven said:


> And the highway is wild and scenic? I understand that people don't like them and agree that they shouldn't be everywhere but that just seems an odd stance for a roadside river, or vs Jet boats (Main, Rogue, etc.)... kind of seems like drones might be a drop in the bucket on many W&S waters. Too me it would make much more sense to determine use on a situational basis.


I believe part of the purpose of the designation is to prevent further degradation of the wild and scenic nature of the Lochsa river corridor. Not that we disregard the designation because a roadway exists. Even the roadway is a scenic byway. Together they make a beautiful corridor where drones would not be a good fit IMO. Especially situationally on the Lochsa since there is currently no airborne impact at all. It wouldn't be like a slight increase in jetboats, it would be a whole new impact. I'm not going to get further into a nit picking debate on this, it is just my opinion and I simply wanted to state it, not convince others. Now if we were talking Megaloads..........


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## elkhaven (Sep 11, 2013)

lhowemt said:


> I believe part of the purpose of the designation is to prevent further degradation of the wild and scenic nature of the Lochsa river corridor. Not that we disregard the designation because a roadway exists. Even the roadway is a scenic byway. Together they make a beautiful corridor where drones would not be a good fit IMO. Especially situationally on the Lochsa since there is currently no airborne impact at all. It wouldn't be like a slight increase in jetboats, it would be a whole new impact. I'm not going to get further into a nit picking debate on this, it is just my opinion and I simply wanted to state it, not convince others. Now if we were talking Megaloads..........


Your opinion is noted. please don't get defensive that I question your logic and simply present a differing point of view (not to be confused with opinion). Currently my opinion is fairly open on the subject, I don't think I know enough, never having seen a drone in use, to really decide whether they belong or not. I will say however that it has never killed a person to view their stance from the oppositions perspective. So regardless of your opinion I don't think the NW&SRS is intended to limit aerial activity within it's jurisdiction. could it be used to limit such activity? I have no doubt! Should it? - I'm sure our opinions differ.


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## lhowemt (Apr 5, 2007)

elkhaven said:


> Your opinion is noted. please don't get defensive that I question your logic and simply present a differing point of view (not to be confused with opinion). Currently my opinion is fairly open on the subject, I don't think I know enough, never having seen a drone in use, to really decide whether they belong or not. I will say however that it has never killed a person to view their stance from the oppositions perspective. So regardless of your opinion I don't think the NW&SRS is intended to limit aerial activity within it's jurisdiction. could it be used to limit such activity? I have no doubt! Should it? - I'm sure our opinions differ.


Yeah, and my opinion could change. But it is what it is today. Thanks for educating me that I won't die from others perspectives! Whew, I am so relieved!

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## DanOrion (Jun 8, 2004)

Lets face it: Helmet cam footage is booor-ing. The only way I'm using a go-pro is if they make a drone that will follow me around to document what a badass I am whether it be kayaking, skiing or making babies. I'll post that shit up on facebook for grandma to see, make 'er proud. (love you grandma) 

This has nothing to do with scouting because we don't scout. We sack up and run that shit.


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## caverdan (Aug 27, 2004)

They work great for finding parking spaces at Walmart!!


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## Andy H. (Oct 13, 2003)

caverdan said:


> They work great for finding parking spaces at Walmart!!


There's some Class V scouting indeed!


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## Schutzie (Feb 5, 2013)

Meh.
Drones are of no use on the river. I say kill em as you find em.

but then I ran back in the day when toilet paper was considered a luxury to be packed only when we allowed the women along, you know, so they could do the cokking. And stuff.


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## BoscoBoater (Jul 11, 2006)

DanOrion said:


> Lets face it: Helmet cam footage is booor-ing. The only way I'm using a go-pro is if they make a drone that will follow me around to document what a badass I am whether it be kayaking, skiing or making babies. I'll post that shit up on facebook for grandma to see, make 'er proud. (love you grandma)
> 
> This has nothing to do with scouting because we don't scout. We sack up and run that shit.



Your dream has come true. The Hexo+ drone will follow you automatically. It is all about you with this puppy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GC04LhC4dI4


Videos taken with one of these have got to be easier to watch then those made with a head mounted GoPro.


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## restrac2000 (Mar 6, 2008)

I have seen the footage from them a ton now but experienced them in person for the first time today. Didn't realize they had such a high pitch whine when flying. Somebody was taking footage at the resort today while I was instructing students and I heard it fly by before I saw it. They guy had great control of it but what an annoying sound. 

Phillip


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## swiftwater15 (Feb 23, 2009)

Keep them the hell out of the wilderness. 


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## Ole Rivers (Jul 7, 2005)

BoscoBoater said:


> Your dream has come true. The Hexo+ drone will follow you automatically. It is all about you with this puppy!
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GC04LhC4dI4
> 
> ...



Zano, Airdog and Nixie join Hexo+ as follow me "autonomous aerial camera drones" and are all covered at the CES show going on now, kickstarter, too, to follow you, video and flying autonomously, as you boat down Gore.


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## BrianK (Feb 3, 2005)

I have little doubt that those autonomous flying drones will soon ruin every outdoor activity. But I have to admit that's pretty impressive technology.


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## Eddy Groover (Mar 25, 2005)

I would bet that John Wesley Powell would have given his right arm to have one! Sorry, couldn't help myself.


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## DesertRatonIce (Jan 1, 2015)

Grover, that is too funny. 

I am torn with this idea. I think the technology is amazing. We have to know how to use drones for all different types of activities. Amazon wants to use them for delivery purposes. I totally get that kind of an idea. I am not totally convinced that they should be used when out in the wilderness. The noise they make is super annoying. I would rather hear fingernails on a chalkboard. I go to the river for my solitude. I love hearing the organic noises and the also the sounds of my paddle in the water.
We as boaters have done fine with scouting over the last many years. I still think we will be fine in our endeavors without them for scouts. 


Woke up this morning at 10:13.


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## The Mogur (Mar 1, 2010)

Zippidy_Dew_Dah said:


> With all the talk about drones being considered for commercial and recreational applications, what do buzz members think about using them to scout rapids?


If you have room on your raft to carry a drone, you aren't carrying enough beer.


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## BoscoBoater (Jul 11, 2006)

The Mogur said:


> If you have room on your raft to carry a drone, you aren't carrying enough beer.



This is true... Every individual item on board should be evaluated on its nautical merits vs its given weight in beer...



I don't think I would find much use for drones for regular river scouting. I do think they will enhance my armchair scouting though. I always check utube for any available videos of any rivers that are new to me that I am interested in running. The current ways of mounting cameras on folks and their boats leave a lot to be desired. Their perspectives are not always the best if your just chair scouting a new section.


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## mdignan (Dec 26, 2010)

It sounds like a drone was useful for the Gradient and Water guys down in Brazil: https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=690486564405527&set=vb.440984349355751&type=2&theater

I could see how it would be useful if you are just on a scouting mission. I don't see any practicality in it's use for scouting while running the river.


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